Balance Issues

[Flatline]

Balance Issues

The following feedback is the result of me playing a lot of kart-type games over the past month: I'm basing this feedback on my OCD unlocking of cars in BBR2, coupled with my experiences playing Mario Kart 64, Mario Kart Wii, Super Mario Kart, Super Indie Karts, Crash Team Racing, and Sonic All-Stars Racing (original and Transformed).

It should also be noted that this feedback is not about game or AI difficulty.


Debuff stacking:

Put simply, in its current state, the sheer quantity of possible debuffs that can slam into you in rapid succession is too high. You can be blinded by both the tiki masks and the tunnel vision, and then simultaneously lose control of your vehicle due to rubber wheels, moon gravity, bees etc... and all without actually "dying", thus being potentially trapped in an incapacitated state for extended periods of the race, repeatedly.

Being hit by so many things at once, and being forced to endure them for prolonged periods, isn't particularly fun. It's not chaotic, it's not "mayhem"; it's just like having a friend stand in front of the screen waving their arms around in your face while trying to steal the controller from you.

Possible solution -
Maximum debuff limit, beyond which the player "dies" and respawns, or the implementation of exclusive debuff "slots". If a player has the tiki masks covering their screen, applying the tunnel vision should either kill them, or do nothing. Otherwise you may as well be giving players a random chance to have their monitor turn off.
Similarly, if the player is under the effect of moon gravity and their wheels get inflated... they should perhaps ascend into the sky rapidly, and respawn, or "pop" on the first ceiling they impact.

A lot of the time, actually respawning is faster and more efficient than enduring the debilitating effect of multiple non-fatal debuffs.


Physics:

I know the game is supposed to be chaotic and more physics-driven than its karting peers, but the physics need to be restrained a bit. On multiple occasions, I've had my car flip onto its side, and slide along the track out of control for as long as any debuff... simply because I was nudged into the scenery.

Please weight the cars a little more so they flip back up. Car-flipping isn't actually part of the gameplay - you can perform jumps, get bounced, get rammed by other cars without flipping your vehicle. So it seems far more like a physics glitch than a genuinely intended feature.

Similarly, the moon gravity powerup is truly awful. It's a racing game - it is most fun when your wheels are on the track, and you're zooming around at high speed. When you're spending so much time floating gently through the air, that feeling of speed and action is lost (especially since it seems to be a very common powerup).
Furthermore, when moon gravity is deployed while the car is in an interior environment, the player ends up hitting their head on the ceiling - which is to say, the camera collides with the upper limits of the level, either popping through the scenery, or otherwise jerking about in a very unattractive way.

The concept for moon gravity is fine, it just needs to be toned way down; either it's moon gravity, in which case it shouldn't actively lift anyone, merely reduce the gravity temporarily (like the low-grav section on that space level)... or it lifts everyone, in which case it should be limited to a couple of metres elevation, and not result in players flying through the sky.

Meanwhile, car weight and collision is a bit lacking when it comes to impacting other racers; without impact sounds, and without any canned nudging effects, the strategic use of ramming other racers is largely lost, and clusters of cars bumping into each other feel rather spongey. Even the bull-rush effect is a bit hit and miss in this regard - you only know that you've hit someone when you see them ragdoll. There is no audio feedback, and the initial impact seems to be... non-existent, like it's less a ramming effect, and more a magical touch effect.


Reverse Shooting:

This is a terrible idea. I'm sorry to be so blunt, but the current relationship between difficulty and race position is a bit broken in League Rules mode, with struggling racers frequently getting hammered from people ahead, not by carefully dropped obstacles, but from actual projectiles.

Given that there are no real catch-up mechanics (like the Mario Kart bullet), being forcibly held in last place is an actual reality, with racers ahead gobbling up powerups and immediately shooting them backwards.

I don't really see why backwards shooting would be a thing in a racing game - if you're ahead, you already have the advantage. Keeping that advantage is supposed to be the product of skillful driving and strategy, not simply bombarding the people you've already beaten.

Additionally, the existence of backwards shooting rather precludes more precise tweaking of powerup drops. If backwards shooting did not exist, players in the rear of the race could be given more aggressive drops. But so long as backwards shooting exists, they'd actually be better off being given defensive drops.


RNG:

Meanwhile, the current RNG for powerups doesn't seem to respond particularly well to the state of the race - stuck in second position with an AI racer a long way ahead for 90% of the race, I have picked up the "blue shell" powers (the big explosion and the death rat thing) perhaps one or two times in ten races.

The RNG in general needs to be tweaked a tad, to be more responsive to race conditions - if the racer in first position is that far ahead, more long-range powers need to drop. The first place racer shouldn't be punished for doing well... but as it stands, everyone else is punished for being in the pack, getting hammered relentlessly by their peers so nobody can actually catch up.


League Rules:

Firstly, given that these are considered the base rules for the game, they're currently in a state of overkill. The game feels fastest and most tactical when you tweak the rules and disable a lot of things. Giving every racer 2 of their unique power usages, from the start, introduces such constant disruption to the racing that the actual race itself often feels random; like you're just surviving a random series of environmental effects, rather than beating other racers.

