Anyone else really annoyed by the Bluds?

[Albatross]

So first off, I know that we are in Turkey and the Bluds are coded Kurds. I don't mean to comment at all on that conflict, just the way the fictional Bluds are in the game.

I just don't understand what they want from me, even if i block all of the targeted ♥♥♥♥ against them they still violently rebel if i ♥♥♥♥ up a ceremony. Not even to mention the Bluds could never survive on their own, they would get slaughtered by Wehlen or conquered in a week by Rumburg.

And no Mr MP, a democratically elected representative using his constitutional powers to put down a violent nationalist movement is not "fascism", it is literally the opposite of it. I imposed the same laws on the Young Sords but im a bad guy for doing it to the Blud nationalists? Absurd.

Now i realize that part of the problem is that Anton is Sordish and from a semi-fascist party and we are only seeing things from his perspective. Even still the Bluds come off as extremist religious nationalists and i'm not sympathetic to it.

[stm8022]

Originally posted by Albatross:

I just don't understand what they want from me, even if i block all of the targeted ♥♥♥♥ against them they still violently rebel if i ♥♥♥♥ up a ceremony.

It's simple, they want to feel you're treating them with the same respect you're treating the rest of your people. This means the bare minimum of not supporting bills that discriminate them, but also respecting their beliefs, instead of a "i couldn't be arsed to remember a simple ceremony and messed it up, what's the big deal?" attitude.

[chilango2]

You have to remember the Bluds were one of the *targets* of Sollism. They are a persecuted minority who have been persecuted *specifically* by the party you represent and who face hostility and racism within that country from the Sord majority.

They tend to be wary of government overreach like banning parties because they tend to be the next victims even if they aren't the first, which is a perfectly logical fear given the history within the game.

Of course getting them on your side is difficult.

And given this history, it's perfectly logical that if you mess up their ceremony, they will see it as an *insult* why shouldn't they?
They aren't that hard to get friendly, in addition to vetoing the bills, don't ban any parties (it makes things worse anyway), get all the ceremonies *right* and take every opportunity to talk about how they are and should be equal citizens.

[davlas07]

Still their attitude seems a bit odd to me: during my last playthrough I aimed to grant Bergia an authonomy, which can only be done through special decree (so you have to go for a dictatorial constitution first, otherwise you wouldn't even have and option to reform status of Bergia in any way). Going for a dictatorial constitution means making a deal with Kibener first, so I had to sign the Language Unification Act since I didn't ban the Red Youth and rejected Religious Harmony Bill.
After giving Bergia that authonomy I went there to support the Anschraf and the crowd was happily chanting my name but then Leke said smth like "...after everything you've done against Bluds", and accused me of "cultural genocide". It just made my brain melt - doesn't giving you guys AN AUTHONOMY count for anything?!
Yep, sure, you can still renounce the Language Unification act and establish this "Minority Rights Commission" but after Leke literally calls you a racist for just one law (which you have to sign anyway to even have a chance to give Bluds their precious authonomy) without at least mentioning the good thing you've done, you start to think that well maaaaybe I should have unleashed the military on you instead as that psychopath Kibener insisted.

[stm8022]

Originally posted by davlas07:

It just made my brain melt - doesn't giving you guys AN AUTHONOMY count for anything?

Of course it does, but oppressing them, which *is* what you have also done, *also* "counts for something".

To expect them to completely ignore it and focus only on your good deeds comes close to a sociopathic Thanos-like attitude -- "sure i might've murdered half of your population, but you should be nothing but grateful because i've only done that to improve the lives of the remaining half."

[davlas07]

Originally posted by stm8022:

Originally posted by davlas07:

It just made my brain melt - doesn't giving you guys AN AUTHONOMY count for anything?

Of course it does, but oppressing them, which *is* what you have also done, *also* "counts for something".

To expect them to completely ignore it and focus only on your good deeds comes close to a sociopathic Thanos-like attitude -- "sure i might've murdered half of your population, but you should be nothing but grateful because i've only done that to improve the lives of the remaining half."

I mean, you can get them on your side only if *all* your stances are pro-Bludish, one single misstep - and you'll be accused of genocide, called a racist etc.

