Wasps in their current state are bad for Halo.

[Truly]

In the past, Halo vehicles for the most part were designed to play cooperatively, to help play the objective, be balanced and make cool plays/have fun. Some good examples were warthog, hornet, elephant, prowler, spectre

The single person vehicles always came at a cost:

Chopper: +can boost through vehicles -turning and mobility
Ghost: +effective at splatters -vulnerable from fire from side/back
Banshee: +powerful weapons -not easy to maneuver

Now let's look at the halo infinite wasp. Never before was a single person vehicle so hard to kill, easy to drive and easy to get kills. There's no downside, most people can get so many kills so easily. It does this because when you spawn, there is not a single thing you can do to fight back. Assault rifle and pistol? what a joke. I tested it and you have to hit every pistol shot you start with and all but 1 clip of AR for it to be destroyed. It's agile and bulletproof and deadly. So fun to play against.

For me and my friends who still play, (most left due to balance and no content) the wasp ruins BTB, since the any objective revolves around first having the wasp dead. It is so effective that people will watch spawn times and try to sneak by everyone just to have a taste of that sweet sweet wasp kill dopamine. If there's two of them in the sky the game is just over. Why? Well the three weapons that are most likely to kill them: Skewer, and sniper aren't easy for a newer player to hit. In before "YoU FoRgOt LoCkOn HydRa" Well on the map Highpower it doesn't spawn near the base instead you get the ever useful RAVAGER....

If it was up to me I would take it out of the game and replace it with a hornet or some team based vehicle. At the VERY least it should be balanced to make it more susceptible to AR or pistol rounds.

Don't even get me started on tanks, overall BTB map design and active camo, as they are also very unbalanced.

[KairanShadow]

Maybe use the warthog instead of ignoring it?

To add, the wasp is a nerfred version of the hornet, it had the same problems and two Spartans could sit without getting knocked off.

And nothing about the Tanks have changed i think the wraith has a faster canon velocity over explosion size but the wraith was barely ever used for long ranged engagements due to that.

[Truly]

Originally posted by Devilish Dave:

So long story short, people really suck at this game and it's the one thing apart from the few issues I have with the game itself, that is pushing me away and making me play less. It's just a suicide fest for your brain cells to try and cooperate with so many horrid players.

Agreed. There are better games out there that don't have glaring balance issues.

Originally posted by Shadow426:

Maybe use the warthog instead of ignoring it?

My wife and I (who use the warthog whenever we can), still find an evasive wasp, due to its long range lock-on rockets outkills a warthog. I think thats dumb since it takes teamwork of two players to pilot effectively.

[Chicky Lumps]

The main problem with the Wasp is the airspace design encouraging cheesy range camping and spawn killing.
On paper the Wasp is supposed to be a glass cannon and doesn't last long under fire from anti-vehicle weapons. In practice, the generously sized airspace boundaries allow it to stay entirely out of range of almost all those weapons, as well as corner peek individual players behind cliffs out of bounds and hide with complete immunity if someone with a ranged weapon or land vehicle tries to challenge them.

Both the Wasp's machine gun and rockets are effective at basically all ranges, while almost all the non-power weapons with similar range are kinetic guns that have massive debuffs against Wasps. Combine that with a huge airspace allowing Wasps to hover at sniper distances even from the edges of the map and go behind any terrain, and it's not hard to figure out what the meta Wasp playstyle is gonna be.

Possible solutions:
1. Give the Wasps' attacks slight spread or damage drop off to encourage it to actually take risks in order to be fully effective.
2. Decrease the Wasp's armor against regular kinetic weapons. Other damage types can stay the same. At the moment it's a flying smart car that soaks up bullets like a Wraith which is neither good for balance nor makes sense in universe if you care about that.
3. Restrict air vehicles from going so far below the map. Currently a Wasp on High Power can hide below the cliff of the enemy's base to spawn camp, and even if it's disabled below ground level, it will just fall hundreds of meters without dying. If Wasps are just going to hide below the map to be immune to both weapons and skyjacking, they shouldn't also have qualified immunity in the off chance they get disabled. Besides, there aren't enough air vehicles at the same time on any map to make use of that space for dogfights regardless.

[Kurato]

just grab a shock riffle or disruptor and zap it out of the sky or grapple to it and punt the pilot in the face.

[Chicky Lumps]

Originally posted by Kurato:

just grab a shock riffle or disruptor and zap it out of the sky or grapple to it and punt the pilot in the face.

Any pilot who actually cares is never going to be within grapple range and Wasps basically can't die to being disrupted over a pit.

[Kitt 🌟 Stargazer]

I feel that the wasp is too tankie for how powerful and easy it is to use. You can melt people super fast with little effort while several people are all firing upon you.

Blitz got a killionaire spawn camping an eye base in oasis after jacking a waspe while 7+ enemies were firing at him.

