Building is too tedious + deforestation simulator

[....]

I like the game but some things seriously are really bad for fun:

1) Build/Grind
Iunderstand that they wanted to have a "realism" feel to the building but the way it is now its not fun at all.

Grind to build:
- building requires way too many logs and trees dont respawn fast enough and dont drop enough logs
- building pretty much leads to complete deforestation - if you take wood from further away building becomes even more tedious only carrying 2 logs a trip - i want to have a nice looking base - not a desert base because i need all the trees on this planet for a house and a fence ...
- why would they not instantly give players at least a sled to transport more logs?
- in general the grind compared to the importance of a single base in this game seems off - the map is just too big and the traverl too slow for a single base to be that usefull

Find the invisible log - sidegame
- When playing at high settings and cutting down a tree in the woods with lots of bushes etc. its almost impossible to find all the logs since they are pretty much invisibile when they land in bushes/grass and they will randmoly start a journey across the map ...
- when putting down logs they will suddenly become selfconscious and start their own live ...

Easy to destroy:
- so there is lots of tedious grind to build - yet buildings are destroyed pretty easily ...

Lack of planning:
- Free-Build without beeing able to make blueprints is a mess - you never know what even works, often random posts cant be removed
- lots of building parts are missing so depending on how you build you will always have tons of holes you can never fill

Game mechancis make no sense:
- one the one hand everything is an absurd grind - on the other hand we have an NPC that pretty much auto-builds etc. and reduced some grind too zero - at least if you only build blueprints
- i also dont want to use the NPC for much since when collecting branches he will trigger 99% of all enemys on the map and when collecting logs he will make everything look like a wasteland and even destroy your tree-bases according to some other players


Suggestions:
- give players the ability to craft a sled for logs from the start
- give players the ability to drop logs on the floor in a pre-defined way to for example make them roll downwards in the right direction and make the player able to drop them on the floor and stay there
- make logs dropped into bushes etc. way more visible and stop absurd movements of logs (or add an option for that - outlne etc.) in real life nobody has to do a 10 hour search for logs because in real life you can also instantly see them and they wont move across the map in 80% of cases
- reduce the ammount of logs required for buildings or increase the drop rate of trees, the respawn of trees and the ability to carry more than 2 logs
- it doesnt even make sense that everything is made out of logs or half logs ...
- maybe in general add settings for players to reduce the grind
- given how unimportant bases are due to the size of the map and travel speed i seriously wonder if building bases should be this tedious - i would understand it if you would build one big base but that does hardly make sense on such a huge map

[GamingWithSilvertail]

Originally posted by ....:

Originally posted by GamingWithSilvertail:

Just out of curiousity, on what setting sare you you playing as you cant see logs?

For example where are the logs? And even worse if you pick up the 2 you see and move them to your baes you will never find the others and thats not even a spot where logs will travel across the map to their freedom:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2941828334
I just cut down the tree and made the screenshot - the only obvious log is the first one ...

Everything is set to high.

Are you not looking in the direction where the tree drops, as in actually moving there cause that might help? o.O

They're not really missable. They're very big.

.

Originally posted by Shyhalu:

Originally posted by pansekitoo:

there is no point in building a base in today's game at all:
it has to be tedious, and slow, and eventually they will constantly destroy it for you so that this process takes as long as possible.

if none of this... you would quickly realise that there is practically no game at all here.

Minecraft disagrees....vehemently.

One of the reasons I won't buy this is how tedious and unfulfilling base building was in the first one.

They basically made gathering resources less tedious with an NPC helper....only to get rid of the quicker base building method for a more tedious one.

Yeah.. lets compare minecraft which is a totally different type of game compared to the forest ...

Are you thinking this forum is Valheim? Cause valheim is more like MC when it comes to building and inventory system.

[....]

Originally posted by GamingWithSilvertail:

Originally posted by ....:

For example where are the logs? And even worse if you pick up the 2 you see and move them to your baes you will never find the others and thats not even a spot where logs will travel across the map to their freedom:
https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2941828334
I just cut down the tree and made the screenshot - the only obvious log is the first one ...

Everything is set to high.

Are you not looking in the direction where the tree drops, as in actually moving there cause that might help? o.O

They're not really missable. They're very big.

.

Originally posted by Shyhalu:

Minecraft disagrees....vehemently.

One of the reasons I won't buy this is how tedious and unfulfilling base building was in the first one.

They basically made gathering resources less tedious with an NPC helper....only to get rid of the quicker base building method for a more tedious one.

Yeah.. lets compare minecraft which is a totally different type of game compared to the forest ...

Are you thinking this forum is Valheim? Cause valheim is more like MC when it comes to building and inventory system.

