Honestly, game stops being fun when you realize it's massively unfair.

[saddler93]

Inb4 git gud but that's what I think. As fun as it gets early on, game gets unfair really fast at rift 10+. Everything has either 3-4 full resistances or has 3/4th map's range. As cool as spells and passives are, not many of them can face the absolute chaos that becomes the game later on.

I hope I'm on the wrong and everybody's enjoying it, but it's gotten to the point where i'm just not having fun trying spells since more than half of them do very little.
It's either "stun everything so you don't instantly die" or "stun that so you don't instantly die".

[eb]

Wrong on every account, the wizard is incredibly op, there are dozens if not hundreds of viable builds, and the game is actually easier than the average roguelike.

[Weekend Player]

The game is a fun puzzle once you figure out which spells/upgrades enable a build. The problem is as big as the spell/skill lists are it seems there are only a handful of spells (deathcleave/restless dead/ghost ball/mega annihilate) that if you don't have at least one of in a build, it doesnt work. Or at least I haven't figured out builds that don't need one of those.

Don't get me wrong, game is still a lot of fun for many hours. But many other spells need to be balanced to scale better + monsters having multiple immunities needs to go. That would make a lot more builds viable and increase game replayability.

[eb]

Originally posted by Intropik:

The game is a fun puzzle once you figure out which spells/upgrades enable a build. The problem is as big as the spell/skill lists are it seems there are only a handful of spells (deathcleave/restless dead/ghost ball/mega annihilate) that if you don't have at least one of in a build, it doesnt work. Or at least I haven't figured out builds that don't need one of those.

Don't get me wrong, game is still a lot of fun for many hours. But many other spells need to be balanced to scale better + monsters having multiple immunities needs to go. That would make a lot more builds viable and increase game replayability.

You don't need any of those spells you mentioned to win, pretty much every spell scales to absurd levels with the right skills, and removing immunities would destroy the game because then you could just do whatever and win, and at that point why would anyone bother?

[eb]

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/887800332816629820/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/886747745866625034/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885991087783677952/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885771764112707635/char_sheet.png

just the four latest wins I bothered posting to the discord. wow look at all that death cleave/restless dead/ghostball/mega annihilate. no build variety at all amirite

[Weekend Player]

Originally posted by eb:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/887800332816629820/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/886747745866625034/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885991087783677952/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885771764112707635/char_sheet.png

just the four latest wins I bothered posting to the discord. wow look at all that death cleave/restless dead/ghostball/mega annihilate. no build variety at all amirite

Why do you sound so "bothered" to post things when you don't have to? I only said these are examples of things I found to work out. Your ice run looks interesting. Your other three runs look basically like swarm builds not much different than restless dead/ghostball runs in playstyle. One of them you literally have one spell.

I dont know why you sound so upset. The game is not perfect and its just my impression that some balance changes would make the game more interesting.

And by the way, I know the game gets easy if you figure some strategies out but having 3-4 immunities on minions is not the only way to keep it challenging. It's more of a frustrating form of difficulty than a fun one.

[eb]

If you're going to keep moving the goalposts then I'm done. Have fun with your copium.

[Weekend Player]

Originally posted by eb:

If you're going to keep moving the goalposts then I'm done. Have fun with your copium.

Uhh what? You're watching too many online debates buddy. Im impressed with your buzzwords but this is just a friendly discussion about a game not some intellectual proving grounds, chill out.

[Capt.EO]

i know more than the scietists !

[Crusher Von Splattenheim]

Well I just got my first Mordred kill and I wouldn't have gotten it if not for eb's screenshots up there.

In my failed runs I'd have like 10 spells and maybe 1 or 2 skills. Well this time I had 7 spells, I probably could've cut out 1 or 2 of them, and I had like 5 skills and won. It really does seem like compounding skills are what make a spell do serious work without requiring getting lucky on a shrine find.

[glythe]

Originally posted by saddler93:

I hope I'm on the wrong and everybody's enjoying it, but it's gotten to the point where i'm just not having fun trying spells since more than half of them do very little.
It's either "stun everything so you don't instantly die" or "stun that so you don't instantly die".

This is a game that rewards:

1. Reading Comprehension
2. Planning
3. Strategic allotment


Death Cleave is probably the easiest build but there are tons of ways to make viable builds. Try looking at the guides on steam for some ideas how to make better use of what is in the game.

[Mindmaker]

Originally posted by Intropik:

Originally posted by eb:

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/887800332816629820/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/886747745866625034/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885991087783677952/char_sheet.png

https://cdn.discordapp.com/attachments/726806037151219732/885771764112707635/char_sheet.png

just the four latest wins I bothered posting to the discord. wow look at all that death cleave/restless dead/ghostball/mega annihilate. no build variety at all amirite

Why do you sound so "bothered" to post things when you don't have to? I only said these are examples of things I found to work out. Your ice run looks interesting. Your other three runs look basically like swarm builds not much different than restless dead/ghostball runs in playstyle. One of them you literally have one spell.

I dont know why you sound so upset. The game is not perfect and its just my impression that some balance changes would make the game more interesting.

And by the way, I know the game gets easy if you figure some strategies out but having 3-4 immunities on minions is not the only way to keep it challenging. It's more of a frustrating form of difficulty than a fun one.

Apparently I'm taking way too many spells, jesus.

[elonashooter]

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, you can win with literally just wolf?

[Tenebria]

Originally posted by elonashooter:

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, you can win with literally just wolf?

It's even a trial to do so :p

[treehann]

Originally posted by Tenebria:

Originally posted by elonashooter:

♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥♥, you can win with literally just wolf?

It's even a trial to do so :p

I wish there were more specific restricted trials. Most of them are just abuse, they're not fun like the Wolf one :P

[Pup]

As a dabbler in Nethack (the original Roguelike)... non-random "weapons" is kinda nice xD