Is ki cost on block weapon or style dependent?

[gungadin22000]

I cam't recall being told anything about this. In the Nioh games, each game had an inherent parry statistic telling you how much ki they cost when used to block but I can't seem to find any similar info in this game.

Are all weapons and styles identical in how much ki they consume while blocking? Does it matter whether your style has blue/red arrows vs your opponent?

[Lahoo Eckbert]

Wasn't it a thing in nioh ? Low stance = dodge, mid stance = parry, high stance = block
So this might also follow a similar princible.

[hwaitinghoshino]

Yes, your style matters.

-Advantage (Blue Arrow) gives more stagger/ki damage, and longer panic duration upon successful Counterspark/parry.

-Disadvantage (Red Arrow) gives less stagger/ki damage, and barely panics the enemy.

-Neutral is denoted by white up and down arrows.

-Shinobi stances are disadvantaged to all, but gives a longer panic duration similar to that of Advantage (a bit like a high risk high reward choice)

[n1lknarf]

hwaitinghoshino님이 먼저 게시:

Yes, your style matters.

-Advantage (Blue Arrow) gives more stagger/ki damage, and longer panic duration upon successful Counterspark/parry.

-Disadvantage (Red Arrow) gives less stagger/ki damage, and barely panics the enemy.

-Neutral is denoted by white up and down arrows.

-Shinobi stances are disadvantaged to all, but gives a longer panic duration similar to that of Advantage (a bit like a high risk high reward choice)

Ahhhh.

Last night I found a stat increasing counterspark damage when using shinobi styles, it made the game a lot easier suddenly.

[hwaitinghoshino]

n1lknarf님이 먼저 게시:

hwaitinghoshino님이 먼저 게시:

Yes, your style matters.

-Advantage (Blue Arrow) gives more stagger/ki damage, and longer panic duration upon successful Counterspark/parry.

-Disadvantage (Red Arrow) gives less stagger/ki damage, and barely panics the enemy.

-Neutral is denoted by white up and down arrows.

-Shinobi stances are disadvantaged to all, but gives a longer panic duration similar to that of Advantage (a bit like a high risk high reward choice)

Ahhhh.

Last night I found a stat increasing counterspark damage when using shinobi styles, it made the game a lot easier suddenly.

Worth checking this post on Shinobi style by Snipez, a veteran player.

https://www.reddit.com/r/riseoftheronin/comments/1jhnatm/shinobi_isnt_really_disadvantaged/

[gungadin22000]

Thanks for the responses, but I was really more thinking about ki cost of the PLAYER blocking. What determines how much ki the PLAYER loses upon blocking? The enemy red/blue arrow is kinda explained in-game with regards to effects on the enemy, it is not clear if it does anything defensively for the player.

[LArc7thHeaven]

i dunno but in my personal experience the one with more frame cost more ki

[the chazz]

gungadin22000님이 먼저 게시:

Thanks for the responses, but I was really more thinking about ki cost of the PLAYER blocking. What determines how much ki the PLAYER loses upon blocking? The enemy red/blue arrow is kinda explained in-game with regards to effects on the enemy, it is not clear if it does anything defensively for the player.

Yeah it's weird no one was answering the question you actually asked lol. This wouldn't be hard to test. I can do it in a while if no one else does

[the chazz]

I just tested it, your style DOES matter when blocking. If it's an effective style then your block will cost less ki, if it's ineffective it will cost more. However the difference between the two is very small. You wouldn't notice unless you had both in front of you. I've got a video and screenshots from my test and just eyeballing it I would say the difference is 10%. I mean 10% is a big deal when it comes to something like your damage but here it's negligible.

I would say this doesn't matter honestly.
btw all you have to do to test things like this is just find an enemy, make a save before fighting and test your question out and reload if you need to. I made sure the enemy was unharmed and that I was comparing ki damage from the exact same attack animation. I ran the test twice and the ki damage he inflicted from the same attack animation was consistent both times. It was the same higher value on both ineffective styles and it was the same lower value on both effective styles so I'm pretty confident.
I actually was guessing that it wouldn't have been consistent. Because for the player the exact same attack will do different damage values with a variance of like 10% for no reason. Apparently npcs don't work like that.

I did the test on the same katana. I can't be bothered to check if weapon type makes a difference

[gungadin22000]

Thanks for the in-depth investigation, Mr. Chazz. It does, however, beg the question:

Did the effective style require less ki to block because of it matching the enemy style better, or is it just that some individual styles are more or less effective on blocking? Is there a single block-tanking style for katana, for instance?

And the question regarding various weapon types and their blocking effectiveness is also open.

[the chazz]

gungadin22000님이 먼저 게시:

Did the effective style require less ki to block because of it matching the enemy style better, or is it just that some individual styles are more or less effective on blocking?

Dammit that's a really good question. Because you're right to note I was only testing the same 2 styles (1 ineffective stance, 1 effective). Guarding is a more universal action so maybe it's a static number? Though there is a unique guard stance for each style...

It would be simple enough to test. Do what I did, then do a third test with 2 new styles and see if they continue to match. If they do, you should now have 3 pictures with the same damage value for ineffective and 3 pics with the same damage value for effective.

I changed my mind about the difference being small. If you're interested in this because you're wanting to make a guard build, I would say that maybe that 10% style difference would be more pronounced if you're guarding a string of attacks. Instead of a single instance of taking 90% ki damage instead of 100% which is barely noticeable, if you took a string of 10 attacks then it starts adding up. Especially if you've geared for it with the affix "Ki Consumption (Guarding). This affix only rolls on your primary weapon and accessories. The highest value I know of for the weapon is 5.3% and 1.3% per accessory, meaning in total you could have 10.5% from gear alone. Coupled with an effective stance (which I eyeballed at being another 10%) and adding another -10% from the Mighty Warrior set bonus? You'd definitely notice a difference then. More so if indeed certain weapons are better at blocking than others.

[hwaitinghoshino]

Hey OP, this guide by LastToLoad about Countersparking likely helps with your blocking question, amongst others.

On top of your style, heavy weapons like Odachi, Greatsword and Polearm will allow you to lose less ki upon blocking, compared to Medium weapons like Katana, Spear and Bayonet.

https://www.youtube.com/watch?v=Q8uesbTHljw