Minion builds: are they viable?

[TwoTonTuna]

Total GW2 noob here. I did some research on minion builds. specifically Necromancer summons and Engineer turrets/mech. I found a lot of posts saying that minion builds are only viable for open world. And even then, they perform worse than other builds.

For the GW2 vets out there, is this still true? Will I be essentially lock myself out of certain GW2 content if I decide to go for a minion build?

[Degra]

Originally posted by birdfoot:

Originally posted by Hanakocz:

Lvl 80 boost grants full set of celestial exotic gear. Therefore it is worth it to use the boost even if you already leveled up to 80 via normal play (good to do to learn the game), just to get the gear from the boost.

Oh, is the gear from lvl 80 boost account bound? I've never used the boosts before and there's 2 taking up my shared inventory slot which is kinda annoying. Have been wondering how to put them to some use instead of simply destroying them.

The level boosts also include some free gold (I believe you get 5 gold from a boost?)
I wouldn't destroy them.
Even if you don't need the gear, it's still worthwhile to use the boost.

[birdfoot]

Originally posted by Degra:

Originally posted by birdfoot:

Oh, is the gear from lvl 80 boost account bound? I've never used the boosts before and there's 2 taking up my shared inventory slot which is kinda annoying. Have been wondering how to put them to some use instead of simply destroying them.

The level boosts also include some free gold (I believe you get 5 gold from a boost?)
I wouldn't destroy them.
Even if you don't need the gear, it's still worthwhile to use the boost.

Thanks, that's great news to me. I never saw the use for them as all my 12 toons are already at level cap. But as I've been trying out new builds recently since my return, I've expended most of the armor and weapon boxes that I've gotten from WvW reward tracks last year before I stopped playing. I could certainly make use of another source of Celestial gear given their current price on the trading post.

Edit: Looked up the wiki for more info and it seems that the gold it gives is 2g. Also, according to wiki, the gear cannot be salvaged so it might be a good idea not to plug expensive runes into it - or at least check to see if wiki is right before deciding whether or not to.

[Pinkspring]

You can swap builds whenever you want.
In practice you'l probably be swapping out skills depending on whether you are doing open world, dungeons, raids or PvP.

And pay nothing for it.

[Teratus]

Specifically regarding Necromancer minions you must keep one thing in mind.

Necro Minions are a self sustain support utility, they are NOT a damage utility.

Most of the complaints people have made over the years regarding the "uselessness of Necro Minions" have come from people trying to use them as a DPS tool.

Necromancer Minions in Gw2 can heal you, pull conditions off you, distract enemies, provide protection/damage reduction and they can boost your defensive stats.
Some of them also provide some CC coverage such as the Elite Golem.

Everything about them tells you that they are intended to be a support mechanic, not a DPS one.
So if you use them as a support mechanic you'll find them to be exceptionally useful and they can greatly enhance their master's survivability.

Tanky Minion Master's in the PvE game can be extremely hard to kill and they can solo most open world content, as well as some group content as well.

So yes Necro Minions are very good so long as you take advantage of their strengths as a survival tool and focus on the traits that enhance their ability to keep you alive.

[Xevius]

Originally posted by Kodesh:

...
For the GW2 vets out there, is this still true? Will I be essentially lock myself out of certain GW2 content if I decide to go for a minion build?

Short: Yes. Minion Builds will lock you out of most of the Endgame Content with Groups. in Open World you should be fine with it

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by Drake:

also while undeads are not that good, the scourge necro spec has access to shades which are very powerful.

Until you get to the later expansions and then you have to go meta build or you will not get in any raids or other content, and guess what minion builds are not in the meta's, so yes you can do minion builds but later content good luck with that.

[TwoTonTuna]

Originally posted by Teratus:

Specifically regarding Necromancer minions you must keep one thing in mind.

Necro Minions are a self sustain support utility, they are NOT a damage utility.

I have noticed that a lot of minion skills revolve around CC. The only 'pure' damage minion I see is the Bone Minion's Putrid Explosion--turning them more into walking bombs than fighting minions.

I can see CC being useful in small/large-scale PvP, but what about end-game instanced raids? Doe players actually care about CC and boon corruption in end-game raids/fractals? Or is the end-game all about raw DPS with nothing else mattering?

