ME 3: Legion's dead

[S'bass thulu]

So legion was my specialist in 2. He was loyal and some blurb said he wouldn't die but he's dead either way. I also reprogrammed the radicals in 2. Does it matter all that much for 3? Legion, Garrus, and Kasumi have been my favorite in game AIs even though everything's wonky now and then.

[SpaceWombat]

... yes Legion being dead in ME2 has very important implications for ME3. I recommend using the trilogy save editor to mark him as alive.

[Cool Cereal]

It will be impossible to get the best outcomes in ME3 if you import your ME2 save.

[S'bass thulu]

CC what do you mean?

Thanks SW.

[Cool Cereal]

Originally posted by S'bass thulu:

CC what do you mean?

Thanks SW.

I don’t want to give spoilers, but if you go into ME3 with Legion being dead and having reprogrammed the heretics you will not be able to get the best outcome at the end of a major ME3 arc.

[S'bass thulu]

ugh. respect

[S'bass thulu]

I'll run this one and hop on the fail train. Then try one with all the good advice. Should've sent Jacob into that specialist spot.

[NecroMaster]

You probably failed the hold the line value.

At the end of the suicide mission when you’re picking your final team all the squad mates you have holding the door hold a certain value and if it’s average is too low 1-3 of them can get killed.

Here’s what their values are worth.

Garrus, grunt and Zaeed are a 3
Thane, Miranda, Jacob, thane and Samara are a 1
Jack, mordin, tali, legion are a 0

And if you make them loyal their value is increased by 1

Nowhere they start dying is when their average is below these values.

Less than 1 than 3 people will die.
Less then 1.5 than 2 people will die.
Less than 2 than only one person dies.

The two people you take into the boss room must also be loyal or they won’t make it out.

But there’s one more thing you should know.

Garrus, Grunt and Zaeed have values that are so high that any scenario 2 of these 3 are missing the value will always be below 2 with the whole team present even if you send a low value back with the crew.

So it’s important if you want to take one of those 3 in only take one

[Dethlane]

Yes, it does matter. If Legion died in ME2, you get some other geth instead of him during quarians' arc in ME3 and it becomes impossible to broker peace between quarians and geth.

Originally posted by NecroMaster:

Thane, Miranda, Jacob, thane and Samara are a 1
Jack, mordin, tali, legion are a 0

Legion is 1, Kasumi is 0.

Originally posted by S'bass thulu:

Should've sent Jacob into that specialist spot.

There's a guide for the suicide mission. But in short:

Finish all, or at least almost all, loyalty missions before going for IFF. Go through the Omega 4 relay immediately after collectors kidnap your crew, without doing any other quests, otherwise some/most of the crew will die.

Also it's crucial to upgrade Normandy's armor, shielding and main gun (upgrades from Jacob, Tali and Garrus). Each missing upgrade of these three will result in a squadmate's death when approaching the collectors' base.

1st part:
Tech specialist - loyal Tali/Legion/Kasumi
2nd team leader - loyal Garrus/Miranda/Jacob

After rescuing your crew, agree to send an escort with them. Send any loyal squadmate (preferably Mordin/Kasumi/Jack/Tali).

2nd part:
Biotic - loyal Samara/Jack
2nd team leader - loyal Garrus/Miranda/Jacob

Final part:
Pick any 2 loyal squadmates with you, preferably not Garrus/Grunt/Zaeed. Also, if you plan to bring LI with you, pick them 2nd for a nice flavor to afterfight cutscenes.

If you've done everything correctly, everyone survives. And if you chose Tali as the tech specialist and/or Jack as the biotic, it alters some of their lines in ME3.

[S'bass thulu]

Yeah. That's the frustrating part. I did every quest, discovered every anomaly, cleared 100% on all planets. Everybody was loyal before going into that last mission. I get legion's unique in concept, but I figured once all the radicals were reprogrammed it'd be a bigger army and if that individual host body was lost the consciousness of legion would still just show up somewhere again transmuted, not gone. I read some tips like that but it said that if (any) crew were loyal then they wouldn't die, not that only one squad member wouldn't be in that situation. Well, I don't have any saves in 2 before the radicals are converted. Back on this bone pony. Thanks for the tips.

[NecroMaster]

Originally posted by S'bass thulu:

Yeah. That's the frustrating part. I did every quest, discovered every anomaly, cleared 100% on all planets. Everybody was loyal before going into that last mission. I get legion's unique in concept, but I figured once all the radicals were reprogrammed it'd be a bigger army and if that individual host body was lost the consciousness of legion would still just show up somewhere again transmuted, not gone. I read some tips like that but it said that if (any) crew were loyal then they wouldn't die, not that only one squad member wouldn't be in that situation. Well, I don't have any saves in 2 before the radicals are converted. Back on this bone pony. Thanks for the tips.

To be fair every mechanic in the suicide mission is explained except the hold the line mechanic.

So whenever people say everyone loyal legion died that’s always the first thing I think is what went wrong cause legion is allegedly first on the chopping block if hold the line is failed with everyone loyal.

[Dethlane]

There's a number of checks, loyalty alone isn't enough. You have to choose loyal and correct characters for the roles. And on top of that, when going for the final fight you should leave as much firepower behind as possible. Below are possible deaths and their requirements.


Intro. If Normandy's main gun, armor and/or shielding weren't upgraded, squadmates die (1 per missing upgrade).

1nd part. If tech specialist or 2nd team leader is chosen wrong (wrong character or not loyal), tech dies.

Crew. If no escort, they all die. If escort isn't loyal, this character dies.

2nd part. If biotic is chosen wrong, one of the squadmates in your party dies. If 2nd team leader is chosen wrong, they (the leader) die. From what I remember, Miranda survives even if she isn't loyal, never tested it though and I dunno if they changed it in LE.

Final fight. Any non-loyal party member dies. If average strength of the vanguard isn't enough, 1-3 of them die.

If less than two squadmates survived, Shepard dies as well.

[Dethlane]

Originally posted by NecroMaster:

To be fair every mechanic in the suicide mission is explained except the hold the line mechanic.

Yeah, and that's especially cool. All suicide mission aspects - necessary ship upgrades, importance of loyalty, necessary skills for specialists - are explained beforehand. As for holding the line, it isn't stated clearly unlike earlier points, but it's implied. Like, there will be seemingly endless waves of enemies, so in stands to reason to leave as much beef and firepower as possible. If anything, the necessity of having loyal party members in the final fight is more unclear.

Originally posted by NecroMaster:

So whenever people say everyone loyal legion died that’s always the first thing I think is what went wrong cause legion is allegedly first on the chopping block if hold the line is failed with everyone loyal.

Is he? IIRC it's smth like Mordin - Tali - Kasumi - ...

[S'bass thulu]

Wasn't reading the super helpful info above correctly at first. Sorted the points on the second play through. Everybody got through alive this round. Thanks.