“Effects do not stack”

[Sir Chaos]

I have been rather lucky with brass candlesticks and have accumulated some dozen of them. The lightposts specifically say that their own effects stack. It would be rather silly to have more than one if the damage doesn’t stack.

What does it mean? What effects are not stacking, exactly?

[Weyrling]

If it specifically says the effect doesn't stack, then it just doesn't stack?
The brass candlestick only has one effect, so it seems pretty straightforward to me.

[Dumbo3k]

But what exactly doesn't stack? Does it mean that multiple candlesticks don't stack? or that you don't get the damage bonus per multiple beacons/lanterns? or both?

[Seftak]

It is CLEARLY written you cannot have more than one candlestick bonus... So you get the bonus only once wheter you equip one or 12. And it is not written you get the bonus PER lantern, just that the bonus is active while in range of a lantern.

[Nasabot]

If it doesnt stack it goes against the concept of supplies.
You can have ~400 supplies in theory, but only 1 candlestick? Makes sense!

[Ray]

aye its very silly that once you get one, every future one is effectively worthless. its confirmed that it doesn't stack in supplies when you click on the top left button to see total stats gained from supplies; it never goes over 5%.

[Seftak]

I guess they can been seen as orbs. Just scrap them.

[Sir Chaos]

It could be clearer. So these extra candlesticks are waste.

[Seftak]

Originally posted by Sir Chaos:

It could be clearer. So these extra candlesticks are waste.

It couldn't be any clearer though, EFFECT DOES NOT STACK is pretty straight forward...

[glythe]

The lumberjack axe and the rare book also do not stack.

Every other item seems to stack.

[Dusk_Army]

Originally posted by Seftak:

Originally posted by Sir Chaos:

It could be clearer. So these extra candlesticks are waste.

It couldn't be any clearer though, EFFECT DOES NOT STACK is pretty straight forward...

Actually, speaking from the perspective of a designer, it's not clear. There's at least three ways it can be interpreted:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

Since nearly every other supply item does stack if you equip multiples, the player naturally assumes that the developers meant option 1, not option 2 or 3. It should be changed to "multiple Candlesticks do not stack", or "multiple Candlesticks and overlapping roadside tiles do not stack".

[Weyrling]

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

Originally posted by Seftak:

It couldn't be any clearer though, EFFECT DOES NOT STACK is pretty straight forward...

Actually, speaking from the perspective of a designer, it's not clear. There's at least three ways it can be interpreted:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

Since nearly every other supply item does stack if you equip multiples, the player naturally assumes that the developers meant option 1, not option 2 or 3. It should be changed to "multiple Candlesticks do not stack", or "multiple Candlesticks and overlapping roadside tiles do not stack".

If you consider it from an 'effects are actual things' perspective, it's perfectly clear.
IE, It applies the effect 'do 5% more damage' only one time, conditional to being within range of a lantern or beacon.

[Seftak]

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

Originally posted by Seftak:

It couldn't be any clearer though, EFFECT DOES NOT STACK is pretty straight forward...

Actually, speaking from the perspective of a designer, it's not clear. There's at least three ways it can be interpreted:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

Since nearly every other supply item does stack if you equip multiples, the player naturally assumes that the developers meant option 1, not option 2 or 3. It should be changed to "multiple Candlesticks do not stack", or "multiple Candlesticks and overlapping roadside tiles do not stack".

If it were written "you will only get bonus from one candlestick" or "only one lantern at a time will activate the effect" you would be right to question if there are other ways to stack the effect

But it is clear as water.
EFFECT
DOES
NOT
STACK

They do not have to list everytime the effect doesn't stack if it doesn't stack EVER.

[Dusk_Army]

Originally posted by Seftak:

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

Actually, speaking from the perspective of a designer, it's not clear. There's at least three ways it can be interpreted:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

Since nearly every other supply item does stack if you equip multiples, the player naturally assumes that the developers meant option 1, not option 2 or 3. It should be changed to "multiple Candlesticks do not stack", or "multiple Candlesticks and overlapping roadside tiles do not stack".

If it were written "you will only get bonus from one candlestick" or "only one lantern at a time will activate the effect" you would be right to question if there are other ways to stack the effect

But it is clear as water.
EFFECT
DOES
NOT
STACK

They do not have to list everytime the effect doesn't stack if it doesn't stack EVER.

You are clearly someone who has never played a tabletop game in his life. The intent is not "perfectly" clear. In fact, if it were written either of the two ways you mentioned, I would not question it at all; those are both "perfectly" clear as to what they mean.

If this effect were written, exactly as it is, on a card in a physical card game, you can bet that there would be arguments at the table over exactly what it means. Yes, the computer knows exactly what's supposed to happen, but contrary to what you believe, it is not clear enough to the player. If it were, this discussion would never have been opened in the first place.

