Thank you for the consideration.

[I am Bibbly.]

Ya'll are very reasonable people and I thank you for taking my outreach in stride.

[Mander Bander]

Originally posted by Bibbly -:

anyone else kind of see these things as glaring issues?

Nah. Getting Moon Whistle is a walk in a park. After that you'll experience the third layer, and then you'll explore the fourth layer with needing to go back through the third one without fast travel, and then you'll explore the fifth one with needing to go back through the fourth one. Just learn the abyss, take more than enough food from orth, go back if you see that you dont have enough food to keep cave raiding. Dont let to get yourself in situation when you're deep down there with nothing to eat. I went to the third layer as red whistle once just for fun, was going to load my save after that, but managed to go back to orth on my last breath. Just remember that your curiosity can bring you anywhere, but you always have to go back, and the way back probably will be way harder

[Eoun]

for me these are all features, the abyss is supposed to feel like an unforgiving heck hole rather than a picnic site, the author was greatly involved in the production of this experience for that additional level of fidelity to the source material, by the way, would like to know what do you mean by rng/random number generation/luck, because yes it's advisable to use the save balloon feature to scout ahead and reload back to spend less resources, but once you figure out the routes, because the abyss' layout doesn't change barred few exceptions, you may near-perfectly plan/craft your intended hike path, carrying as many or as few supplies as preferred since there are some food recipes that don't need salt and are perfectly viable, albeit maybe a bit repetitive down there; also please consider the cave raider character is a short and thin human, so their punching power should do little to no damage against most things if it was implemented, it's not like they're Reg, who can actually throw some darn good punches against primeval creatures and fully geared cave raiders; maybe adding a punching relic that could also be upgraded would work, but then, if we're talking about tools/weapons, i'd rather have a javelin with a rope attached or a grappling hook gun to mimic Reg's ability to initiate the traversal of rope spots from down to top instead of being limited to placing rope only from top to down, idk rope arrow, anything, tame a capable primeval creature or something

[I am Bibbly.]

Originally posted by Mander Bander:

Originally posted by Bibbly -:

anyone else kind of see these things as glaring issues?

Nah. Getting Moon Whistle is a walk in a park.

I'm a Moon Whistle. I've been to rockslide canyon.
The map sucks and I never have any idea where I'm going or how to get back. Its a slog. At my level the back-tracking is fine, unless I run out of food or tools.
In which case, again, IMO, that is soft-locking the experience.

And what I'm saying is I don't believe the devs played through their game in full. If they'd have played it on PC without a controller and ran through the game a lot of glaring issues and glitches would be fixed. There are fundamental aspects that STOP and soft-lock the entire experience. It isn't a 'feature' just because people call it a 'mature/hardcore survival RPG'. People with lives and jobs don't have the time or money to spend on a game that stops you from enjoying it.

Originally posted by Eoun:

for me these are all features, the abyss is supposed to feel like an unforgiving heck hole rather than a picnic site, the author was greatly involved in the production of this experience for that additional level of fidelity to the source material, by the way, would like to know what do you mean by rng/random number generation/luck, because yes it's advisable to use the save balloon feature to scout ahead and reload back to spend less resources, but once you figure out the routes, because the abyss' layout doesn't change barred few exceptions, you may near-perfectly plan/craft your intended hike path, carrying as many or as few supplies as preferred since there are some food recipes that don't need salt and are perfectly viable, albeit maybe a bit repetitive down there; also please consider the cave raider character is a short and thin human, so their punching power should do little to no damage against most things if it was implemented, it's not like they're Reg, who can actually throw some darn good punches against primeval creatures and fully geared cave raiders; maybe adding a punching relic that could also be upgraded would work, but then, if we're talking about tools/weapons, i'd rather have a javelin with a rope attached or a grappling hook gun to mimic Reg's ability to initiate the traversal of rope spots from down to top instead of being limited to placing rope only from top to down, idk rope arrow, anything, tame a capable primeval creature or something

It is not a 'feature' to give a person a game that stops the person from experiencing the gameplay, just because. That isn't a hard game, its a game that puts players into repeatedly unplayable states. It shows a lack of respect toward people's time.

