Tips for a good counter deck?

[Gerfreckle]

I pretty much only play with counter decks because I find them the easiest, although I'm still a massive noob because I haven't even finished the game once (got close a few times though). What's some good advice you can give for an effective, game-winning deck (on normal difficulty)? I do the basic stuff like remove useless cards, upgrade counters, etc., but should I specialise in anything particularly?

[The Mighty Bison]

I also feel that the counter deck is the easiest starter to win with because it has the safest and most consistent cards in it. Nothing close to like a guaranteed win, but easier than the other decks.

There's a lot of things you can try, I personally like to stack counters and shoot for Armored Strike cards to deal huge damage bursts. Focus on adding in dodges, taunt, etc. to get enemies to behave how you want and trigger your counters multiple times. You could also shoot for a combo/counter deck to really make the most of your Combo Counter cards.

I would also go for any huge block cards, like Hunker Down, Big Block and so on. If you go for the combo/counter strategy you can also get that cards that convert combo to block and vice versa

[Gerfreckle]

Originally posted by The Mighty Bison:

I also feel that the counter deck is the easiest starter to win with because it has the safest and most consistent cards in it. Nothing close to like a guaranteed win, but easier than the other decks.

There's a lot of things you can try, I personally like to stack counters and shoot for Armored Strike cards to deal huge damage bursts. Focus on adding in dodges, taunt, etc. to get enemies to behave how you want and trigger your counters multiple times. You could also shoot for a combo/counter deck to really make the most of your Combo Counter cards.

I would also go for any huge block cards, like Hunker Down, Big Block and so on. If you go for the combo/counter strategy you can also get that cards that convert combo to block and vice versa

Thanks for the tips, I'm going to start a new game now and see what I can do with it. I think perhaps I'd gotten too wary of taking any cards at all that weren't dodge or counter, so I'll try branching out a little bit to be a bit more versatile.

[Twelvefield]

I can't say I agree with the advice given, but FiTS allows for a wide variety of strategies.

Block is not easy to deal with since it doesn't scale up with enemy power. You need to rely on large block synergies that you may or may not draw. Dodges are much easier to use, and they combine very well with Counters. You've probably figured that part out already.

Unfortunately, the Counter deck is rife with bricks, including the king brick of them all: Step. Ugh. So cards I would concentrate on getting rid of are:

Step: nearly the worst card in the game, especially since it is so common
Block: the best Blocking card is Root Down, since that is held does not brick you hand as much.
Quick Block: almost as bad as Block, but at least it's cheap and upgrades for cheap
Long Counter: too situational to keep in your hand
Dash: just a hair less awful than Step. Panic Dash is the only movement that gets you out of range of ninjas and mobile pawns that track you, if your only move is down the line of their attack.
Quick Kick/Strike: Not bad cards, but too weak to do much in the late game
Jump Kick: too situational
Push: should be replaced with the almighty Front Kick ASAP
Head Smash: this card grants the enemy pawns an extra turning move that they otherwise would not have. Too dangerous!

Hey, that's most of the deck. Critical cards to remove are Step and Dash, but if you remove them you won't have any mobility. You need to replace them with Shift, Slip, Panic Dash, and the great Front Kick. Push is replaced by Front Kick.

Counter cards pair all right with Block, but great with Dodge. One highly under-rated Counter is Counter-Throw. This is the only single card in the game that immobilizes the enemy for two turns. If you pick up something like Spiked Stamp, this creates a massive synergy. Throw cards in general are very good when combined with Spiked Stamp and/or Ground Punch.

So you have to decide on a) Block vs. Dodge, and if you can b) Throw vs, Stun. All of these options have strong and weak points, I prefer Dodge and Throw cards in a Counter-style deck. (Then there's Bleed. Bleed is great, but you tend to end up with a thick deck to make a Bleed build worthwhile. FiTS generally punishes the thick deck)

Then you have to decide if you can get by on an ultra-thin deck of 20 or less cards. If you are aggressive at pruning bad cards, this is what you will be left with. You have one useful Combo based attack, Combo Counter, which combined with Jolt can make you powerful. If you use Dodges, you can stand your ground and not burn up Combo by moving too much, and then built a paper-thin deck that cycles to your Combo Counter every two or three hands. Ouch!

