detail manuals

[LtCyrano]

maybe im just blind but where are the manuals for the planes?
as a DCS player you usual get a highly detailed manual for every modul.

[Sangeki]

There are none. If you want more information about anything in the sim not covered in the sim, including the aircraft, look it up elsewhere.
No, it doesn't make sense.

[jmjohnson]

No sense at all. Even less than none actually, when you hear theres a manual in the DVD package. Uh .pdf, anyone??

Of course just becoming aware some feature is in the sim, so you can look it up elsewhere, is especially fun.

[Sobo]

You are talking about Microsoft here. You would expect detailed Manuals?

[Rever]

I have been playing this series since the beginning. Yes, I am that old. I didn't expect manuals. You can complain if it makes you feel better, but until you get into paying $45-90 per plane, you don't normally get a manual. Whether that makes sense or not, it is the norm for MS Flight Sim.

[RichSkater04]

Download the AIM (Aeronautical Information Manual) and while you're at it, grab the IPH (Instrument Procedures Handbook). They're outdated, but you can find free PDF versions of both from 2017 and that's good enough for this. Or you can buy current hard copies from the FAA if you really think you're going to try the real thing.

As for aircraft specific things like, what's a good climb speed in a 172, you'll have to search online yourself (and hope the sim correctly models aircraft performance). Things like, how does the autopilot in the a320 work, are going to be harder to answer though.

Not so much because that information might not be available, but because those systems are only partially implemented in the default planes. They each have their own quarks that don't exist in the real thing, or are otherwise specific to the sim itself. Not having a manual for this stuff is a real pain.

One example is there are some pages in the FMC that don't actually exist, and some other pages may look real, but function differently than the real thing. So even if you can find a manual, or more likely, find a manual for some 3rd party version in another sim, it's likely going to be different.

[jmjohnson]

Planes are one thing - how to find and use all the features in the sim is another.

This is isn't exactly a simple feature-lacking program.

Much to find out & know about!

[ApeLikeJay]

I think the creators are guilty of being too familiar with sims themselves that they take for granted the concepts are all the same from one release to the next and that "everyone has played a flight sim, right?"

Nearly every question I've had about anything has been answered in some Google search related to past flight sims... so, conceptually, it is the same for the most part... but this is a generational release that hasn't seen a significant entry in the genre in ages, they really should have assumed a new audience... because they're clearly getting one.

[RichSkater04]

Publicado originalmente por ApeLikeJay:

I think the creators are guilty of being too familiar with sims themselves that they take for granted the concepts are all the same from one release to the next and that "everyone has played a flight sim, right?"

Nearly every question I've had about anything has been answered in some Google search related to past flight sims... so, conceptually, it is the same for the most part... but this is a generational release that hasn't seen a significant entry in the genre in ages, they really should have assumed a new audience... because they're clearly getting one.

I wager that the majority of the current players are not people who are used to flight sims. They're not used to the flight sim market of not getting any sort of manual with a game they paid potentially $120 for. And further not expecting to pay $40 for an "unofficial DLC plane" from a 3rd party to get any sort of help. I already wrote a book about this and wondering what it might mean for the future of development (or lack of).

There's a ton of features if you know where to look. It is a flight sim, you're going to have to think like a pilot to find them. Something like the fact that every VOR is in the sim with real world frequencies and you can totally use them for navigation exactly as you would in real life is a huge feature.

I doubt the majority of current players even know what a VOR is. Overtime that won't be the case though. A lot of people will realize flight sims just aren't their thing. Others will go buy a yoke and throttle when they're back in stock, pick up a new hobby and learn everything they can. I'm interested to see if/how Microsoft attempts to cater to both sides of the equation. There was a lot of hype for the "gamer" to try this out, and many did. Will they do anything more for the "gamer" or is all about the "simmer" now?

[jmjohnson]

Publicado originalmente por RichSkater04:

There's a ton of features if you know where to look. It is a flight sim, you're going to have to think like a pilot to find them.

Something like the fact that every VOR is in the sim with real world frequencies and you can totally use them for navigation exactly as you would in real life is a huge feature. .

