Fake Game math?

[justin.pierson]

After putting in 60+ hours of runs and beating the first two boards I have noticed some things that make me question a lot of the game logic...
1. When it says you have 110% chance to get a magical item, shouldn't that be every single time not 20-30 that i am seeing even with that bonus.
2. A max 75% evasion should be on average 1-3 out of 4 hits should evade, I watched a group of mobs hit my rouge 10 times in a row with no evade, which seems like that number is useless. Yes this was after the magic shield was broken, which btw why is that a thing? I don't agree with that but whatever.
3. Attack speed boost? I noticed that sometimes the boost works fine, and other times it doesn't seem to fire, like you hit 3 times then the mob hits you then you hit 3 times and then the mob hits you twice and then you get one hit... math... fun times
4. How about some more buildings to say... reduce the damage you get instead of building a screen full of mud houses and upgrading all of those so you have enough slots...

Yes this is a rant... I have just put so much time and energy into all of this equipment, upgrading all the building, and planning the landscape only to get kill the 3rd boss and have its dog one shot me with 12 potions left over. *sigh* (and to make it worse, I rezzed and it hit me again, dead)

[Justice Potato]

A 100% increase in drop rate doesn't mean the drop rate is 100%, rather it's double the original. If the drop rate was 2% and you have a 100% increase that means you now how a 4% chance at getting an item.

Evasion works properly, but, judging by point 2 and 3 of your rant, it seems you're unaware of the existence of the stamina bar.

[Newbie Moontee Mk.I]

about 4.
there already one building that can reduce damage
and i do believe player can beat the game without supply items
so don't need to feel fatigued for the mud house and supply items
since so little every single supply items effect is
and need to stack a lots to be useful

[Sunderbrass]

I've had the same experience with Evasion during my 130 hours of play. Unless there is some hidden modifier that monsters have that negates some of your Evasion, it is not working properly. Certainly not at the expected percentage values.

Regarding Attack Speed, it does sound like you're running out of stamina. Which gives you a -70% Attack Speed modifier and cuts your Evasion in half.

The increased chance to get an item is a modifier to the base chance, not a flat bonus.

[>//The_FALCON]

1. When it says you have 110% chance to get a magical item, shouldn't that be every single time not 20-30 that i am seeing even with that bonus.

A: 110% chance of the base roll, which means it's a bit over doubled

2. A max 75% evasion should be on average 1-3 out of 4 hits should evade, I watched a group of mobs hit my rouge 10 times in a row with no evade, which seems like that number is useless. Yes this was after the magic shield was broken, which btw why is that a thing? I don't agree with that but whatever.

A: You have no idea how probability works. Go flip a coin 100 times and record every outcome. you will not see a perfectly balanced head tails split across all 100 flips

3. Attack speed boost? I noticed that sometimes the boost works fine, and other times it doesn't seem to fire, like you hit 3 times then the mob hits you then you hit 3 times and then the mob hits you twice and then you get one hit... math... fun times

A: 1. Did the mob decrease your attack speed with a debuff or even stop you from attacking at all? 2. did you run out of stamina? both of these will cause your attack speed to decrease



tl;dr - no fake math in the game, OP just doesn't know about logic

[justin.pierson]

Originally posted by Justice Potato:

A 100% increase in drop rate doesn't mean the drop rate is 100%, rather it's double the original. If the drop rate was 2% and you have a 100% increase that means you now how a 4% chance at getting an item.

Evasion works properly, but, judging by point 2 and 3 of your rant, it seems you're unaware of the existence of the stamina bar.

Ok good point, but that is not what is says, it says raises the chance to find a rare item by 10% so if it was 2% chance it should be 12% not 10% of 2%, which if that is the case (since I was ranting anyways) seems a stupid way to phrase that... not like you can see the original percentage to compare if it was a waste of a slot.

That was with a full stamina bar, on the first hit and attack speed was at 310% I see that happen a lot when there is a lot of mobs on the screen (4+)

[senitewolf]

Originally posted by justin.pierson:

After putting in 60+ hours of runs and beating the first two boards I have noticed some things that make me question a lot of the game logic...
1. When it says you have 110% chance to get a magical item, shouldn't that be every single time not 20-30 that i am seeing even with that bonus.
2. A max 75% evasion should be on average 1-3 out of 4 hits should evade, I watched a group of mobs hit my rouge 10 times in a row with no evade, which seems like that number is useless. Yes this was after the magic shield was broken, which btw why is that a thing? I don't agree with that but whatever.
3. Attack speed boost? I noticed that sometimes the boost works fine, and other times it doesn't seem to fire, like you hit 3 times then the mob hits you then you hit 3 times and then the mob hits you twice and then you get one hit... math... fun times
4. How about some more buildings to say... reduce the damage you get instead of building a screen full of mud houses and upgrading all of those so you have enough slots...

