How are you meant to beat the game on seasoned / nightmare? (possible end game spoilers)

[>>Tomoko<<~<3]

I was completely wiped out on wave 24, begrudgingly i went ahead and made my second attempt. this time ensuring i went deep on both sides. boarded up both walls. and cleared out a S*** ton of nests. and on the final wave i get completely wiped out. not even 30 seconds into the final wave and my Left flank has fallen from Wall 6 to wall 4, i run over. everyone is dead. not one person survived. with about 10+ Artillery enemies chasing me down.

i had fully upgraded walls. with 8 stalkers and 2 snipers per side. plus 3 engineers.
both my cement and ammunition factory had 2 guys running them. and despite all that. every single soldier was wiped out on the flank i wasnt watching?

i cant watch both sides at the same time. so how in the **** am i supposed to play the game when the one side i cant be on falls like a wet paper towel the second the wave starts.

i noticed the large enemies throw little eggs behind the wall.

nice!

i can only be on ONE side while this is going down to shoot the eggs. so the entire time the opposite flank to me is getting reamed seconds into the fight.

just for sh*ts and giggles i went ahead and started up a Cheat engine run.
infinite scrap, food and research. all i have to do is BUILD. ... and wait for crap to be built (seriously boring, not all that fun)

and despite all this! and clearing out more of the nests than i previously did by a wide margin, we actually collapsed harder than my previous attempt. i had everything! literally everything. all my walls were max. i had fuel early on with tons of molotovs. mines everything

completely wiped out.

is there something that im missing? a hidden mechanic that i over looked?

i feel like this isnt even a get good moment. i literally had everything. and was winning the flank i was on. however despite this the opposite flank that i cant be on folds like the french and everything is over in under a minute

10/10 would waste like 18 hours of my time banging my head against a cement wall again.

but seriously though. the game has potential but seriously needs to be balanced.

oh. and when i died. my gunners kept shooting at the mobs and while i was staring at the death screen they managed to kill all the remaining enemies after about 20 minutes of shooting i actually got the completion for beating it despite i was dead lol

[Dukenukem117]

One way to beat the last wave is to dump all your defenses on one side and guard the other side with a handful of snipers, an engineer or two for repair, and a stalker tethered to you and basically molotov the wave so that it has to walk through a huge stretch of fire to even get to the wall.

But I don't like how you have to guard both sides and cant see whats going on on the opposite side so you cant even really learn what went wrong.

[>>Tomoko<<~<3]

Originally posted by Dukenukem117:

One way to beat the last wave is to dump all your defenses on one side and guard the other side with a handful of snipers, an engineer or two for repair, and a stalker tethered to you and basically molotov the wave so that it has to walk through a huge stretch of fire to even get to the wall.

But I don't like how you have to guard both sides and cant see whats going on on the opposite side so you cant even really learn what went wrong.

thats a very interesting strategy, i never thought to stack everyone on one side and defend the other.... ehhhhh its just frustrating. because after you die there goes your 2 hour run. and you have to start over.

dont the large enemies still throw eggs over the wall on the flank you're not on? my left side flank fell because no one was there to shoot them. i feel like the game wasnt thought completely out in many reguards.

[Dukenukem117]

Originally posted by >>Tomoko<<~<3:

Originally posted by Dukenukem117:

One way to beat the last wave is to dump all your defenses on one side and guard the other side with a handful of snipers, an engineer or two for repair, and a stalker tethered to you and basically molotov the wave so that it has to walk through a huge stretch of fire to even get to the wall.

But I don't like how you have to guard both sides and cant see whats going on on the opposite side so you cant even really learn what went wrong.

thats a very interesting strategy, i never thought to stack everyone on one side and defend the other.... ehhhhh its just frustrating. because after you die there goes your 2 hour run. and you have to start over.

dont the large enemies still throw eggs over the wall on the flank you're not on? my left side flank fell because no one was there to shoot them. i feel like the game wasnt thought completely out in many reguards.

Stalkers should be smart enough to turn around to shoot them. Im pretty sure I've seen that happen. But ya, the roguelike nature of the game is kind of frustrating when you can't even see whats going on and what caused you to lose. I once had a side that I thought was fine but slowly started to disappear cause all that remained was one giant lobbing eggs and the engineers left didn't know how to handle it.

[Nylonathathep]

Hey, mates! You guys seem to know your thing regarding final waves, so here's a question.

