Fleet Resupply via Cargos and Oilers?

[cap]

What would people think about merchant ships having this ability? Perhaps make it consume supplies or something.

I think it would be neat to have more resupply convoys moving around the map, or to perhaps deploy one or two merchant ships as submarine tenders.

[cswiger]

Yes, I'd like to see a few more types of merchant vessels in support and auxiliary roles.

Some of the IJN merchants were indeed refitted as fleet supply vessels and even seaplane tenders (Kamikawa Marus), making them into light escort carriers.

As for the USN, the Hog Island / Design 1024 class included the AS-10 Argonne, which was a sub tender and later used as flagship for Adm. Ghormley during Operation Watchtower.

[JazzObserver127]

The Cimmarons and Nippon Maru are good fleet replenishment oilers. The C2 and C3 are good ammunition ships.

[Johan217]

I think it is an excellent idea, because my ships tend o be out of ammo after any significant engagement.

[cap]

Originally posted by cswiger:

Yes, I'd like to see a few more types of merchant vessels in support and auxiliary roles.

Some of the IJN merchants were indeed refitted as fleet supply vessels and even seaplane tenders (Kamikawa Marus), making them into light escort carriers.

As for the USN, the Hog Island / Design 1024 class included the AS-10 Argonne, which was a sub tender and later used as flagship for Adm. Ghormley during Operation Watchtower.

Yes! I was thinking the same thing. Having more auxiliary and logistics type craft would be awesome.

On that note, one or two corvette/destroyer escort type type craft for convoy ASW and maybe some escort carriers would be great as well.

[byepopejoy]

I think refueling ships at sea is a good idea provided the game starts tracking fuel consumption, since it had a significant effect on fleet operations - you never knew when your CV task force would be pulling out of the line to refuel its destroyers.

I'm not so sure about ammunition, since the US Navy didn't really start using underway replenishment of ammunition until 1945. In the meantime, your best bet is to build a port up into a forward base you can use to replenish your supplies.

I use Shortlands when playing as the IJN and the Rennell Island if I need a forward base as the USN, but I don't need a forward base that much as the USN given the force disparity between IJN and USN.

[Johan217]

Originally posted by byepopejoy:

I'm not so sure about ammunition, since the US Navy didn't really start using underway replenishment of ammunition until 1945.

Interesting, I did not know that. In that case, I'm OK with no ammo resupply at sea.

About smaller vessels: If these are added, I would like to see them implemented as a fixed attachment (e.g. 2 corvettes and a minesweeper) to a transport fleet, at an extra cost. At the same time, the armament of the transports themselves should be severely reduced.

[boris.glevrk]

A lot of ships can't really replenish ammo at sea IIRC. Like... subs. Craning in the torpedoes in harbor is already painful as it is, but doing it in high seas?

Likewise I don't think large caliber ammo can do that. I'm not sure how battleships replenish their ammo, but you can't just crane a proper BB shell to the deck and expect people to carry them inside by hand. (my best guess is there's a hatch in the turret roof or on the deck, and the ammo has to be craned in all the way to the battery, just like torpedoes on submarines)

[kf.*****]

I have my doubts, especially in the game period of the campaign anyone except the German Fleet refuelled at sea, as for re-arming they definitely didn't. The IJN Navy did have some ability at Midway for instance and Possibly US fleet, but these required perfect conditions and probably anchored of a small island. The procedure would take some time as well with ships anchored, again I think only the German fleet had developed refuelling at sea, not anchored. Note: We are talking about refuelling, which we actually have no limit at the moment, without we should have to return to port, just like aircraft have to return to base,. Re-arming requires ships being anchored off shore for several hours if not a day plus. Only small arms would be possible at sea, not anchored. Possibly torpedoes and small guns maybe possible, however supply ships will them selves need to replenish, they should not have unlimited supplies. As for supplying light cruisers and above this would be to complicated and dangerous except in port.

Saying that we don't have operational limits on Aircraft at the moment, the IJM subs should only be able to launch/recover in sea conditions 1-3, float plane recovery on other ships should be limited to possibly 4 or 5, while flat tops should be limited to 6.

I would also say using the replenish option should take a day to 3 days depending on the type of ships.