As for the playthrough I described, it looks a bit funny: Bludish crowds treat you like a hero because you granted them an authonomy, allow you to pick the red candle during the Anschraf, applaud your speech, and than that "...after everything you've done against Bluds". Looks more like a kind of mismatch or smth to me

as for the Bergia Special Zone law - I guess you should go for it only if you wanna oppress them further, otherwise it makes no sense

[chilango2]

In my democratic reformist run I obviously couldn't make the region semi autonomous because that's mutually exclusive with a reformer run, but I was able to be mostly successful, no Bludih protests, allowed to take red candle, create the minority rights commission. I still didn't get the achievement, which I am curious about, I might have to choose the Bergia regional development decision, I tend to pick something else. It's the only pro-blud option I left on the table during my reformer run.

Leke was supportive to some extent, but he still formed the BFF and was suspicious. I basically wonder if that's just the way he is as a character: he's suffered too much to not be suspicious. That being said, the writing and dialog feedback on what exactly is going on with that could be clearer, I agree.

[tmitfc]

Remember that oppress of Bulds is way more back when Kingdom of Sordland conquered Bergia. It happened even before Soll's birth.

[davlas07]

Originally posted by chilango2:

Leke was supportive to some extent, but he still formed the BFF and was suspicious. I basically wonder if that's just the way he is as a character: he's suffered too much to not be suspicious.

I agree. His alignment with the communists during the election campaign at the end is triggered by the poisoning of Ejahl (?) the current leader of the WPB, which you simply can't prevent (you can try to ban the Young Sords, investigate the NFP , it doesn't matter. The only way to prevent Leke from aligning with the communists is to ban the WPB, which can be done if you make an alliance with Hawker and the Old Guard, but in that case you obviously cannot be pro-Bludish at all
So it seems that in case you do everything right for the Bluds, the game implies you still have a long way to go.

[LahnaMan]

Originally posted by davlas07:

Originally posted by chilango2:

Leke was supportive to some extent, but he still formed the BFF and was suspicious. I basically wonder if that's just the way he is as a character: he's suffered too much to not be suspicious.

I agree. His alignment with the communists during the election campaign at the end is triggered by the poisoning of Ejahl (?) the current leader of the WPB, which you simply can't prevent (you can try to ban the Young Sords, investigate the NFP , it doesn't matter. The only way to prevent Leke from aligning with the communists is to ban the WPB, which can be done if you make an alliance with Hawker and the Old Guard, but in that case you obviously cannot be pro-Bludish at all
So it seems that in case you do everything right for the Bluds, the game implies you still have a long way to go.

Won't vetoing the Electoral Campaign Finance Act and lowering the electoral threshold work to avoid the commie-blud alliance?

[davlas07]

Originally posted by LahnaMan:

Won't vetoing the Electoral Campaign Finance Act and lowering the electoral threshold work to avoid the commie-blud alliance?

I doubt that. You see, I vetoed that act and decreased the threshold to *8%*, they still made an alliance at the end. So I thought the assasination of Ejahl is the main reason. There might be smth else, I dunno. Actually I never tried *3%* threshold, maybe it helps.

[Waqas]

3% threshold is the only thing that stops the alliance

and

funnily that is the only way to stop communists from getting into the assembly as they fail to meet the threshold.

[firestarter]

Originally posted by Waqas:

3% threshold is the only thing that stops the alliance

and

funnily that is the only way to stop communists from getting into the assembly as they fail to meet the threshold.

What about 15% threshold?

[Tommson667]

Originally posted by firestarter:

Originally posted by Waqas:

3% threshold is the only thing that stops the alliance

and

funnily that is the only way to stop communists from getting into the assembly as they fail to meet the threshold.

What about 15% threshold?

I just had a playtrough and despite having 15% threshold it they surpassed it. Though during my Malyenevist run communists got in there with 3% threshold. I know though that having a 8% threshold and legalizing BFP can cause both them and WPB to fail since both will be bellow the needed threshold due to them sharing votes.

[Volodio]

You can use the note features to remember the steps of the ceremonies. It's quite useful.

[teodafik]

i find it quite simple to get them allinged