Boss: Cain

[escafondrex]

I've finally defeated Cain and he's decidedly unbalanced.
Other bosses can be killed with some skill, but with Cain you have to farm too much experience doing repetitive loops, without difficulty that can get boring.
The game except Cain is 10.
Thanks to the creators

En español:
Finalmente he derrotado a Cain y decididamente no esta balanceado.
Otros jefes pueden matarse con cierta habilidad, pero con Cain hay que farmear demasiada experiencia haciendo loops repetitivos, sin dificultad que pueden llegar a ser aburridos.
El juego, salvo Cain es de 10.
Gracias a los creadores

[CJones]

Cain is hard as ****, but he's nowhere near as blatantly unfair as Tubal.

[Ap2000]

Originally posted by Typisch:

had way more trouble with tubal tbh

Weird, I got that one on my second try.
Like... 50+ levels ago. lmao
I'm at around level 230 now and can just somehow get Cain to 50% HP. Once I got him to 75%.

[HerbertWess]

The main issue with Cain is that at least in the first run you are sort of underpowered and he can hit stupidly hard, compared to other bosses, so there is lesser margin for errors. Besides that, the moveset is a mix of the other estuaries. About the only thing that i find incredibly annoying is that i tend to confuse Lamec's and Tubal's movesets, hence i forget the rotary blades when he lands.

By the time you master this guy, you will have no trouble dodging crap with second boss, prime version. Don't wanna spoil it :P

[Scruff Mcgruff]

All of Cain's spells/abilities are slightly modified versions of the spells/abilities from the first 6 bosses. So from that perspective, I don't think he's unbalanced at all (and is actually quite 'balanced'). I also didn't find I needed to farm much at all my first 2 or so times through the game. Comparatively, I'm getting to NG+8 now and have had to spend a bit of time leveling to overcome some of the later 'Prime' bosses. Either way, if you find any of the normal versions of the bosses unfair, you're going to really dislike their Prime versions...

[Stanis23]

Cain pattern is fairly obvious tbh, it's clear what you would need to do for most of his attacks.

Namah and Tubal (especially Prime version) are more annoying to me, one is flying and other has adds to make the stage a lot more chaotic and that you can't just fully focus on the boss like Cain.

It doesn't help he's always available for retry so you can go for the +100% HP trait or regen trait.

[Zombie]

The only thing I would change about Cain is have the full heal from entering a boss room activate on him. I don't like having to fight Jonah and then not heal for Cain.

Other than that Cain is fine, although he does have one or two attacks that are excruciatingly hard to dodge without some kind of I-frame but that's how he should be as the last boss.

Non-prime cain is really simple.

[Ap2000]

Originally posted by Zombie:

The only thing I would change about Cain is have the full heal from entering a boss room activate on him. I don't like having to fight Jonah and then not heal for Cain.

At least in NG that most definitely happens though.

[CJones]

Beat Cain last night. Took 10 tries, which is still fewer attempts than Tubal. I found that Ronin with Wind Shield works really well for this fight. The wind shield blocks his homing attacks, and you can use the Ronin's talent to teleport through stuff. Plus he just gets a lot of range.

Overall, I found Cain to be a very fair boss. All his attacks are dodgeable, once you know what to expect. Again, this is in stark contrast to Tubal, where you can very much end up in situations where damage is virtually, if not completely, unavoidable.

[sh00g]

Tubal is way worse with the adds.

[Vegetamaker]

Well, Tubal is REALLY harder boss in the game, specially talking about prime versions. Last boss have alot more mechanics, but they all are easy to learn and avoid.

Tubal is very random with the adds he summon and he hit really hard. And even has attacks that go forward and back attacks that you can't see because, sometimes, they go outside of the screen. Very unfair imo.

And well. Namaa is very annoying, but she has less health and damage output so is more manageable than Tubal.

[Mordbube]

For me Tubal was harder. Wind Shield is very usefull against Cain.

[Neutrino]

I'll go with Op here, I'm globally bad at platform games but I like rogue legacy.
I can dodge an attack but I'm totally unable to dodge that many for so long. I always take dmg from one of the 2 black walls, from the moving "ball wall" and I often take dmg from any form of attack.

I'm level 250+ and while Tubal was easy with the x2 health/no heal perk, Cain has way to much HP to try to brutally smash his head in without moving like I did with Tubal.

I feel very frustrated, I know I don't have the skill to finish the game in NG+ mode (and that's ok with me), but I can't even finish the game in normal mode or lower the difficulty somehow...

[Ap2000]

I'm really surprised with all the people finding Tubal decidedly harder. With Tubal you can just bounce on the mobs he summons and they have barely any HP, just that defender thing, iirc.
I guess it really comes down to play styles and how comfortable you are with bouncing.

Originally posted by Neutrino:

I feel very frustrated, I know I don't have the skill to finish the game in NG+ mode (and that's ok with me), but I can't even finish the game in normal mode or lower the difficulty somehow...

There are "house rules", but I honestly don't know if any of them do anything for bosses. Or they somehow disabled progress/achievements.

[Derpykat5]

Originally posted by Ap2000:

I'm really surprised with all the people finding Tubal decidedly harder. With Tubal you can just bounce on the mobs he summons and they have barely any HP, just that defender thing, iirc.
I guess it really comes down to play styles and how comfortable you are with bouncing.

Originally posted by Neutrino:

I feel very frustrated, I know I don't have the skill to finish the game in NG+ mode (and that's ok with me), but I can't even finish the game in normal mode or lower the difficulty somehow...

There are "house rules", but I honestly don't know if any of them do anything for bosses. Or they somehow disabled progress/achievements.

House rules do effect bosses, don't disable progress or achievements.

[Ap2000]

Originally posted by derpykat5:

House rules do effect bosses, don't disable progress or achievements.

Thanks, in that case I'm just going to set enemy HP to 50% and kill him tbh.