The abyss is a made up fantasy world full of redundant and broken aspects that were poorly implemented. The inventory system and loot system is broken. The PC controllers are broken. And RNG has nothing to do with that and it is not a feature.

The cave raider character is a 12 year old that eats 8 bowls of soup and isn't full.
Can eat 10 apples and isn't full.
And becomes sick from jumping 15 times, on any layer, which is not how strain works.
Again, those aspects are not features, I believe they are poorly implemented byproducts of a game that was put together and not ran through by the devs.

There are broken gameplay aspects outside of the RNG and inventory, there are broken game aspects to do with graphical errors and glitches, player locomtion.

The 'game balance' itself is mostly fine. Outside of say, everything that stops the game from being playable or enjoyable, because that is ultimately part of the design that was implemented. And telling players 'oops try again' while leaving them in a state of hopelessness is lack of respect for people's time. 20 to 60 minutes of gameplay rendering barely ANY meta progression is an over all unwelcoming experience even for hardcore survival and JRPG enthusiasts.

[Eoun]

you did ask if anyone saw the things as glaring issues and i replied 'on the contrary', if the game's not enjoyable, it's not to be played (there can be exceptions as always with everything ever), i've quit several 'good games' cuz felt like they were straight up giving me everything and, from my view, i wasn't enjoying the flow in those, games are meant to entertain the player, mission irredeemably failed for some, for sure and someone said the player character's age on 'deep in abyss' is never mentioned so there's a theory they're an adult with nanism/dwarfism; time is said to work differently in the abyss and game mechanics can be seen as attempting to represent that, the amounts are not to be taken literally (at least for my immersion's sake), they're supposed to represent a grueling journey (the ultra hitboxes of some creatures, the 'jank' degrees of many rock-wall protrusions, bunch of enemies sprouting out of thin air, crouching making character nearly undetectable, poison overkilling vulnerabilities, the curse blanket being fundamentally flawed as you mentioned and many more other stuff) through a stretch of unknown time, the abyss would be really small if it was on a 1:1 scale with the regions in this game; what i'm trying to say is that i honestly welcome all this game's 'flaws' cuz to me they really provide great joy, i feel like i need to put time into the abyss to harvest its relics and primeval creatures' materials, which is what i want from a made in abyss game if there ever was to be one, sitting down, making a map/route is awesome, takes time, but pays off, not for everyone though, that's why i like the navigation and supply management elements in other multiplayer games, keeping the folks well stocked and well oriented on the group's tasks so all they got to worry about is doing their thing; i would be one of those cave raiders who take rich noble foreign tourists for a much safer abyss raid and you sound like you want some of that tour experience, but not in this game though(?) edit: this other topic may be useful idk https://steamcommunity.com/app/1324340/discussions/0/3728450372147621173

[Mander Bander]

Originally posted by Bibbly -:

The map sucks and I never have any idea where I'm going or how to get back. Its a slog.

You know what I did when I was a knew one in the abyss? Made a map. With my own hands. And that was one of the coolest exploring experiences from this game. I created it myself, not for some npc, and it was very helpful.

Originally posted by Bibbly -:

At my level the back-tracking is fine, unless I run out of food or tools.
In which case, again, IMO, that is soft-locking the experience.

Well, IMO, thats just means you didn't prepare enough food or tools to go as deep as you went. Again, I had really hard situations on 1-2 layers when I wasnt prepared but still managed to find a way up.

Originally posted by Bibbly -:

That isn't a hard game, its a game that puts players into repeatedly unplayable states. It shows a lack of respect toward people's time.

No, it shows a lack of preparations from your side. Do not underestimate the abyss, and such situations will not arise.

[Oyaku]

sounds like skill issue to me

[I am Bibbly.]

Alrighty then. Thank you all for the input.

[I am Bibbly.]

Just found the fast-travel thing on the map menu.
Ohhh boy. Well, I'm going to ugh... I'll take the slings and arrows to do with being a bit of a moron. The oversight is on my part.

However I still do feel that there are fundamental issues. My character is climbing with his legs broken, he gets stuck beside walls. There are walls missing. The speed at which the player moves is directly associated with stamina, 'decreasing stamina usage' is actually increasing total stamina. Also strain itself is broken. The horizontal back and forth motion of 1 meter shouldn't cause strain. Anyway, I'll probably force myself to go through this whole thing. The developers already got a few 'actual' bug reports from me. Some of which were recorded.

