SPOILERS AHEAD: Good ending question

[twk]

Is there any possible ways of saving Dakota from death by this phoney ass Arturo?[/spoilers] Aren't traits supposed to shape the ending?

[DarkSpiral]

I honestly thought this was spelled out pretty clearly by the game but:

The traits you earn during gameplay decide which ending you get; the exact events of that ending are not determined by you beyond that point.

[margifish]

Actually there are certain choices you make in the game that determine whether you get the 'good' ending or 'bad' ending....I think it's whichever end your choices have pushed over the line (like 3 choices for one ending and two for another will result you getting that end). Because those key choices shape Julia's outlook and determine what path she pursues in the end. As for your question, sadly no. But it's the consequence of her choice. Julia can choose to be true to herself (the 'bad' ending), or she can choose to be a good member of her clan, a good Lasombra (the 'good' ending).

[TheLostOne(JamilNielsen)]

Firstly i found it interesting how good ending is "sacrifice humanity for power" and bad ending is "abandon power for Peace of self/or whatever"
anyway, Basically Bad ending is you making up with girlfriend and finding a better cause to fight for.
at the end of the day i'd still say Bad ending was the good ending, reason being that the ultimate fight a vampire has is fighting "The Beast" basically maintaining your sense of self.
but yea, very interesting.

[Midnight77]

I don't know if this matters or not but on one night you get a choice of 2 missions. One is to sort things out with Dakota and another is a reporter lady. Since I knew Dakota was going to be a dead end for the good end I went with the reporter lady. This immediately lead me to Tamika. Without this option you won't pick up a trait and it leads to Torque as well. Not sure if you could have done the "sort things out" and then did this one but the reporter mission which leads to Tamika is very important to get all the answers you were looking for.

[vasex90]

Good ending: not Camarilla dog + Agathon dead + time to be aggressive + lie to Torque + no torture. A couple of mistakes are allowed. The good ending has much more info and new arts than the bad one. Good ending + Bad ending = the Moon and the Sun.
The whole game I was thinking that Dakota is the ghost ))

[twk]

Originally posted by vasex90:

Good ending: not Camarilla dog + Agathon dead + time to be aggressive + lie to Torque + no torture. A couple of mistakes are allowed. The good ending has much more info and new arts than the bad one. Good ending + Bad ending = the Moon and the Sun.
The whole game I was thinking that Dakota is the ghost ))

i've got good ending with every "humanly" traits, but the last one, torturing of Kaiser was determinng one. It made Julie a monster, i think, that capable of getting to her desires by any means.

[Amygdala]

Does Arturo actually do it? The way she spoke of "having planned ahead" and the cut to a shocked Dakota I assume Julia murdered Dakota herself, or ran her out of the city or something

[twk]

Originally posted by Amygdala:

Does Arturo actually do it? The way she spoke of "having planned ahead" and the cut to a shocked Dakota I assume Julia murdered Dakota herself, or ran her out of the city or something

no, qadir did it.

[Midnight77]

SPOILERS- NOT GONNA COVER EM THIS TIME

I finished the game with all 5 traits and the good ending. Ultimately the good ending is about rising from the ashes because she is stuck in a vampiric system with no progression and no future. She is treated like a dog and nobody even notices her when she is a vamp. She will never go anywhere. Julie at the beginning starts her journey if you tried to shoot the vamp lady in the subway near the beginning. Her response to you taking the shot is impressed and she told her this is where she needed to start to survive what was to come. It's this transformation basically into her dark side to become ruthless and rise to the top and make something of herself. Dakota is mentioned by a friend in a flashback that Dakota would eventually use Julie up to the point that she would leave her. Dakota already had one foot out the door anyways because she had slept with someone. It may have even been for a good while so Julie had been used. Julie comes to the realization that she needs someone better in her life for a real relationship to grow so she dumps Dakota. I understand the whole "final step into darkness" bit was doing Dakota in but honestly she had already left. It would have made more sense if she agreed to Qadir going back to her place to do the deed knowing full well Dakota was gone and would never be found so she wouldn't actually do this final act. It just didn't sit right with me that they did in fact hunt her down and did her in. It just seemed needless. The most interesting thing about all this is peeling back a layer at the beginning......She was all about getting the truth out to the public and lambasted her boss because he was a sellout with the corporate shills above him for caving into the big corporate who wanted the story buried. She turns into a vamp and then she actually does the very thing she was detested by at the beginning - she sold out. She had the biggest story that would have exposed and buried them all. Instead, she sinks the story and creates a narrative for everyone to wash their hands with. Her reward is a powerful seat at the table. She ultimately becomes the very evil that she fought against when she was a human. I hope a lot of people really "got that" at the ending. To me that was the most important takeaway from playing the game.

[Bloodartist]

Originally posted by Midnight77:

SPOILERS- NOT GONNA COVER EM THIS TIME

I finished the game with all 5 traits and the good ending. Ultimately the good ending is about rising from the ashes because she is stuck in a vampiric system with no progression and no future. She is treated like a dog and nobody even notices her when she is a vamp.

The actual ♥♥♥♥? If you call being in primogen council "no progression and no future" you don't know a thing about vampire the masquerade.

She achieved a major position in the citys "vampiric system", something that rarely happens. Don't forget that characters like Arturo, Sophie, etc are ALSO primogens. She is on equal footing with them. This is far more major character progression than in coteries.

Now her selling her own values, that is more valid criticism. But I guess that's the intended duality of the endings.

[Midnight77]

Originally posted by Bloodartist:

Originally posted by Midnight77:

SPOILERS- NOT GONNA COVER EM THIS TIME

I finished the game with all 5 traits and the good ending. Ultimately the good ending is about rising from the ashes because she is stuck in a vampiric system with no progression and no future. She is treated like a dog and nobody even notices her when she is a vamp.

The actual ♥♥♥♥? If you call being in primogen council "no progression and no future" you don't know a thing about vampire the masquerade.

She achieved a major position in the citys "vampiric system", something that rarely happens. Don't forget that characters like Arturo, Sophie, etc are ALSO primogens. She is on equal footing with them. This is far more major character progression than in coteries.

Now her selling her own values, that is more valid criticism. But I guess that's the intended duality of the endings.

If working out of a sleazy burger joint just to take role call and be ignored by everyone is the height of a major position then it's your opinion and more power to you Bloodartist. Not going to argue with you about it.

[Bloodartist]

Originally posted by Midnight77:

If working out of a sleazy burger joint just to take role call and be ignored by everyone is the height of a major position then it's your opinion and more power to you Bloodartist. Not going to argue with you about it.

Being in the burger joint was
a.) her happy place
b.) BEFORE her transition to primogen council. She achieves the primogenship at the very end, in the "good" ending.

Sounds like you havent even played the game.

[Midnight77]

Originally posted by Bloodartist:

Originally posted by Midnight77:

If working out of a sleazy burger joint just to take role call and be ignored by everyone is the height of a major position then it's your opinion and more power to you Bloodartist. Not going to argue with you about it.

Being in the burger joint was
a.) her happy place
b.) BEFORE her transition to primogen council. She achieves the primogenship at the very end, in the "good" ending.

Sounds like you havent even played the game.

She sure wasn't overjoyed to me to be there but..... not going to argue with you about it. :)