My strong recommendation would be to tone down league rules:
Make current "League Rules" settings a "Mayhem" mode, and make a new league rules preset that either removes a lot of the more eccentric powerups and limits special powers...

...or alternatively, find a way to tweak the drop table for the powerups so that, per track, certain powerups will almost entirely preclude others. For example, if a moon gravity has dropped, other bounce/airtime-inducing powerups should have a massively reduced chance to drop. Or if someone has dropped bees, the control inversion powerup should become exceedingly rare.

Meanwhile, character special abilities should either be limited to 1 use in League Rules, or should have to be earned - perhaps extend the initial timer, and then bind it to race position. If you're in first place early on, it should take you a lot longer to unlock your special. If you're in last place, the charge-up time should be reduced massively.

Put simply - make character abilities have an inverse relationship to performance. If you're doing well, you shouldn't gain your ability until perhaps the last lap.

In fact, I'd recommend this anyway. It would make the special abilities more meaningful than their current status, which is little more than "You start with a themed powerup".


And Lastly:
Drift boost?

The game doesn't have accelerator pads, and the drop rate on boosters and nitro seems pretty low when all powerups are enabled. Either through drifting or through tricks, the game could do with giving players the ability to regularly gain a bit of a speed boost. Or at least, an acceleration boost. It doesn't have to be much, and it doesn't have to last long - but a little VROOM every now and then, in response to the player successfully drifting or pressing something at just the right moment would do wonders. It needn't increase the overall speed of the race, just allow little surges that would make it feel faster.

[Vector Unit]

Hi Flatline -

Thank you so much for the super detailed and well thought-out feedback. There's a ton to digest here, and we're still talking about it amongst ourselves.

Generally speaking I'd say there's a lot here we agree with...and we probably won't get to much of any of it before the game switches out of Early Access in a couple of weeks. But we WILL keep it all on the table for consideration as we continue to update the game going forward.

I'd be super curious to know what other players think about these points as well. Feel free to chime in, folks!

- Matt

PS. You actually do get a speed boost out of drifting. It's not a discreet burst of speed but more of a stat buff.

[JD]

I certainly agree with the point about multiple, incessant barrages of debuffs, even though I've never heard that term before. I enjoy the cut and thrust of the racing, which these things tend to obscure. My solution has been to switch to championship races, and turn off all power-ups and abilities. Which works pretty well for me.

Cheers
John

[Flatline]

Originally posted by Vector Unit:

PS. You actually do get a speed boost out of drifting. It's not a discreet burst of speed but more of a stat buff.

Yeah, just to add a little addendum -
I have since noticed the subtle speed boost, but I'd maybe modify the wheel effect a little... add a trail to imply speed. Because it's a bit *too* discreet at the moment. Like, the thought process I went through was:
"Oh, the wheels are sparkling. I must get a boost if I do this."
"Oh, nothing has happened. I guess there's no boost."
"...Although I do seem to get better times when I drift well..."

Anyway, thoroughly enjoying the game. Feels fundamentally "right", in terms of handling etc so good job. And the ability to actually customise the rules right down to specific drops is great.

But my girlfriend is a Mario Kart lunatic - she's the one who unlocked all the stuff on Mario Kart Wii, and some of the feedback here is driven by my observations of her struggling with certain things, or getting frustrated with certain things.

Which, I figure, is a good indicator of broad commercial appeal.

[Shadowspawn]

I'm only 3 races into the story mode. First race was easy 1st. Can't place beyond 2nd in next two races. Not sure if game wants me to come back after unlocking better cars or what. There is always one car that pulls out ahead and you never see again until finish line with a split time of 4-8 sec. I don't like advancing through a series without a 1st place finish so if this game is requiring the replay of earlier races after unlocking better cars that is a huge turnoff (for me). Gameplay seems totally reliant on power-ups (Mario Kart) vs skillful driving (Crash Kart) but opponent AI is very unbalanced (playing on Normal).

[Vector-Ralf]

Originally posted by Shadowspawn:

I'm only 3 races into the story mode. First race was easy 1st. Can't place beyond 2nd in next two races. Not sure if game wants me to come back after unlocking better cars or what. There is always one car that pulls out ahead and you never see again until finish line with a split time of 4-8 sec. I don't like advancing through a series without a 1st place finish so if this game is requiring the replay of earlier races after unlocking better cars that is a huge turnoff (for me). Gameplay seems totally reliant on power-ups (Mario Kart) vs skillful driving (Crash Kart) but opponent AI is very unbalanced (playing on Normal).

Hi Shadowspawn,

Out of curiosity, what difficulty did you choose?

And yes, as you progress through the adventure map, the design is that you would earn enough stars to unlock gates, and skip (or skip trying to get 1st in) some events along the way because they may be too tough. If you later run into a gate that needs more stars than you have, you can go quick-nav (LB/RB) back to earlier chapters to pick up stars you skipped. At that point you will (1) have gotten more skilled and (2) your car will be upgraded so it has an advantage over the field.