[Hanakocz]

Originally posted by birdfoot:

Originally posted by Hanakocz:

Lvl 80 boost grants full set of celestial exotic gear. Therefore it is worth it to use the boost even if you already leveled up to 80 via normal play (good to do to learn the game), just to get the gear from the boost.

Oh, is the gear from lvl 80 boost account bound? I've never used the boosts before and there's 2 taking up my shared inventory slot which is kinda annoying. Have been wondering how to put them to some use instead of simply destroying them.

The exotic gear is soulbound, so you can use it only on character that opens the boost. So choose wisely.

There actually is fair amount of builds that can use celestial gear really well (usually hybrid or condition), so it is worth to get it up. You always can just fill second equipment template with it, and still use the power gear in the first one.
Oh and if you have 2 boosts, you can actually stack them both into same slot, getting the other shared slot free to use.

[Aicus]

Pretty sure the mechanist (engineer with mech pet) is like one of the best build in PvE content.

[Teratus]

Originally posted by Kodesh:

Originally posted by Teratus:

Specifically regarding Necromancer minions you must keep one thing in mind.

Necro Minions are a self sustain support utility, they are NOT a damage utility.

I have noticed that a lot of minion skills revolve around CC. The only 'pure' damage minion I see is the Bone Minion's Putrid Explosion--turning them more into walking bombs than fighting minions.

I can see CC being useful in small/large-scale PvP, but what about end-game instanced raids? Doe players actually care about CC and boon corruption in end-game raids/fractals? Or is the end-game all about raw DPS with nothing else mattering?

CC is useful in all aspects of the game, often in end game group content breaking a defiance bar (what CC does to bosses) is the difference between getting to do a ton of damage or getting smacked with a ton of damage lol
Condition cleansing and Boons are also very important in end game group content so you'll definitely see a lot of that at play there too.

That said I don't think Minions are particularly good for some end game content like raids.

As I said in my post Minions are largely a self sustaining support utility for you, they have little to no real group support function.
If you want to play support in that kind of content then you'll be expected to provide support to the whole group and not just yourself.
And as I also said Minions are not a DPS utility so if your playing DPS then minions are more likely to reduce your overall damage output than improve it.

In difficult group content, what strengths minions have like the ability to heal you and pull conditions off you etc are going to be covered by the support players in your group anyway so they won't really be needed all that much.

That said there are some minions that are useful in that content.
The explosive Bone Minions are one of the few ways Necromancers have of triggering Blast combos which can be useful.

For example if you detonate one in a Fire field it will give players around it the might boon, increasing their damage.
If you detonate one in a Water field it will heal players around it.
Detonating in a light field will cleanse conditions on nearby players.
And detonating in a dark field will blind all nearby enemies.

You can learn more about combo attacks here on the official wiki.
https://wiki.guildwars2.com/wiki/Combo
It's something the game doesn't really go out of it's way to teach you sadly but there are a lot of combo options that are worth learning to use.
I regularly make use of them when solo playing for additional healing, boons and CC on many builds.
Less so on Necromancer though admittedly due to their abundance of Dark Fields which I don't find much use using for combos.

But the main one you'll likely see most of all is the Elite skill Flesh Golem.
The on command charge skill this minion does is a big CC hit that can hit bosses multiple times doing a lot of damage to their defiance bar.

[CptnSpandex]

Problem is the thing that none of you here have addressed, beating around the bush does not help a new player understand that every time a new expansion comes out they nerf the crap out of the previous sub class to push you into using the new one for your class, 2 expansions ago they did just that for minion builds for necro, if you go minion now expect to struggle.

This by the way is why i no longer play this game, you will get to love you're build and then they will nerf it to hell to make you play a subclass you do not even like.

[SinisterSlay]

Originally posted by CptnSpandex:

Problem is the thing that none of you here have addressed, beating around the bush does not help a new player understand that every time a new expansion comes out they nerf the crap out of the previous sub class to push you into using the new one for your class, 2 expansions ago they did just that for minion builds for necro, if you go minion now expect to struggle.

This by the way is why i no longer play this game, you will get to love you're build and then they will nerf it to hell to make you play a subclass you do not even like.

Minion just got several boosts, including on steam release day

[CptnSpandex]

Originally posted by SinisterSlay:

Originally posted by CptnSpandex:

Problem is the thing that none of you here have addressed, beating around the bush does not help a new player understand that every time a new expansion comes out they nerf the crap out of the previous sub class to push you into using the new one for your class, 2 expansions ago they did just that for minion builds for necro, if you go minion now expect to struggle.