[Sifer2]

If your team also has the Shock Rifle then yes it's a kill farm machine with no counter. Otherwise every time you peak out your getting knocked out of the sky by the shock rifle. Even more annoying as the Banshee since that vehicle isn't near as overpowered.

[Chicky Lumps]

Originally posted by Sifer2:

If your team also has the Shock Rifle then yes it's a kill farm machine with no counter. Otherwise every time you peak out your getting knocked out of the sky by the shock rifle. Even more annoying as the Banshee since that vehicle isn't near as overpowered.

Problem is Wasp pilots always hover over cliffs on the map border because for whatever reason they can fall half a kilometer below the map without dying. All it does is stall them and chip damage them a bit.

[Kitt 🌟 Stargazer]

Originally posted by Sifer2:

If your team also has the Shock Rifle then yes it's a kill farm machine with no counter. Otherwise every time you peak out your getting knocked out of the sky by the shock rifle. Even more annoying as the Banshee since that vehicle isn't near as overpowered.

I get disabled two seconds behind my team, making it impossible for the enemy to get near me. Then I get back up in the air like nothing happened and get another 5 to 10 kills.

[Lincrono]

Shock rifle: shuts down camping wasps easily. Hydra, shuts down close, medium wasps easily. 6 dudes dumping 1 mag of BR: kills wasps easily. 4 sniper rounds: kills wasps easily. Skewer, shuts down close, medium wasps. Grapling mountains like spider man, hard, but satisfying. 'Hog, drive in and out of cover half competently and you counter the rockets, get under them and they can't shoot you, a good Hog is a no-fly zone on the move. regrettably hogs are harder to keep alive since people actuality shoot at them. I Don't like going to the "skill issue" well, but as a dude that's gone 50+ kills in a wasp, and who regularly fights them, they're not a problem, teams that ignore them are. Really, one dude persistently hunting a wasp is a counter to it, you only need a few mags with any of the starting weapons to put one down. And that's exactly what I do. sure, i'll die 5 or so times, but i'll get the kill and remove the threat. Never been much for camping with them either, they do best at close-medium range where they can really use their agility and their magical ability to be totally ignored by anyone they're not actively shooting at. it still baffles me that I can brazenly fly directly to enemy spawn and only 1-2 folks out of the 6+ there shoot me, including dudes I just killed,

[ressenmacher]

Originally posted by Chicky Lumps:

The main problem with the Wasp is the airspace design encouraging cheesy range camping and spawn killing.
On paper the Wasp is supposed to be a glass cannon and doesn't last long under fire from anti-vehicle weapons. In practice, the generously sized airspace boundaries allow it to stay entirely out of range of almost all those weapons, as well as corner peek individual players behind cliffs out of bounds and hide with complete immunity if someone with a ranged weapon or land vehicle tries to challenge them.

Both the Wasp's machine gun and rockets are effective at basically all ranges, while almost all the non-power weapons with similar range are kinetic guns that have massive debuffs against Wasps. Combine that with a huge airspace allowing Wasps to hover at sniper distances even from the edges of the map and go behind any terrain, and it's not hard to figure out what the meta Wasp playstyle is gonna be.

Possible solutions:
1. Give the Wasps' attacks slight spread or damage drop off to encourage it to actually take risks in order to be fully effective.
2. Decrease the Wasp's armor against regular kinetic weapons. Other damage types can stay the same. At the moment it's a flying smart car that soaks up bullets like a Wraith which is neither good for balance nor makes sense in universe if you care about that.
3. Restrict air vehicles from going so far below the map. Currently a Wasp on High Power can hide below the cliff of the enemy's base to spawn camp, and even if it's disabled below ground level, it will just fall hundreds of meters without dying. If Wasps are just going to hide below the map to be immune to both weapons and skyjacking, they shouldn't also have qualified immunity in the off chance they get disabled. Besides, there aren't enough air vehicles at the same time on any map to make use of that space for dogfights regardless.

Well written. I'd like to add that one of the issues compounding the problem is that on a lot of maps the cover doesn't have a roof; there's often only a few tiny bits + the initial bases, and even then most of those are open air.

If everyone's harassing the wasp with long range kinetics, it falls apart pretty quickly. If one person's harassing the wasp, it's trivial for the wasp to just fly over their cover and blow them to pieces because there's no feasible way for them to get to a place where it can't find an angle on them. You can't take the highground against it like other vehicles, and because it has this omnidirectional movement it can't even be juked or rung around an obstacle like a banshee.

[Chicky Lumps]

Originally posted by ressenmacher:

Originally posted by Chicky Lumps:

The main problem with the Wasp is the airspace design encouraging cheesy range camping and spawn killing.
On paper the Wasp is supposed to be a glass cannon and doesn't last long under fire from anti-vehicle weapons. In practice, the generously sized airspace boundaries allow it to stay entirely out of range of almost all those weapons, as well as corner peek individual players behind cliffs out of bounds and hide with complete immunity if someone with a ranged weapon or land vehicle tries to challenge them.