Yes that screenshot looks exactly in the direction the tree fell.
Yes they arent missable - in open spaces. If its in an area with lots of plants and mabe even an area that isnt flat its a different story.

Maybe it would be enough to limit movement of logs that fell down after cutting a tree since in real life due to falling down they will stay in place most of the time since they will deform the ground.

[KjngRaptor]

It's all about location, I found a spot with a low cliff over a lake, that is on the side of a tall cliff.... only really two sides need walls and it saves a lot on building.

Also there's an island in the middle of a lake that you can use the zipline to send logs to and.... they can't swim so you don't even need to try at that spot.... until winter when the lake freezes over....

But then I just go back to my cliff lake base and they rarely bother me.

Bunch of fools building in the middle of the woods or out in the open without using the environment to your advantage, end up putting way more work in for a less defend-able
base than what I can setup in a couple hours.

[....]

Originally posted by KjngRaptorTTV:

It's all about location, I found a spot with a low cliff over a lake, that is on the side of a tall cliff.... only really two sides need walls and it saves a lot on building.

Also there's an island in the middle of a lake that you can use the zipline to send logs to and.... they can't swim so you don't even need to try at that spot.... until winter when the lake freezes over....

But then I just go back to my cliff lake base and they rarely bother me.

Bunch of fools building in the middle of the woods or out in the open without using the environment to your advantage, end up putting way more work in for a less defend-able
base than what I can setup in a couple hours.

You do realize that many people also enjoy the aspects of basebuilding and having a good looking base - if it was just about easy defence i would just pick a spot where the AI has issues.

I like the game in general but it seems as if it makes it way to tedious to build a base if looks is important to you aswell as location and not creating a wasteland arround your base.

[KjngRaptor]

Originally posted by ....:

Originally posted by KjngRaptorTTV:

It's all about location, I found a spot with a low cliff over a lake, that is on the side of a tall cliff.... only really two sides need walls and it saves a lot on building.

Also there's an island in the middle of a lake that you can use the zipline to send logs to and.... they can't swim so you don't even need to try at that spot.... until winter when the lake freezes over....

But then I just go back to my cliff lake base and they rarely bother me.

Bunch of fools building in the middle of the woods or out in the open without using the environment to your advantage, end up putting way more work in for a less defend-able
base than what I can setup in a couple hours.

You do realize that many people also enjoy the aspects of basebuilding and having a good looking base - if it was just about easy defence i would just pick a spot where the AI has issues.

I like the game in general but it seems as if it makes it way to tedious to build a base if looks is important to you aswell as location and not creating a wasteland arround your base.

Idk, I like the look of my cliff base, it's a pretty charming spot and considering how the chokepoints work.... I can spend 1/4th of the wood as others do making an big circle around their base to close off the access points.

They have come-a-knockin and were breaking through but.... I just built up that side more, which since it's a one direction kind of thing.... I didn't need to spend hours to reinforce it.

Also, donno if you knew but if you have 2 bases and move between them regularly.... like say with the zipline system.... the enemies become less common and severe in their waves.

[KjngRaptor]

Originally posted by Caduryn:

Originally posted by ....:

You know why games are called games and not work?

I have no problems with not getting everythign instantly - but having to search for 50% of the logs after cutting down a tree just to carry 2 logs a time and not even knowing if what you started to build works doenst seem fun to me.

I play games to have fun - not to have endless grind. It would be enough to me if they added some more game options.

One Word.... zip line, your base will swim in Logs


Thank me later

Don't forget to add a log storage to the end of that zipline also :D

[GamingWithSilvertail]

Originally posted by ....:

Originally posted by GamingWithSilvertail:

Are you not looking in the direction where the tree drops, as in actually moving there cause that might help? o.O

They're not really missable. They're very big.

.


Yeah.. lets compare minecraft which is a totally different type of game compared to the forest ...

Are you thinking this forum is Valheim? Cause valheim is more like MC when it comes to building and inventory system.

Yes that screenshot looks exactly in the direction the tree fell.
Yes they arent missable - in open spaces. If its in an area with lots of plants and mabe even an area that isnt flat its a different story.

Maybe it would be enough to limit movement of logs that fell down after cutting a tree since in real life due to falling down they will stay in place most of the time since they will deform the ground.

You know I didnt only say that screenshot was looking in the direction.

I also said that you should move into the foliage. You cant miss them if you just move into the area where the logs drop. You really cant miss them.

And if stuff is rolling away, then you need to take that as a lesson., Physics are a thing. :P

[ㄥoㄥıʞɐꞱ]

it's tedious ye, and pretty limited atm. Could be so good, but way too less ways to properly control it or form a structure to your likings.