This by the way is why i no longer play this game, you will get to love you're build and then they will nerf it to hell to make you play a subclass you do not even like.

Minion just got several boosts, including on steam release day

Few years too late lol, loved my minion build and they screwed the pooch for me, got all my classes to max but it was no fun without my necro minion master.

[TwoTonTuna]

Originally posted by Teratus:

Originally posted by Kodesh:

I have noticed that a lot of minion skills revolve around CC. The only 'pure' damage minion I see is the Bone Minion's Putrid Explosion--turning them more into walking bombs than fighting minions.

I can see CC being useful in small/large-scale PvP, but what about end-game instanced raids? Doe players actually care about CC and boon corruption in end-game raids/fractals? Or is the end-game all about raw DPS with nothing else mattering?

CC is useful in all aspects of the game, often in end game group content breaking a defiance bar (what CC does to bosses) is the difference between getting to do a ton of damage or getting smacked with a ton of damage lol
Condition cleansing and Boons are also very important in end game group content so you'll definitely see a lot of that at play there too.
...
As I said in my post Minions are largely a self sustaining support utility for you, they have little to no real group support function.
If you want to play support in that kind of content then you'll be expected to provide support to the whole group and not just yourself.
And as I also said Minions are not a DPS utility so if your playing DPS then minions are more likely to reduce your overall damage output than improve it.
...
In difficult group content, what strengths minions have like the ability to heal you and pull conditions off you etc are going to be covered by the support players in your group anyway so they won't really be needed all that much.

That said there are some minions that are useful in that content.
The explosive Bone Minions are one of the few ways Necromancers have of triggering Blast combos which can be useful.
...
But the main one you'll likely see most of all is the Elite skill Flesh Golem.
The on command charge skill this minion does is a big CC hit that can hit bosses multiple times doing a lot of damage to their defiance bar.

Big thanks! Lots of information packed there that's useful for a nooblet like me.

I've also had time to level my necromancer to level 27. This on a trial account with no expansions purchased.

I noticed that minion builds work *really* well against a sustained mob of adds, like those events where mobs keep spawning every few seconds. Minions draw aggro, provide some CC, and can potentially create more minions once I unlock the last mastery I need in Death Magic specialization. Many adds also create life force like no tomorrow, allowing me to spam shroud skills like no tomorrow.

Against singular bosses with no adds though, I can see how the crit, condi, or support builds outperform the minion build.

[SinisterSlay]

Originally posted by Kodesh:

Originally posted by Teratus:

CC is useful in all aspects of the game, often in end game group content breaking a defiance bar (what CC does to bosses) is the difference between getting to do a ton of damage or getting smacked with a ton of damage lol
Condition cleansing and Boons are also very important in end game group content so you'll definitely see a lot of that at play there too.
...
As I said in my post Minions are largely a self sustaining support utility for you, they have little to no real group support function.
If you want to play support in that kind of content then you'll be expected to provide support to the whole group and not just yourself.
And as I also said Minions are not a DPS utility so if your playing DPS then minions are more likely to reduce your overall damage output than improve it.
...
In difficult group content, what strengths minions have like the ability to heal you and pull conditions off you etc are going to be covered by the support players in your group anyway so they won't really be needed all that much.

That said there are some minions that are useful in that content.
The explosive Bone Minions are one of the few ways Necromancers have of triggering Blast combos which can be useful.
...
But the main one you'll likely see most of all is the Elite skill Flesh Golem.
The on command charge skill this minion does is a big CC hit that can hit bosses multiple times doing a lot of damage to their defiance bar.

Big thanks! Lots of information packed there that's useful for a nooblet like me.

I've also had time to level my necromancer to level 27. This on a trial account with no expansions purchased.

I noticed that minion builds work *really* well against a sustained mob of adds, like those events where mobs keep spawning every few seconds. Minions draw aggro, provide some CC, and can potentially create more minions once I unlock the last mastery I need in Death Magic specialization. Many adds also create life force like no tomorrow, allowing me to spam shroud skills like no tomorrow.

Against singular bosses with no adds though, I can see how the crit, condi, or support builds outperform the minion build.

That's when you use the Reapers Rise! command to tag every enemy around you and create up to 10 more minions. Seriously, with the toughness boost to go with it. You can briefly field 20 minions at once. At that point Balthazar himself could land on you and do no damage.