Also, have you tried not getting angry over a person disagreeing with you? I was pretty polite, but you're kind of "shouting" at me with that text, and it's making me respond with bitter sarcasm.

[Morphic]

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

You are clearly someone who has never played a tabletop game in his life. The intent is not "perfectly" clear. In fact, if it were written either of the two ways you mentioned, I would not question it at all; those are both "perfectly" clear as to what they mean.

It is rather clear. Not explicitly so, but still clear. As you deduced earlier, there really is only three possible options for the Candlestick's interaction.

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

As "effects" is plural it should be clear that option 1 is invalid. Which leaves only option 2 in question. This is where I understand confusion for many players since, save for rare exceptions, Camp Items stack. However, one can easily check the effect by equipping multiple Candlesticks, then navigating to the total applied effects screen to see if the % has increased. It does not increase.

Thus, option 3 is the correct interaction. Again, it may not be explicitly clear but it is clear enough that one can deduce the interaction. Then, thanks to in-game interface, one can quickly/easily check that interaction. IMO, this discussion tends to come up because people did not check the total effects screen and simply think multiple Candlesticks stack like nearly everything else.

It's like when people used to argue about Creature Board interactions in MTG. Like for Creatures that had "Can not be Targeted" effects. If I play Wraith of God, which states "Destroys all Creatures"... even though your Creature can't be targeted, it is still destroyed by Wraith of God since it does not need a Target as implied by "all". Though I think a more apt comparison is when Planeswalker cards first came out. A lot of people argued cards with "[...] each/all opponents." should affect Planeswalkers as well. Reading the little rulebook that came with a Planeswalker, one can logically deduce that Planeswalkers would be counted as an opponent. It is not explicitly stated but the descriptions imply that. (Though later errata was added to make this clearer: they are treated as opponents)

TLDR: It is rather clear and easy/quick to check if it stacks. That said, I understand the confusion some are having with the description as other descriptions are not explicitly clear.(See "HP as in heals or +Max?!?!" discussions) Though, this does beg the question of Candlesticks use/balance. It is one of the very rare items that doesn't stack in any capacity. So why use it in the first place? 5% is a nice bonus but compared to other Camp Items it is, IMO, dumb. I would have like to see it stack with other Candlesticks as with other items. Granted getting ~50+% to damage gets to be insane, you are sacrificing slots for other items/utility.

[Dusk_Army]

Originally posted by Morphic:

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

You are clearly someone who has never played a tabletop game in his life. The intent is not "perfectly" clear. In fact, if it were written either of the two ways you mentioned, I would not question it at all; those are both "perfectly" clear as to what they mean.

It is rather clear. Not explicitly so, but still clear. As you deduced earlier, there really is only three possible options for the Candlestick's interaction.

Originally posted by Dusk_Army:

1) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you are within range of multiple Beacons and Lanterns
2) The bonus from Candlestick is not applied twice or more if you have more than one Candlestick equipped
3) Both 1 and 2.

As "effects" is plural it should be clear that option 1 is invalid. Which leaves only option 2 in question. This is where I understand confusion for many players since, save for rare exceptions, Camp Items stack. However, one can easily check the effect by equipping multiple Candlesticks, then navigating to the total applied effects screen to see if the % has increased. It does not increase.

Thus, option 3 is the correct interaction. Again, it may not be explicitly clear but it is clear enough that one can deduce the interaction. Then, thanks to in-game interface, one can quickly/easily check that interaction. IMO, this discussion tends to come up because people did not check the total effects screen and simply think multiple Candlesticks stack like nearly everything else.

It's like when people used to argue about Creature Board interactions in MTG. Like for Creatures that had "Can not be Targeted" effects. If I play Wraith of God, which states "Destroys all Creatures"... even though your Creature can't be targeted, it is still destroyed by Wraith of God since it does not need a Target as implied by "all". Though I think a more apt comparison is when Planeswalker cards first came out. A lot of people argued cards with "[...] each/all opponents." should affect Planeswalkers as well. Reading the little rulebook that came with a Planeswalker, one can logically deduce that Planeswalkers would be counted as an opponent. It is not explicitly stated but the descriptions imply that. (Though later errata was added to make this clearer: they are treated as opponents)

TLDR: It is rather clear and easy/quick to check if it stacks. That said, I understand the confusion some are having with the description as other descriptions are not explicitly clear.(See "HP as in heals or +Max?!?!" discussions) Though, this does beg the question of Candlesticks use/balance. It is one of the very rare items that doesn't stack in any capacity. So why use it in the first place? 5% is a nice bonus but compared to other Camp Items it is, IMO, dumb. I would have like to see it stack with other Candlesticks as with other items. Granted getting ~50+% to damage gets to be insane, you are sacrificing slots for other items/utility.

Thank you, that's a much more explicit way of saying what I meant.