Armor system is interesting but reduces action.

[edmiester777]

The new title was definitely long-awaited but wish some aspects would've stayed similar. I liked having regenerating armor in prior title, allowing for more action-packed sequences and less hiding. I get what they were trying to do with this game but just feels like armor is the treated almost the same as health at this point.

Are there any builds that would help me feel less squishy? or do i need to wait till im level 38 to get better armor?

[The Spu]

bringing an armor bag deployable or favor can help a lot, and you can do both of those from level 1. The armor skill tree is also probably one of the best in the game right now, so it's worth researching right away. From my understanding, the different vests act more like overall % damage reduction and break points rather than improve the regen speed of armor, so you may actually have a better time with lighter armor that lets you move to cover faster.

[Greb]

There are skills which make getting armour back easier, like regenerating it when picking up ammo drops. It'll take a bit of tinkering and unlocking before you really start being able to "play" this game, I'd say.

Sorta like how Payday 2 never felt "proper" until you were like at least Infamy IV and had the discount on skill point costs, if you know what I mean?

I'm not sure what to think about armour and health so far. It does change up some stuff, which I'm going to have to force myself to stop doing, such as dipping in and out of cover willy-nilly, lol. It's not a good idea to just shrug and say "oh well!" to take damage while moving around. You certainly don't want to play chicken with snipers any more too.

Problem is the cops don't seem to care much about self preservation again, it's good for the player but the cops don't seem concerned. At least from what I've seen, they can rush you and so long as they do some damage, they'll grind you down now. They don't swarm you like Payday 2 which is nice, but at the same time they don't seem bothered about dying either.

It's a lot harder, which is good. I can't really weigh in on the subject properly without more experience though, it could be that the game becomes really easy once you unlock more guns and more skills.

But hey, at least the Bulldozer is back to being a big scary monster now. It's a shame he's not green anymore, though.

[Mordtziel]

bringing an armor bag deployable or favor can help a lot, and you can do both of those from level 1.

Armor bag deployable is currently unlocked at like level 12 or something. Supposed to be level 2 according to the game.

the different vests act more like overall % damage reduction rather than improve the regen speed of armor, so you may actually have a better time with lighter armor that lets you move to cover faster.

Each Armor Vest grants an additional armor chunk while reducing your movement speed slightly.

Are there any builds that would help me feel less squishy? or do i need to wait till im level 38 to get better armor?

You'll never become a one man army that can stand out in the open. Best you can do is grab the tank tree and maintain Grit while making sure to not take too much damage regularly using cover and being quick on the draw.

[Karnage]

Originally posted by Mordtziel:

bringing an armor bag deployable or favor can help a lot, and you can do both of those from level 1.

Armor bag deployable is currently unlocked at like level 12 or something. Supposed to be level 2 according to the game.

the different vests act more like overall % damage reduction rather than improve the regen speed of armor, so you may actually have a better time with lighter armor that lets you move to cover faster.

Each Armor Vest grants an additional armor chunk while reducing your movement speed slightly.

Are there any builds that would help me feel less squishy? or do i need to wait till im level 38 to get better armor?

You'll never become a one man army that can stand out in the open. Best you can do is grab the tank tree and maintain Grit while making sure to not take too much damage regularly using cover and being quick on the draw.

Uh? I had armor bags at level 2. And it's worth noting that you start at level 2 if you do the tutorials. Each section gives you a quarter of a level.

[edmiester777]

Originally posted by Greb:

There are skills which make getting armour back easier, like regenerating it when picking up ammo drops. It'll take a bit of tinkering and unlocking before you really start being able to "play" this game, I'd say.

Sorta like how Payday 2 never felt "proper" until you were like at least Infamy IV and had the discount on skill point costs, if you know what I mean?

I'm not sure what to think about armour and health so far. It does change up some stuff, which I'm going to have to force myself to stop doing, such as dipping in and out of cover willy-nilly, lol. It's not a good idea to just shrug and say "oh well!" to take damage while moving around. You certainly don't want to play chicken with snipers any more too.

Problem is the cops don't seem to care much about self preservation again, it's good for the player but the cops don't seem concerned. At least from what I've seen, they can rush you and so long as they do some damage, they'll grind you down now. They don't swarm you like Payday 2 which is nice, but at the same time they don't seem bothered about dying either.

It's a lot harder, which is good. I can't really weigh in on the subject properly without more experience though, it could be that the game becomes really easy once you unlock more guns and more skills.

But hey, at least the Bulldozer is back to being a big scary monster now. It's a shame he's not green anymore, though.

This is fair, maybe I just haven't given the game enough of a chance as of yet. It's definitely more difficult than 2, and possibly I just wasn't ready for that. I'll play a bit more and sink more skills into some trees but I hope they do bring back some amount of regen so I can feel like a one man army again.

