forced to switch sides between two factions repeatedly

[Zundamon at Arms]

In the main storyline, the player is forced to switch sides between two factions repeatedly. You should know that such two-faced behavior was absolutely unforgivable in ancient Japan. Remember, in the first chapter, the protagonist was pursued merely for leaving their post without permission after their village was destroyed.

[boring2004]

To me the story really starts to fall apart in Kyoto. The illusion of choice is worse than not having a choice in my opinion. If the game just said, "You're Ryoma's sidekick and will do whatever he wants", I'd be ok. But asking "Are you sure you want to pick this side? Are you really sure you want to pick this side?" "Too bad, you're just doing what Ryoma wants" is jarring.

If everyone is important, than no one is important.

In the early game, jumping from side to side is ok. The stakes are - relatively - low. You're introduced to the anti-shogunate in Yokohama and the pro-shogunate in Edo, so I assumed when you made the choice in Kyoto you'd be "locked into that side", but not really...

The stakes are high. You're in a literal war. Going the pro-shogun route, you get to join the Shinsengumi, fight in the Ikedaya and Kinmon incidents, and then immediate have to start killing your allies because... you won the battle too well? The Honno-ji mission was just... why? I have to start killing Shinsengumi members and get in a fight with my boy Soji, because Ryoma wants to save this guy with a shamisen who's name I don't even remember.

[lmaogg]

was thinking if I should get this game. But sounds like Way of the Samurai is still a better game. At least you get to stick to your preferred path till the end

[Mista Ree]

Publicado originalmente por lmaogg:

was thinking if I should get this game. But sounds like Way of the Samurai is still a better game. At least you get to stick to your preferred path till the end

The game is definitely similar to the Way of The Samurai series in a number of aspects and in some regards feels like a Way Of The Samurai 5 but not in terms of your control over the story.

To be fair though the reason why the WOTS games are able to offer so much variety or different paths in terms of story is because you can complete a WOTS playthrough in like an hour or two and as a result it's able to have a larger variety of outcomes than larger games like Mass Effect, The Witcher, and so on.

[Shivers]

Publicado originalmente por gungadin22000:

As has been pointed out, the story is actually pretty great, considering it tries to tell of the highly interesting political and social developments in Japan that led to the Meiji restoration, same as Nioh telling you the stories of Nobunaga and Hideyoshi in the Sengoku period.

RoTR just adds ninjas where Nioh adds demons.

Being historically based, you cannot give the player character too much free agency, as killing Commodore Perry at the start of the game woulda resulted in significantly altering history. This is a storytelling method and is perfectly fine.

However, like in Nioh, Team Ninja is not especially good at storytelling in general, and the translation is also pretty messy a lot of the time, making it hard to follow. I wonder if it's a translation or a cultural issue, though.

There are plenty of alternative history based games and other media, this is just not being good at writing anything original. History being significantly altered is a good thing in games, we tell these stories to see what could have been, were things different, telling the same tale over and over again is stagnant writing, a tired trope. It's one thing to make a game showing the history of a nation, but if you add things that were not there, veiled edges, anime style ninjas, cyborgs, you should have the bravery to deviate from the script, since at that point you already have. We should have the choice to not fight for our enemy, Shinobido: Way of the Ninja accomplished this same task without actually forcing you to fight against your faction of choice, nor forced you to side with any, we should have the freedom to be a free agent and just join our blade twin at the very least.

[VeraelHasta]

From the start I assumed it is not a free choice game.
You are not an empty character with no agenda.
You are the veiled edge with a clear goal and no allegiance (anymore).
So the game doesn't give you choices in the matter - if something is getting you closer to your goal, your character is going to do it. The choices come only when there are similar ways of achieving your character goal.

I also like the theme of helping Ryoma figure out what to do. Like you, he is kinda lost - but in his case it comes from not being able to figure out which way of going forward is the best for japan. So it is okay for him to jump from side to side when one side does something he doesn't agree with.

I didn't finish the game yet. And of course the storytelling could be way better. It is average in my opinion. But it works for what it is. And it is definitely better than storytelling in their previous games.

I think our minds sometimes are too clouded by the constant marketing of games "Your choices matter! You have free will to do what you want!" and we expect every game to work like Mass Effect. In my opinion, a good RPG doesn't have to have huge life altering choices. In most of them the choices come down to a slideshow in the ending anyway, they don't really alter gameplay.

[D. Flame]

Publicado originalmente por VeraelHasta:

From the start I assumed it is not a free choice game.
You are not an empty character with no agenda.
You are the veiled edge with a clear goal and no allegiance (anymore).
So the game doesn't give you choices in the matter - if something is getting you closer to your goal, your character is going to do it. The choices come only when there are similar ways of achieving your character goal.

I also like the theme of helping Ryoma figure out what to do. Like you, he is kinda lost - but in his case it comes from not being able to figure out which way of going forward is the best for japan. So it is okay for him to jump from side to side when one side does something he doesn't agree with.

I didn't finish the game yet. And of course the storytelling could be way better. It is average in my opinion. But it works for what it is. And it is definitely better than storytelling in their previous games.

I think our minds sometimes are too clouded by the constant marketing of games "Your choices matter! You have free will to do what you want!" and we expect every game to work like Mass Effect. In my opinion, a good RPG doesn't have to have huge life altering choices. In most of them the choices come down to a slideshow in the ending anyway, they don't really alter gameplay.

Nioh 1, Ninja Gaiden 1 and 2, DOA 4 and older, even DOAX had better story telling.

[boring2004]

Honestly it doesn't need to be Mass Effect or Baldur's Gate. You don't even need to change any historical outcomes; in Chapter 3 just let Anti-Shogunate be on the backfoot before winning while Pro-Shogunate starts out strong and goes out in a blaze of glory at the end.

In Chapter 3, I sided with the Shogun before being forced to broker the Satsuma-Choshu Alliance, and then having the option to side with the Shogun again for the Battle of Toba-Fushimi. That's not being a mercenary, that is being absolutely stupid. You are literally creating the army that you're just about to fight. It would be like having a bank robbery mission in GTA where part of the setup is making sure the cops have body armor and machine guns.

I know 'emotional impact' isn't what they're likely going for, but it's so fascinatingly jarring to be like "Last time we met, I said I'd kill you, but now I'll help you create an army to fight against the people I had previously helped before killing said army in the next mission."

I was singing this game's praises, recommending it to folks, enjoying the hell out of it, but Chapter 3 is killing it for me and not in the good way. I have no connection to finding a 'blade twin' that I saw once in a flashback. By the time Chapter 3 rolls around, you'd probably have more interest in the characters you've been interacting with for 50 hours over a twin that appears once or twice per city for a cryptic fight and a bye.

[cs446]

It really does feel like Way of the Samurai 4 except your choices don't matter and you keep getting railroaded into switching sides. I don't know what the point of introducing faction mechanics and the ability to choose to help one faction over another in such a way-it only serves to draw attention to how little agency the player has. Better to make the story purely linear like Nioh if they were going to do that IMHO.

[Tr0w]

As a Rurouni Kenshin fan i really like the Bakumatsu setting and story in this game more than the alt history Mongol invasion in GoT.

[NoOne]

I think it's funnier that you slice and dice every boss, and moments later it's huff & puff cor blimey you got me good there mate . Dude I cut your ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ head clean orf !!!