Or are you going to build a thick deck of around 30 cards? Then you are collecting Dodges or Block, and augmenting with Throws and held cards, and/or Stuns.

[Leylite]

I agree with most of the above analysis, but I have to single out Long Counter as actually being great - it gives you even more block than a normal Counter, Long Counter+ does even more damage than Counter+, and enemies that push you away (normally a problem for the Counter deck that makes you want a proactive attack, dodge, Root Down, etc.) can get directly countered by a Long Counter. You can also counter pistol enemies, the Hatchetman, etc. at 2 range for convenience.

It's a solid card to keep in the deck and in the endgame I'd be fine with keeping Combo Counter + Long Counter and getting rid of a normal Counter.

[Twelvefield]

I'll buy that. I've always considered Long Counter as being a half-brick since the ranged attack does nothing for adjacent pawns. Thanks for clearing that up!

People hate Counter Throw and I love it. I hate Long Counter, but now I'm going name my next kid after it. Long Counter Twelvefield has a ring to it.

[Leylite]

Oh, maybe you have Long Counter mixed up with the Throwing Knife Counter? Throwing Knife Counter only activates for attacks at range 2+, and I agree it's pretty situational and kind of hard to exploit. Long Counter activates at range 1 or 2, which in practice tends to be against nearly every attack in the game. Very efficient for 1 momentum!

...of course Dodge Counter+ costs _zero_...

[Fluxia Lumionia]

Tips -

Vary your counter cards. I've found that counters do not stack if they are the same. Counter stab + counter stab only gives one counter stab. But Counter Stab + Long counter gives two counter attacks.

Dodge helps vs people who do big damage in one blow, but actually is pretty bad vs multi attackers.

Lowering the enemy damage increases the advantages of counter cards. Also cards that stun opponents for a turn are also really good, as no enemy has full protection against stun unlike other things. Redirection, grapple, swap are all good ones as well, since they can make it so that enemies attack enemies and not you, incases where you need to shuffle dudes around because getting hit is a pain.

Always use the one that increases damage first, and combo counter last, so that the numbers stack up.

[Twelvefield]

Sure, Long Counter and Throwing Knife Counter are almost the same to me, cards I rarely use (but I am into Long Counter now!).

If you lower enemy damage, that makes it safer for you, but also more difficult to have the pawns injure each other, which is a strong tactic. The more damage done to the enemy, the better, and there are many times that you use one pawn as a weapon against another. Dodge definitely helps with that, but so do the Reposition class of cards that allow you to move the pawns yourself. I prefer not to debuff enemy damage (in fact I do like Rush Of Blood), but either course of action is a viable strategy. You have to choose which one to follow.

One Counter I really do not like is Counter Grapple. It's too situational and it doesn't do any damage.

[Leylite]

I think Counter Stab is just bugged as of the current version to not stack; you definitely can play multiple copies of other counters and stack them just fine.

Taunt can also be surprisingly useful on a counter deck, since you can build up your counters/block, have an enemy attack you in your current position, get countered heavily, then you can move somewhere else and have other enemies attack you and get countered too. (Or you can taunt -> counter -> stun/throw, so you can have your cake and eat it too.)

EDIT:

In theory, I think the use case for Counter Grapple is supposed to be that you could play Counter Grapple -> Counter in that order, then when a front-shielded enemy attacks you, you would grapple them so they're facing away from you and then your normal counters can hit them in the back. Unfortunately the Prison shield enemy also pushes you away, and if you're back-braced against something then that (usually) means that tile is occupied and you can't grapple them into that tile.

Counter Grapple + Counter Stun is also maybe effective to keep them on that new tile so you can push them off the board next turn, but that's also pretty niche.

[Pαιɳɯҽαʋҽɾ]

Originally posted by Gerfreckle:

I pretty much only play with counter decks because I find them the easiest, although I'm still a massive noob because I haven't even finished the game once (got close a few times though). What's some good advice you can give for an effective, game-winning deck (on normal difficulty)? I do the basic stuff like remove useless cards, upgrade counters, etc., but should I specialise in anything particularly?

I play Counter a lot as well but if you get bored and want a faster game, go Aggressive. It's fun and over powered if you get the right cards and upgrades. Rolls over everything.

Anyway, these are my own suggestions. Feel free to mix it around.