[Cryptic]

It causes you to actually use cover. I love that

[Mordtziel]

Uh? I had armor bags at level 2. And it's worth noting that you start at level 2 if you do the tutorials. Each section gives you a quarter of a level.

You can look back here on the forums and see people talking about how it wasn't unlocking until level 12 (it was the same for me). Unlocks have certainly been bugged a bit. And given what I've seen around here, people advise against doing the tutorials

[Karnage]

Originally posted by Mordtziel:

Uh? I had armor bags at level 2. And it's worth noting that you start at level 2 if you do the tutorials. Each section gives you a quarter of a level.

You can look back here on the forums and see people talking about how it wasn't unlocking until level 12 (it was the same for me). Unlocks have certainly been bugged a bit. And given what I've seen around here, people advise against doing the tutorials

Seems like doing the tutorials helped me not get bugged out then. lol

[Coldflame]

sustaining damage having a resource cost makes the gameplay way more interesting, there's an incentive to avoid confronting cops needlessly

with the significant reduction to objectives that are pure 'waiting' compared to pd2 it works well

[The Spu]

Originally posted by Coldflame:

sustaining damage having a resource cost makes the gameplay way more interesting, there's an incentive to avoid confronting cops needlessly

with the significant reduction to objectives that are pure 'waiting' compared to pd2 it works well

Yes, I like Shade's voice line during the armored transport heist that sawing through the door would take too long The saws and drills in the payday universe are really all useless.

[Cryptic]

I put poop in the armor for extra protection. I eat lots of iron. 🤡

No but seriously armor up. It's everything here

[Will4%IfPig]

I love all these people that clearly played payday 2 on very hard. The new armor system rewards boring gameplay. Payday 2 was always about risk reward. Payday 3 encourages you to actively avoid what should be the main draw of the game. Combat.

[Mordtziel]

Originally posted by YT:@LackingXL:

I love all these people that clearly played payday 2 on very hard. The new armor system rewards boring gameplay. Payday 2 was always about risk reward. Payday 3 encourages you to actively avoid what should be the main draw of the game. Combat.

Payday 3 wants you to avoid standing in the middle of the street and murdering hundreds like a swarm shooter with effectively infinite hp and instead use the myriad of cover to be found in every heist from vehicles to doors while murdering a few dozen like a tactical shooter with quite finite amounts of hp.

I'm sure once the modding scene gets underway someone will come along and make one that lets you once again become an unkillable god that has no need for think. Like allowing ammo drops to recover armor chunks instead of just armor or just allowing passive armor regen through skill reworks or whatever.

[looking for gurl]

i dont use armor since the one i equip is strongest so rarely run out of armor or need to replinish

[edmiester777]

Originally posted by Mordtziel:

Originally posted by YT:@LackingXL:

I love all these people that clearly played payday 2 on very hard. The new armor system rewards boring gameplay. Payday 2 was always about risk reward. Payday 3 encourages you to actively avoid what should be the main draw of the game. Combat.

Payday 3 wants you to avoid standing in the middle of the street and murdering hundreds like a swarm shooter with effectively infinite hp and instead use the myriad of cover to be found in every heist from vehicles to doors while murdering a few dozen like a tactical shooter with quite finite amounts of hp.

I'm sure once the modding scene gets underway someone will come along and make one that lets you once again become an unkillable god that has no need for think. Like allowing ammo drops to recover armor chunks instead of just armor or just allowing passive armor regen through skill reworks or whatever.

Yeah I think it's fair that people see the old payday 2 metas as less-tactical, but IMO I liked that about PD2. All the modifiers (like hydras) made it impressively difficult even when you had builds to regen a lot of health/armor.

And honestly I can respect the balance of the new skill trees, but there are several issues that I've noted in my first 10 or so hours (maybe these will change with time)

1. Regarding balanced skill trees - yes they feel more balanced, where you cannot as easily cheese the game to become a demigod murder machine, but I think the PD2 community kinda liked the cheese
2. The tactical shooter style of gameplay is apparent, but the AI still behaves as if you were playing the PD2 style swarm shooter. The cops, while having more sophisticated behaviors, still ultimately rush you with no fear of death, pinning you into corners.
3. A huge focus on graphic fidelity with a lack of focus on replay-ability. I know this may be controversial, but every match I play feels the exact same as every other ones. The skills you stack don't have enough of an effect on gameplay for me to get excited about experimenting with different builds.

That being said, these are opinions of someone who prefers chaos-fueled loud gameplay. It does appear that the stealth in this game is much more comprehensive and probably a lot of fun for players who prefer that route.