Yes this is a rant... I have just put so much time and energy into all of this equipment, upgrading all the building, and planning the landscape only to get kill the 3rd boss and have its dog one shot me with 12 potions left over. *sigh* (and to make it worse, I rezzed and it hit me again, dead)

1. As mentioned before, it is a 20% increase in finding an item, so if the base number is small a 100% increase means the resulting number is still small. Maths is indeed fun.

2. On average, yes. But as we established maths is fun and it would be highly weird if you would always dodge three out of four attacks. It would mean it is not random. Now given half a million people run this game and get attacked and have mobs of skeletons attack them it would be highly weird if you would never get strings where the virtual four-sided die would not roll a 1 several times in a row. Probability and all.

3. As mentioned before, there's a thing called stamina. Run out and Attack Speed goes down to original.

4. How about really understanding the basics of the game properly before suggesting changes? Not to mention there are ways you have in your camp to, you know, reduce incoming damage.

I know rants can be relieving and all and aren't always meant to be 100% correct, but maybe try to understand some basics first before writing together this far off?

[justin.pierson]

Originally posted by >//The_FALCONTnY:

1. When it says you have 110% chance to get a magical item, shouldn't that be every single time not 20-30 that i am seeing even with that bonus.

A: You have no idea how probability works. Go flip a coin 100 times and record every outcome. you will not see a perfectly balanced head tails split across all 100 flips

That's not true, over a long enough time period true random it will always balance it, the more you flip the more it becomes 50/50.

[Ryvak]

I've been noticing this too. I'm currently playing a loop with the "Buckler" trait, which states Every counterattack restores 1.5*loop hp. I'm not sure what the game considers the loop hp, is it the hp you get at camp or the hp per day you get from the meadows? Not that it matters, here's what i'm seeing. Camp hp heals for 30% of your heath bar. Right now my health bar on loop 14 is at 1356 so I receive 406.8hp when entering the camp. if this is considered loop hp then 406.8*1.5=610.2. Now my HP/day from meadows is 95. If this is the loop hp then 95*1.5=142.5. The actual number of hp i'm seeing on every 10th or so counterattack is 48. It's zero for most counterattacks. My counter percentage is currently at 15%. It would seem that the Buckler trait trigger is set closer this number, than the descriptions "every counterattack" would imply.

[>//The_FALCON]

Originally posted by justin.pierson:

Originally posted by >//The_FALCONTnY:

1. When it says you have 110% chance to get a magical item, shouldn't that be every single time not 20-30 that i am seeing even with that bonus.

A: You have no idea how probability works. Go flip a coin 100 times and record every outcome. you will not see a perfectly balanced head tails split across all 100 flips

That's not true, over a long enough time period true random it will always balance it, the more you flip the more it becomes 50/50.

That doesn't disprove the existence of chains of dodges/hits. it becomes 50/50 in terms of amount, not in terms of balance

[Leopanther]

Originally posted by Ryvak:

I've been noticing this too. I'm currently playing a loop with the "Buckler" trait, which states Every counterattack restores 1.5*loop hp. I'm not sure what the game considers the loop hp, is it the hp you get at camp or the hp per day you get from the meadows? Not that it matters, here's what i'm seeing. Camp hp heals for 30% of your heath bar. Right now my health bar on loop 14 is at 1356 so I receive 406.8hp when entering the camp. if this is considered loop hp then 406.8*1.5=610.2. Now my HP/day from meadows is 95. If this is the loop hp then 95*1.5=142.5. The actual number of hp i'm seeing on every 10th or so counterattack is 48. It's zero for most counterattacks. My counter percentage is currently at 15%. It would seem that the Buckler trait trigger is set closer this number, than the descriptions "every counterattack" would imply.

It's quite simply '1.5 x Loop' amount of HP. If you're on loop 5, thats '1.5 x 5' HP, so 7.5 HP.
On loop 10 it restores 15 HP per counter.

[taggedjc]

If something restores "1.5*loop HP" then the amount of HP you will recover is equal to "1.5*loop" so if you're on loop 14, that's 21 HP (plus however much you get back from vampirism and/or killing the enemy if you damage and/or kill them)

[audaxx]

don't drop out of school, kids.

[Ryvak]

Originally posted by taggedjc:

If something restores "1.5*loop HP" then the amount of HP you will recover is equal to "1.5*loop" so if you're on loop 14, that's 21 HP (plus however much you get back from vampirism and/or killing the enemy if you damage and/or kill them)

well, that makes the trait pretty useless. They need to make the wording clearer.

[Non-Slim Jim]

Originally posted by Ryvak:

well, that makes the trait pretty useless.

Not at all. A high counter rate will make it worthwhile.

[OOOOOOOOOOOOOOO]

Look up the difference between additive and multiplicative in regards to statistics. You are wrong on so many levels on how math works that it's pointless to point them out. You'll need to do your own research / Khan Academy to understand what you're missing.