Cheers.

This discussion can be locked or deleted at leisure.

[Empress Fordola]

"Game is too hard for me, I'll report it to the devs"
is what I got after reading everything lol
I found the game really enjoyable when I played through it a few months ago.
Game taught me quickly that preparation is not to be taken lightly.

[I am Bibbly.]

Originally posted by Empress Fordola:

"Game is too hard for me, I'll report it to the devs"
is what I got after reading everything lol
I found the game really enjoyable when I played through it a few months ago.
Game taught me quickly that preparation is not to be taken lightly.

There are player loco-motion issues and graphical errors.
There are letterbox problems, there are invisible objects on climbing surfaces,
there is all kinds of moments and places and situations that are broken. THAT is what I had reported to the devs.

[Seba Jun]

The game is really easy, I really don't see where the difficulty is. It's an action RPG, you can lvl up enough to face tank anything. The only downside is breakable weapons, as it always been the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mechanic created in video games, and to add more fun they break in like 10~hits.

[Eoun]

Originally posted by Seba Jun:

The game is really easy, I really don't see where the difficulty is. It's an action RPG, you can lvl up enough to face tank anything. The only downside is breakable weapons, as it always been the ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ mechanic created in video games, and to add more fun they break in like 10~hits.

about durability, some say there's a way to build a combination of equipment so its one hit kill and very high durability, but also very food demanding, it's similar to ozen's character build we can grind thousand man wedge, the relic she inserted all over her body, to increase attack power at the cost of exponentially(?) augmenting the natural decline of the fullness bar, so bunch of items that have relic slots for the wedges and using high durability stuff like scaled umbrella that has low attack by itself; may unequip the 'wedged' stuff when not in combat so they don't unnecessarily drain fullness; the grinding consists of rerolling a random loot from the 5th layer's inter. unit, it's an encounter much like those foreign raider ambush encounters which you only get by walking over the correct spot on the zone map and there's no visual indication the place triggers it; there are players who learn the location and save balloon before initiating it to reroll the loot faster until finding what they went there for

[Simalf]

Originally posted by Mander Bander:

Just remember that your curiosity can bring you anywhere, but you always have to go back, and the way back probably will be way harder

I reached the bottom of third layer as a Red whistle (lvl 15).

I know im past the point of no return which is probably that looooong climbable wall in third layer.
Might as well go deeper but it seems i have come to a dead end.

Its like a room in which the ground is Ice surrounded by lava. Anyhow i can get deeper or is this it until i continue with main story?

[z320]

Originally posted by Simalf:

I reached the bottom of fourth layer as a Red whistle (lvl 15).

I know im past the point of no return which is probably that looooong climbable wall in third layer.
Might as well go deeper but it seems i have come to a dead end.

Its like a room in which the ground is Ice surrounded by lava. Anyhow i can get deeper or is this it until i continue with main story?

that room is connected to 4th layer, but you better follow Main quest first, deeper layer than that only can reach with story progression

[Simalf]

Originally posted by z320:

Originally posted by Simalf:

I reached the bottom of fourth layer as a Red whistle (lvl 15).

I know im past the point of no return which is probably that looooong climbable wall in third layer.
Might as well go deeper but it seems i have come to a dead end.

Its like a room in which the ground is Ice surrounded by lava. Anyhow i can get deeper or is this it until i continue with main story?

that room is connected to 4th layer, but you better follow Main quest first, deeper layer than that only can reach with story progression

BTW with savescumming i did managed to come up again. (Rolling RNG until i got what i needed ro refill on stone, bones, tailmeat)

Came out of the hole that wasnt even there yet (from second robot).

Been playing the game and having a blast. Im enjoying the difficulty. Still those ####! MadokaJERKS were so annoying to deal with.

Glad im a black whistle now and can just fast travel past them.


The optional boss battle against __ was dissapointingly easy. Just took like 5 low tier relic pickaxes.

If __ grabs you (which like all the other attacks are easy to dodge) there will literally be a truce for a short while allowing you to heal.