[byepopejoy]

Originally posted by kf.*****:

I have my doubts, especially in the game period of the campaign anyone except the German Fleet refuelled at sea, as for re-arming they definitely didn't. The IJN Navy did have some ability at Midway for instance and Possibly US fleet, but these required perfect conditions and probably anchored of a small island. The procedure would take some time as well with ships anchored, again I think only the German fleet had developed refuelling at sea, not anchored.

Actually, the US Navy developed at-sea refueling in the late 1930's and it was a standard part of fleet logistics by the start of WW2 - the Cimarron-class tanker in the game was designed for underway refueling.

There's a detailed history here[www.history.navy.mil] if you'd like to learn the full story.

[SeeSeeBee]

i wholeheartedly endorse this idea, also carrier planes should also be able to fly straight to their assigned carrier instead of having the carrier return to port to take in new planes. after all ... planes fly dont they? coupled with the resupply ships carrying the extra equipments and personal belongings for them pilots this should also be allowed.

[Drydock Dreams Games]

Originally posted by kf.*****:

I have my doubts, especially in the game period of the campaign anyone except the German Fleet refuelled at sea, as for re-arming they definitely didn't. The IJN Navy did have some ability at Midway for instance and Possibly US fleet, but these required perfect conditions and probably anchored of a small island. The procedure would take some time as well with ships anchored, again I think only the German fleet had developed refuelling at sea, not anchored.

Underway refueling was taking place on both sides routinely during operations actually :)
Either from oilers or between ships of the same task force when destroyers needed to top off. Obviously it did require some place safe and some time to be accomplished, but it was done at sea. Loads of stories about refueling coming up too early/going wrong/being dearly needed (for instance Takagi's cursed refueling attempts before Coral Sea, or Fletcher getting criticized by some for being too careful regarding his fuel situation)

[kf.*****]

Originally posted by Drydock Dreams Games:

Originally posted by kf.*****:

I have my doubts, especially in the game period of the campaign anyone except the German Fleet refuelled at sea, as for re-arming they definitely didn't. The IJN Navy did have some ability at Midway for instance and Possibly US fleet, but these required perfect conditions and probably anchored of a small island. The procedure would take some time as well with ships anchored, again I think only the German fleet had developed refuelling at sea, not anchored.

Underway refueling was taking place on both sides routinely during operations actually :)
Either from oilers or between ships of the same task force when destroyers needed to top off. Obviously it did require some place safe and some time to be accomplished, but it was done at sea. Loads of stories about refueling coming up too early/going wrong/being dearly needed (for instance Takagi's cursed refueling attempts before Coral Sea, or Fletcher getting criticized by some for being too careful regarding his fuel situation)

I stand corrected on refuelling, but as I said that is refuelling and currently ships have unlimited fuel so there is little point unless this changes. However it is key to note this was not re-arming which is what people are effectively asking for,

[Benlexlin]

Originally posted by boris.glevrk:

A lot of ships can't really replenish ammo at sea IIRC. Like... subs. Craning in the torpedoes in harbor is already painful as it is, but doing it in high seas?

Likewise I don't think large caliber ammo can do that. I'm not sure how battleships replenish their ammo, but you can't just crane a proper BB shell to the deck and expect people to carry them inside by hand. (my best guess is there's a hatch in the turret roof or on the deck, and the ammo has to be craned in all the way to the battery, just like torpedoes on submarines)

Interesting that you say that because Japan actually have a dedicated submarine resupply ship called submarine motherships (I don't know whether that's the official English name but it would be the direct translation from Japanese) although most of them were converted into aircraft carriers after midway.

[SumatranRatMonkey]

As long as it's a game option I would be fine with fleet fuel. The thing is, it could be one of those things that sound awesome but actually is just tedious micro. If anyone has ever played War in the Pacific you know what I am talking about.

Rearming at sea would be cool since ammo is something you already happily spend doing something fun (destroying enemy ships).

[Markus1987]

Originally posted by InfluxOfGoats:

As long as it's a game option I would be fine with fleet fuel. The thing is, it could be one of those things that sound awesome but actually is just tedious micro. If anyone has ever played War in the Pacific you know what I am talking about.

Rearming at sea would be cool since ammo is something you already happily spend doing something fun (destroying enemy ships).

I remember that the lack of fuel in Thunder at Sea (campaign simulator for Fighting Steel) meant that the units that were affected could only run at a maximum of 10 knots, even in the battles.