See - there ya go! I did NOT know this, nor would I have likely discovered this on my own. Now I get to go find a guide on how to do this.

Thanks!

[LtCyrano]

hmm... thats bad.
i flew most time the learjet 45 in FSX. i spend the extra money for the cessna citation longitude and could not activate the autopilot yesterday.
sure the tutorial-checklist at the beginning is nice and helpful, but the complete rest is missing.

[RichSkater04]

Publicado originalmente por jmjohnson:

See - there ya go! I did NOT know this, nor would I have likely discovered this on my own. Now I get to go find a guide on how to do this.

Thanks!

No problem!

To be fair to the "GPSers", VOR technology is slowly phasing out in the real world in favor of GPS navigation. However, in my opinion, which many disagree with, it's just a cooler way to navigate. There's a physical tower on the ground you're tuning into on your NAV radio, GPS waypoints are just kind of made up spots.

I'm not an "old school" kind of guy usually, but in this case I guess I prefer the old way. Also, it makes cruise phase a lot more interesting than just follow the "magenta line". Instead, you're constantly changing frequencies, looking for intersections off other radials, it can keep ya busy on a long arrival.

Once you understand how to track a radial with your CDI, look for STARs that DON'T have "(RNAV)" in the title. These arrivals will use only VORs for the routing and you can do all of that without ever touching the GPS. To start I would recommend programming the route into the GPS anyways, just so you can make sure you're on course.

But the ultimate test is to take off normally, immediately go "under that hood" (instruments only, don't look outside). Fly from one airport to minimums at another, look up and hopefully see a runway (hopefully the one you expected) and then land normally, all without ever using the map or GPS.

But remember, It's not just a silly challenge. Many planes don't have GPS and this is how they actually do it for real. So you're actually learning something here. You might never use this skill for real, but if you ever get the chance to ride with an old pilot, you might just blow their mind.

I really hope they add stuff like this to the tutorials. In FSX we had a "better" training mode. For one, you actually progressed as a real pilot might, from basics (PPL) to instrument flying (IFR) and then into complex and multi-engine (CPL) and eventually the Boeing airliner (ATP). The information taught and tested on was also much more in depth. You were taught in an IFR tutorial how to hold on a radial of a VOR, for example.

The checkrides were riddled with bugs and a lot of people hated the examiner's voice for always failing them over things they didn't do. They weren't impossible though, and once you did it you got a virtual license that had your name on it and made you feel like you actually did something. I found them very rewarding and also educational. Hopefully we see some sort of this brought to the new version.

[jmjohnson]

/I\ Awesome thanks again!

Cheers!!

[RichSkater04]

Publicado originalmente por jmjohnson:

/I\ Awesome thanks again!

Cheers!!

Have fun, I'm gonna go get to work on that guide for ya. It'll be up on steam by the end of the week hopefully. I've been thinking about doing one on this topic anyways, and you inspired me to stop thinking and actually do it, people could use it. Cheers.

[FlippinFlow]

I know these planes are just the "included" planes, and not study sim level. But I wish they included some documentation as well at least cover some of the AP nuances or the CMS in the bigger planes. I often use youtube with DCS and FSX, but manuals with specs and procedures are handy. Instead I have to watch a youtube video from someone who might or might not know what they are talking about.

[DarkFire]

Publicado originalmente por FlippinFlow:

I know these planes are just the "included" planes, and not study sim level. But I wish they included some documentation as well at least cover some of the AP nuances or the CMS in the bigger planes. I often use youtube with DCS and FSX, but manuals with specs and procedures are handy. Instead I have to watch a youtube video from someone who might or might not know what they are talking about.

Agreed. Coming to MSFS2020 from DCS I was kind of expecting a couple of hundred pages of PDF to read about each aircraft. The in-game checklist system helps to some extent but check lists are not a manual, for which there's no substitute.

I'd recommend looking up Squirrel on youtube. The chap is a real pilot (as many are) but he has a knack of explaining concepts really well and is currently doing a tutorial series.