1. I don't pick every reward I get. Only the useful ones. (Get to this in a bit)
2. Starting, I focus on cash and upgrading the Counter cards for higher block. Allows me to stay put longer even when surrounded.
3. Keep the deck lean. You want the good cards to shuffle back asap. Hence, #2. Minimal new cards, only upgrades at the start.
4. Support cards to look out for,
- Grapple
- Shove
- Shift
- Push
- Front Kick/Quick Kick
- Redirect
- Pocket Sand
- Suprise Attack+
- Defensive Stance

5. Other Counter cards like Counter Stab, C.Grapple, C.Throw, C.Stun, I usually skip. It's not bad but I prefer those with higher base block before upgrade and direct damage output. Reason being is this deck is meant for you to TAKE HITS. And likelihood you will be surrounded every now and then. You'd want them to get countered and die off ASAP or else you'd be in trouble. Stab kills slow, Stun will STILL leave you surrounded after, Throw doesnt work on some, Grapple doesnt work if you're backed into a corner.

6. Cards like hunker down that converts Momentum into block, (upgraded is 6x) so if you're still at 3/3 Momentum only, that's 18 block. Which is equivalent to 1 Long Counter+. Hence, I don't use it either. Quick Block is probably my fav. 0 cost.

7. Point here is to build a tank, take hits and hit back hard and fast. The longer they take to die, the higher chance you'd get surrounded and your block may be insufficient to take the hits. And use support cards to keep you alive. Manage your Block vs Enemy Damage properly.

8. That's where the support cards come in. Grapple being my fav. Then 1-2 'push' cards for some quick kills (killed spiky Ninja boss on first turn a few times) The first 5 cards I listed in #4 are my priority cards. The others are fillers when RNGesus doesnt love me.

Best run with the counter deck I had was:
Long Counter+ x3
Counter+ x2
Power Sink x1 (one is enough)
Quick Kick and Push (1:1)
Grapple+ x2
Shift+
Quick Block+
Block+ x2
Combo Finisher+

I remember this run cause it was the first time I tossed out C.Stab from my deck and I also had the Impenetrable enhancement (25% more Block).

As for MOVEMENT cards,
Slip is good since it costs 0 when upgraded but you can STILL get stuck and pummeled to death. Hence, keep a Shift handy. Or you can use Redirect, Shove, Kick, Push, etc. Its for situations when you have one too many enemies around you and not enough block.

Problem with playing Counter are those that PUSH you. Shotguns, kickers, etc. Long Counter is your best bet but you need to be standing right in front of the enemy when he attacks so you stay in range.
This deck needs a lot of proper positioning so it tends to kill SLOW. Add too much direct damage cards and you lose your main essence, block and counters.

Especially the last boss. His minions hurt so you want to try to keep it to 2 attackers at most (if your block can handle it)
Takes a lot of patience and moving around.

Once you've won enough times with the Counter deck, play Aggressive a few times. Aggressive deck is delicious. Sometimes allowing you to kill 2-3 enemies in one turn.

Anyway, just my 2 cents. The more you play, the more you learn. Good luck bro.

p.s Edit: I don't use cards costing more than 1 Momentum and generally avoid X cost cards. I rather use all my momentum on Counters and 0 cost cards for support. Gives me offense and defense at the same time. 3/3 momentum, Long Counter+, Counter+, Power Sink+, Quick Block, that gives me 18+10+15+12 = 55 block (68 with Impenetrable enhancement) and 30 counter damage. Fun times.

[Twelvefield]

Counter Grapple is effectively a Shift where you stand still. If you are near a wall ("tight spaces"!) then you can't use it if the pawn isn't against the same wall as well. Considering there are niche cards that call for you to play along walls, that's even worse.

No doubt there are some really bad cards in the deck. Counter Grapple isn't the worst, but I consider it the worst Counter card.

I'm not a huge fan of multiple Counters as a synergy. The can be complicated to play and you are at the mercy of the deck. My Counter-based decks tend to be thick. But there are some very entertaining synergies you can build, and they can be very effective. A set of great Counters and Dodges sets you up for a Muhammad Ali-style "rope-a-dope" fight, which is one of the more fun ways to play the game, I think, and it's definitely lethal. You do damage on your turn plus the pawns' turn, yow!

Taunt is a situational card, but fortunately it has quite a lot of use. I like Taunt and really like Get Over Here. Anything that uses up the pawns' actions or moves before their turn is a good thing.