Both the Wasp's machine gun and rockets are effective at basically all ranges, while almost all the non-power weapons with similar range are kinetic guns that have massive debuffs against Wasps. Combine that with a huge airspace allowing Wasps to hover at sniper distances even from the edges of the map and go behind any terrain, and it's not hard to figure out what the meta Wasp playstyle is gonna be.

Possible solutions:
1. Give the Wasps' attacks slight spread or damage drop off to encourage it to actually take risks in order to be fully effective.
2. Decrease the Wasp's armor against regular kinetic weapons. Other damage types can stay the same. At the moment it's a flying smart car that soaks up bullets like a Wraith which is neither good for balance nor makes sense in universe if you care about that.
3. Restrict air vehicles from going so far below the map. Currently a Wasp on High Power can hide below the cliff of the enemy's base to spawn camp, and even if it's disabled below ground level, it will just fall hundreds of meters without dying. If Wasps are just going to hide below the map to be immune to both weapons and skyjacking, they shouldn't also have qualified immunity in the off chance they get disabled. Besides, there aren't enough air vehicles at the same time on any map to make use of that space for dogfights regardless.

Well written. I'd like to add that one of the issues compounding the problem is that on a lot of maps the cover doesn't have a roof; there's often only a few tiny bits + the initial bases, and even then most of those are open air.

If everyone's harassing the wasp with long range kinetics, it falls apart pretty quickly. If one person's harassing the wasp, it's trivial for the wasp to just fly over their cover and blow them to pieces because there's no feasible way for them to get to a place where it can't find an angle on them. You can't take the highground against it like other vehicles, and because it has this omnidirectional movement it can't even be juked or rung around an obstacle like a banshee.

Exactly, it's too easy for the Wasp to peek weird angles off the map to pick off players one by one. It doesn't matter if 6 players can bring it down faster when the pilot can easily pick angles where no player but the target can get a LOS to it.

[Truly]

Originally posted by Chicky Lumps:

Originally posted by ressenmacher:

Well written. I'd like to add that one of the issues compounding the problem is that on a lot of maps the cover doesn't have a roof; there's often only a few tiny bits + the initial bases, and even then most of those are open air.

If everyone's harassing the wasp with long range kinetics, it falls apart pretty quickly. If one person's harassing the wasp, it's trivial for the wasp to just fly over their cover and blow them to pieces because there's no feasible way for them to get to a place where it can't find an angle on them. You can't take the highground against it like other vehicles, and because it has this omnidirectional movement it can't even be juked or rung around an obstacle like a banshee.

Exactly, it's too easy for the Wasp to peek weird angles off the map to pick off players one by one. It doesn't matter if 6 players can bring it down faster when the pilot can easily pick angles where no player but the target can get a LOS to it.

I agree with the prospective changes, and am glad I am not the only one who thinks this way.

[Kitt 🌟 Stargazer]

The thing melts people so darn quickly. You gotta pray one of the few good options to take out a wasp is up, most of which are power weapons that have a significant down time before a new one comes up. The best option is probably a hydra, but you won't see more then one of those on your team, and hope they have enough rockets to take out the wasp. If they are up, you better hall ass because if that Wasp pilot see's you you'll be dead in seconds lol. Best bet will usually be a Disrupter or Grapple shot, and hope the Wasp pilot plays a little too aggressively so you can actually ultilize them effectively on the Wasp. If they stay at a distance, stick behind their team, or use the out of bounds area's for cover, these tools will be fairly worthless trying to down the thing.

https://www.youtube.com/clip/UgkxOd5UUH59wnpU0ZedvIIv6ioCGrj2q1Df

Here's a good clip showcasing just how powerful those things can be. 7+ people trying to gun down Mint Blitz after he hi jacks a wasp, then spawn camps the enemy team and gets a Killpocalypse in the Wasp.

Banshee's at least have to work a little for their kills, and generally won't last nearly as long as a good Wasp pilot will. Ground vehicles don't have the benefit of flying in area, which allows them to easily avoid a lot of anti-vehicle weapons ( plasma grenades, rockets, ect. )

[Chicky Lumps]

Originally posted by Nelska:

The only actual complaint that I have is it is too hard to kill someone in a vehicle without having to destroy it. you used to be able to 1 shot scorpions through the bars in the drivers seat (halo ce). now that you cant even emp them with the alien pistol. Anything like the wasp where its above you. There's no way to kill it without a power weapon.

I think most vehicles are fine in this regard, in fact I'd say the Chopper shouldn't be so easy to shoot the pilot out of. Although the Ghost seems to have almost all of its open seat protected by invisible hitbox, making side shots that clearly should hit the driver do no damage to him at all. Which I think it part of why it's too easy for Ghost pilots to ram a dozen people before going down even with everyone shooting their flanks.

Wasp has a destructible windshield on the top side, however shooting the pilot out almost never happens for an obvious reason. No one can aim at the top side because the Wasp is over the map.