Review about 'the mirror'

[craig234]

A reviewer wrote:

'If you ever fight the mirror, you lose. It starts with more HP than you can deal round 1. Then it summons clones of your party that has your damage, all your moves, and more hp than your guys. If you don't kill your clones in i believe 3 turns, it summons another batch. The mirror is invulnerable while clones are alive. It's mathematically impossible to win, and i don't know why they do this.'

I don't have the game, but I'm curious if people want to reply to that without spoilers. (Because Steam has the crappy setup to disable comments by default, there's no discussing it in the review).

[kingchris43]

that's just not true at all.
all enemies have a lot more health than your guys, which is why it's crucial that you think about where you start on the map, and focus on initiating your buffs and reducing enemy resistances before offloading your arsenal.
some bosses require you to kill adds in order to harm them, while others need to be focused while AOE heals keep your guys up.
using barrels and summons to your advantage, and knowing when to utilise them, can make a huge difference.

i don't think i've had this game a week yet, but i have 81 hours in it.
i find the combat thrilling, challenging, rewarding, and incredibly well balanced.
i love absolutely everything about this game. everything.

[Let]

I cant give specifics as it's been a while since I've done the mirror fight, but I've beat it twice so far (I know because I have the fortunes from it) and it was no where near impossible. However, I don't know when the original review was left, but I have heard that in the beginning this game had some balance issues. I do not think that is the case now. I'm honestly surprised more people aren't playing this. I've been having a lot of fun.

[Ilsalay]

Originally posted by craig234:

A reviewer wrote:

'If you ever fight the mirror, you lose. It starts with more HP than you can deal round 1. Then it summons clones of your party that has your damage, all your moves, and more hp than your guys. If you don't kill your clones in i believe 3 turns, it summons another batch. The mirror is invulnerable while clones are alive. It's mathematically impossible to win, and i don't know why they do this.'

I don't have the game, but I'm curious if people want to reply to that without spoilers. (Because Steam has the crappy setup to disable comments by default, there's no discussing it in the review).

There's a lot of factors that could be taking place here.

If the person writing the review was playing with a full party of 6 that was made of lower level characters (10ish or lower) that event /could/ be impossible. And they could have been playing on a higher difficulty that they likely shouldn't have been. The Mirror event can be 1 turned/2 turned before it has a chance to make clones. If you don't have a means of disabling/stunning the mirror round 1, and your low level party can't put out enough damage, I could see how this could quickly become a downhill battle.

The 6 man party inflates the HP of enemies significantly, also. So without knowing the exact situation it is very hard to say.

[Red riding hood the third]

It becomes horrid if one of your party members is a pure priest with healing spells that shields the mirror instead of the clones.

[craig234]

The review was recent (Jan 30). Sounds like there's more to the topic.

[Ilsalay]

It's honestly an event that shouldn't appear until a certain level - as it could be impossible for lower levels. There was a recent update since that review and I recall some discussion in the Discord community about that event in particular. Can't recall if the Devs were planning to tweak the event, or push it back to not be available until it is more manageable.

I recall about 2 months ago they had asked for some solo (1 character) play feedback. One event in particular (that had recently changed) was impossible if you got it before a certain level. The Ogre event - where he demands money or you fight. Well, when you are a fresh level 1, you have no money. So when you fight, you fight 3 big giant Ogres (used to be 1) with significant HP and very large hammers. A solo weak lvl 1 can do nothing about that. 1 Ogre, maybe. Would still be rough. But not 3.
I gave them feedback on that - and they gated it to be in later zones/until higher levels.

The devs listen. They need constructive feedback, not negative reviews from a single bad event experience.

[Cheggf]

Some of the balance is a bit rough. Maybe later on once you're higher level things flatten out, but the early levels will either have all of the enemies be completely incapable of harming you if you play on anything below Torturous, or if you are on Torturous the encounters will vary wildly ranging from too easy to literally impossible.

[kingchris43]

perhaps tell us what you're doing so we can figure out what isn't working for you?
it makes more sense to me that you're referring to your own experiences, rather than referencing a review.
i did the mirror quest today on 'adventurer' with 6 people with no problems.
only got one set of clones before closing the show.

remember to keep AOE spells and abilities for when the clones come, and use summons.

[Samseng Yik]

I can tell you how I win. I played with my cousin on Veteran. Each players control 2 heroes.
The key is mana drain spell.
We drain the mirror mana whenever CD ready.
The mirror summon clone need 20 mana.
So when mirror mana reach 0, it just idle

[Cheggf]

Originally posted by Cheggf:

Some of the balance is a bit rough. Maybe later on once you're higher level things flatten out, but the early levels will either have all of the enemies be completely incapable of harming you if you play on anything below Torturous, or if you are on Torturous the encounters will vary wildly ranging from too easy to literally impossible.

I just got the mirror event and that one was actually very well balanced, at least for my party. Maybe at a different level, party size, or difficulty it's impossible but a party of four level 5s was able to do it just fine.

Funnily enough, though, it came immediately after one of those terribly balanced fights I was talking about. Literally 20 minutes of hitting a Mimic over and over again, just the same turns in the same way every time. It was always either stunned or attacking a skeleton so it never posed a threat, it was just a huge time waster.

Originally posted by kingchris43:

perhaps tell us what you're doing so we can figure out what isn't working for you?
it makes more sense to me that you're referring to your own experiences, rather than referencing a review.

He doesn't even own the game. He's referring to the most helpful review:
https://steamcommunity.com/id/thenocturnalplay/recommended/1330000/

[Timon]

I had the mirror event happened to me on my first playthrough, level 3. I played as a summoner, solo character (no party members at all), so I had no problem in beating the clones and the mirror itself. It grants a good special skill - summoning your own clone, too bad that is will always stay at level 3. :(

[craig234]

Originally posted by Timon:

I had the mirror event happened to me on my first playthrough, level 3. I played as a summoner, solo character (no party members at all), so I had no problem in beating the clones and the mirror itself. It grants a good special skill - summoning your own clone, too bad that is will always stay at level 3. :(

That doesn't sound good, RNG making a skill locked at low level.

[Cheggf]

Originally posted by craig234:

Originally posted by Timon:

I had the mirror event happened to me on my first playthrough, level 3. I played as a summoner, solo character (no party members at all), so I had no problem in beating the clones and the mirror itself. It grants a good special skill - summoning your own clone, too bad that is will always stay at level 3. :(

That doesn't sound good, RNG making a skill locked at low level.

Replacing low level things with new high level things is pretty much the point of CRPGs.

[Timon]

Originally posted by craig234:

Originally posted by Timon:

I had the mirror event happened to me on my first playthrough, level 3. I played as a summoner, solo character (no party members at all), so I had no problem in beating the clones and the mirror itself. It grants a good special skill - summoning your own clone, too bad that is will always stay at level 3. :(

That doesn't sound good, RNG making a skill locked at low level.

I want to update the message I left earlier, today I've found the same event, if you beat the mirror again, you'll get the same Fortune Skill, but with an equal level to your character. When I beat it a second time, I was 22th level, so this number also applied to the Fortune level itself. I'm happy again, because with renewed skill, I can use my own clone with the very same abilities that I have, once again!

[RAGEDog]

My group just aced that event 4 of us lvl 4-5 classic diff. the fortune from it is nice especially since someone is playing a summoner.