Denuvo discussion

[donald23]

To make it easier to post your opinion and not have the entire forum cluttered with the same discussion, we have created this central thread.

All others will be locked.

[lukaself]

Escrito originalmente por Anmaril:

I believe it actually means installations.[...]

It's way more serious than that: The lack of transparency regarding what invalidates an activation token is another serious flaw with Denuvo. While not all triggers are known, it is evident that various normal actions, such as game crashes, changing Proton layers, system updates, game updates, hardware changes, switching devices like moving from a PC to a Steam Deck, adjusting the system clock, publisher-imposed time limits, and system reconfigurations, can render a token invalid. These restrictions and their impact are uniquely tied to Denuvo and would not affect a game without such DRM middleware.

Ultimately, the root issue is that a paying customer’s ability to play a game is tied to how they configure or use their computer. What someone does with their personal system should not concern a video game publisher. Customers have paid for the game and deserve access without interference and you're completely spot-on about the server issue, adding to that problematic.

[div1]

Escrito originalmente por Anmaril:

I believe it actually means installations.

No, it's been number of product activation instances per account across all platforms, no matter if it's on the same device or multiple devices.
So if you have 6 tries within 24 hours on your account, that 6th try will lock you out for 24 hours.
That could be a session on PC, continuing on Steam Deck in the evening, You or someone else activating it Saturday morning, then a PC session again, followed by another Steam Deck activation, any additional activation blocks your account.
if that's since Friday evening until Saturday evening, you could be locked out until Sunday evening, scuttling any sessions for most of the remaining of that weekend.
It's not that hard to achieve 6 activation triggers within 24 hours, add in a misclick or two, with some IRL event that make you stop a recently started session, and so on and so on...
You can install it on an many devices you log on to, but if your account racks up 5 program startups, the 6th will lock you out for 24 hours.
Then take into account that this is just one of the many issues with Denuvo and it's implementation into games.

[b9thirty99]

Cancelled all my founder's edition pre-order

[Maverick]

Escrito originalmente por b9thirty99:

Cancelled all my founder's edition pre-order

It's always strange to me to see a consumer educated, and vigilant enough to denounce denuvo who preorders videogames. They've had the same anti-consumer affect on the game's industry and is the direct reason why publishers feel comfortable enough doing what firaxis is doing now. If everybody had the knowledge, will power, and discipline to never pre order games we wouldn't be seeing anything like battle passes, look boxes, or denuvo today.

[b9thirty99]

Escrito originalmente por Maverick:

Escrito originalmente por b9thirty99:

Cancelled all my founder's edition pre-order

It's always strange to me to see a consumer educated, and vigilant enough to denounce denuvo who preorders videogames. They've had the same anti-consumer affect on the game's industry and is the direct reason why publishers feel comfortable enough doing what firaxis is doing now. If everybody had the knowledge, will power, and discipline to never pre order games we wouldn't be seeing anything like battle passes, look boxes, or denuvo today.

Thanks friend. Take care :)

[A D L]

Escrito originalmente por Maverick:

It's always strange to me to see a consumer educated, and vigilant enough to denounce denuvo who preorders videogames. They've had the same anti-consumer affect on the game's industry and is the direct reason why publishers feel comfortable enough doing what firaxis is doing now. If everybody had the knowledge, will power, and discipline to never pre order games we wouldn't be seeing anything like battle passes, look boxes, or denuvo today.

I pre-order my games because I can get them 25-50% off day one and most of the time I can cancel the pre-order if reviews are bad. What's too difficult to understand about that?

[SplatMan_DK]

Not a fan of Denuvo, but not in total panick either. As someone working in the IT industry I completely understand the pain when someone else steals your work. DRM is here to stay, and the publisher is not to blame - pirates are. Be honest and admit it. Pirates are the ones ruining your day.

I'll keep my preorder, and take a wait-and-see approach. If it doesn't get in my way, then I honestly don't care. Scr*w pirates and the pain they put us through - but stop blaming the publisher for fighting piracy.

[Maverick]

Escrito originalmente por A D L:

Escrito originalmente por Maverick:

It's always strange to me to see a consumer educated, and vigilant enough to denounce denuvo who preorders videogames. They've had the same anti-consumer affect on the game's industry and is the direct reason why publishers feel comfortable enough doing what firaxis is doing now. If everybody had the knowledge, will power, and discipline to never pre order games we wouldn't be seeing anything like battle passes, look boxes, or denuvo today.

I pre-order my games because I can get them 25-50% off day one and most of the time I can cancel the pre-order if reviews are bad. What's too difficult to understand about that?

You already told them you approve of the game when you preorder.

[Maverick]

Escrito originalmente por SplatMan_DK:

Not a fan of Denuvo, but not in total panick either. As someone working in the IT industry I completely understand the pain when someone else steals your work. DRM is here to stay, and the publisher is not to blame - pirates are. Be honest and admit it. Pirates are the ones ruining your day.

I'll keep my preorder, and take a wait-and-see approach. If it doesn't get in my way, then I honestly don't care. Scr*w pirates and the pain they put us through - but stop blaming the publisher for fighting piracy.

As someone who has developed games for 10 years I'm right there with you against piracy and that is why I will never support denuvo as it's implementation does nothing but incentive piracy. Piracy is going to exist regardless, let's not actively pat pirates on the back and ensure they get the best possible version of a product when the pirate it. Publishers and the shareholders who have been swindled with no idea what's going on are absolutely the only people to blame in this scenario.

[Eugster]

This “feature” is sufficient to remove the game from any possible purchase consideration. Will look at the game again if/when the malware is removed in a future patch, but if it ends up never being removed then that’s fine too, there are plenty of other games in the queue and it is easy to live without playing this title.

[FluffyPotato]

Damn, I guess I will wait until it gets removed. So many games already coming out on the first half of this year.

[Slan]

Escrito originalmente por Quint728:

I was getting rather excited reading about all the changes and additions Firaxis had made to Civ leading up to Civ VII. I was actually going to consider pre-ordering, something I rarely do with computer games.

And then I saw that hated word. Denuvo.

No. Thanks. I don't care how fabulous Firaxis has made Civ, I will NOT allow that horrid program on my system. No Civ VII for me until this grievous error in Firaxis and 2K's judgment is corrected.

Pretty much how I felt about it, super excited, about to pre-order deluxe edition until I saw that Denuvo word.

[Just Coda]

I hate the general concept behind civ 7, but there's generally a good chance Denuvo will be removed about 90-120 days after release.

Remember 2K has to pay basically a subscription fee on having Denuvo bundled with the game. Most of the sales and earnings a company plans for drops off after 3 months, so it wouldn't make a lot of sense for them to keep it bundled as sales drop off.

So, basically wait for the sale and you should be able to grab it without that extra bit of DRM.

Then again this is all speculation and we live in the era of private equity owning our hobby, so who knows?

[FluffyPotato]

Escrito originalmente por Just Coda:

I hate the general concept behind civ 7, but there's generally a good chance Denuvo will be removed about 90-120 days after release.

Remember 2K has to pay basically a subscription fee on having Denuvo bundled with the game. Most of the sales and earnings a company plans for drops off after 3 months, so it wouldn't make a lot of sense for them to keep it bundled as sales drop off.

So, basically wait for the sale and you should be able to grab it without that extra bit of DRM.

Then again this is all speculation and we live in the era of private equity owning our hobby, so who knows?

The strange thing about that is that only a few games have ended up removing Denuvo which in turn means that unless those games have been cracked once Denuvo's servers go down permanently those games are lost to history as they can't ever be played anymore.

[Metal Cat Solid]

Ths game going to be cracked anyway.