[Krieger]

git wud.

in part one you could almost walk on floating logs in water, here, they go tropo and yeah it is some hard core collection if you want to build anything especially in solo.
they call it free form but it's a pretty rigid building mechanic

[Cosmic]

Originally posted by ....:

I like the game but some things seriously are really bad for fun:

1) Build/Grind
Iunderstand that they wanted to have a "realism" feel to the building but the way it is now its not fun at all.

Grind to build:
- building requires way too many logs and trees dont respawn fast enough and dont drop enough logs
- building pretty much leads to complete deforestation - if you take wood from further away building becomes even more tedious only carrying 2 logs a trip - i want to have a nice looking base - not a desert base because i need all the trees on this planet for a house and a fence ...
- why would they not instantly give players at least a sled to transport more logs?
- in general the grind compared to the importance of a single base in this game seems off - the map is just too big and the traverl too slow for a single base to be that usefull

Find the invisible log - sidegame
- When playing at high settings and cutting down a tree in the woods with lots of bushes etc. its almost impossible to find all the logs since they are pretty much invisibile when they land in bushes/grass and they will randmoly start a journey across the map ...
- when putting down logs they will suddenly become selfconscious and start their own live ...

Easy to destroy:
- so there is lots of tedious grind to build - yet buildings are destroyed pretty easily ...

Lack of planning:
- Free-Build without beeing able to make blueprints is a mess - you never know what even works, often random posts cant be removed
- lots of building parts are missing so depending on how you build you will always have tons of holes you can never fill

Game mechancis make no sense:
- one the one hand everything is an absurd grind - on the other hand we have an NPC that pretty much auto-builds etc. and reduced some grind too zero - at least if you only build blueprints
- i also dont want to use the NPC for much since when collecting branches he will trigger 99% of all enemys on the map and when collecting logs he will make everything look like a wasteland and even destroy your tree-bases according to some other players


Suggestions:
- give players the ability to craft a sled for logs from the start
- give players the ability to drop logs on the floor in a pre-defined way to for example make them roll downwards in the right direction and make the player able to drop them on the floor and stay there
- make logs dropped into bushes etc. way more visible and stop absurd movements of logs (or add an option for that - outlne etc.) in real life nobody has to do a 10 hour search for logs because in real life you can also instantly see them and they wont move across the map in 80% of cases
- reduce the ammount of logs required for buildings or increase the drop rate of trees, the respawn of trees and the ability to carry more than 2 logs
- it doesnt even make sense that everything is made out of logs or half logs ...
- maybe in general add settings for players to reduce the grind
- given how unimportant bases are due to the size of the map and travel speed i seriously wonder if building bases should be this tedious - i would understand it if you would build one big base but that does hardly make sense on such a huge map

Zipline are great for transporting logs from point A to B, you can even build log storage at the end that logs will fly into for auto storage.

You can 'plant' logs into the ground to prevent movement, and easily pick them up by holding down the C key.

You can turn off building damage in the settings.

There is a section about Struts in the handbook, that explains how to make support beams, allowing you to remove previously unmovable logs.

[....]

Originally posted by GamingWithSilvertail:

Originally posted by ....:

Yes that screenshot looks exactly in the direction the tree fell.
Yes they arent missable - in open spaces. If its in an area with lots of plants and mabe even an area that isnt flat its a different story.

Maybe it would be enough to limit movement of logs that fell down after cutting a tree since in real life due to falling down they will stay in place most of the time since they will deform the ground.

You know I didnt only say that screenshot was looking in the direction.

I also said that you should move into the foliage. You cant miss them if you just move into the area where the logs drop. You really cant miss them.

And if stuff is rolling away, then you need to take that as a lesson., Physics are a thing. :P

Yes but in real life if something heavy falls into a soft forest dirt floor it will simply get stuck in it 80% of the time and since its also not perfectly round and full of branches chances are 95% of logs will never just roll off.

I understand what many people are saying - and i think its probably an issue for people like me that like good looking bases and dont want to ruin the area they are building in. Zip-Line obviously also make it easier - still it seems as if its a bit weird - one the one hand people that just want a functional base and dont care about the looks of anything can pretty much save a lot of time building - having Kelvin do lots of work without having to worry and have way less grind than anyone who actually is into building good looking bases.

Also do people really enjoy a building system where you cant pre-plan with some sort of blueprint what you are doing and what is possible? While this is no problem if you just build something very small it becomes a huge issues if you do anything bigger and want a nice design.

Also blueprints are in the game anyways so why not enable blueprint pre-building for free building?