I get the impression that the upgraded rail car is stronger on the left side because of the artillery range reaching further beyond the walls. Is it true or am I imagining things? I only ever used it on the right side after one breach, so I couldn't really check all that well if the shells went far or not.

I tend to leave it supporting the left side while I handle the right one, not quite sure if it is indifferent, but if it really is stronger on the left side it might be the only viable route in high difficulty.

[>>Tomoko<<~<3]

Originally posted by Nylonathathep:

Hey, mates! You guys seem to know your thing regarding final waves, so here's a question.

I get the impression that the upgraded rail car is stronger on the left side because of the artillery range reaching further beyond the walls. Is it true or am I imagining things? I only ever used it on the right side after one breach, so I couldn't really check all that well if the shells went far or not.

I tend to leave it supporting the left side while I handle the right one, not quite sure if it is indifferent, but if it really is stronger on the left side it might be the only viable route in high difficulty.

from what im able to tell all allies have equal range reguardless of their position in the stack. allies further behind the walll still shoot as far as the ones in the front.

as far as the range of the mortar on the rail car... i cant say ive noticed a difference. though i dont think it makes that much of a difference in the grand scheme of things.

i heard from a youtuber that the right side has less overall enemies. while the left has alot more. maybe 30% more enemies. mainly Mortar enemies.

ill do another run and see for my self if the range is increased or not... will reply once i do.

[Gandalf the White]

Just restart till you get digger perk because it's god tier, make sure your early pathing is efficient so you have enough food to pay the handcar and you get plenty of scrap to set up both the engi and digger hut so you can start research day 2.
There's no breach or map edge on the right side till wave 10 because it's not connected by the bridge, so take advantage of this by clearing and expanding right side during the day and taking all your troops over to the left side during the night and harvest the mushrooms during the nightly attacks which aren't anything till the mortar wave 5.
The defensive mortar you need to clear with diggers/molotovs don't spawn till 6 and no spawns will appear on the day of and after a siege which means if you clear the right day 5 you won't have to worry about it again till day 9.

During the midgame I focus on getting all the advantages and getting fuel as early as possible, I'll probably have 5 stalkers so 3 getting fuel 2 guarding the right with an engi and I'll expand left with 4 diggers and an engi.

Make sure when building pop cap to focus on what you can defend first cause having to rebuild more than a couple of times will be the death of you if you can't afford the final gen upgrade to then get drones so you can make use of those 3 extra stalkers.

Late game I just focus on upgrading walls and over saturating the right side with stalkers and snipers and keeping a small amount on the left side with Ivan and the handcar (since you have molotovs and the handcar you won't need more than 6 stalkers and 3 snipers with you)

I basically just ride the handcar left middle constantly day 20 on so i can see if there's a a dweller there to try reach max pop Cap. day 24 (or maybe abit before if you reach pop cap earlier and don't need food) just take your extra engis and any diggers you have left and turn them into stalkers/snipers. If you have 12 stalkers on the right and 7 snipers I can pretty much guarantee you your wall won't even be touched if you have double gun advantage so you get to have a somewhat exciting fight on the left because you actually have to use those molotovs you should have been stockpiling up to this point

[Neyreyan_Youtube]

Simple, put notes or sticky notes and follow them while playing.
Or just restart until you get the digger bonus and kill all eggs/growths near the base

[Nylonathathep]

Originally posted by >>Tomoko<<~<3:

Originally posted by Nylonathathep:

Hey, mates! You guys seem to know your thing regarding final waves, so here's a question.

I get the impression that the upgraded rail car is stronger on the left side because of the artillery range reaching further beyond the walls. Is it true or am I imagining things? I only ever used it on the right side after one breach, so I couldn't really check all that well if the shells went far or not.

I tend to leave it supporting the left side while I handle the right one, not quite sure if it is indifferent, but if it really is stronger on the left side it might be the only viable route in high difficulty.

as far as the range of the mortar on the rail car... i cant say ive noticed a difference. though i dont think it makes that much of a difference in the grand scheme of things.

i heard from a youtuber that the right side has less overall enemies. while the left has alot more. maybe 30% more enemies. mainly Mortar enemies.

ill do another run and see for my self if the range is increased or not... will reply once i do.

So it's better... but perhaps not to the point of making that huge a difference. Thanks for the imput. It's the kind of thing that you can only test during final game waves and it's a bit of a risky experiment haha

[spada]

yeah, I have yet to beat the seasoned lvl. even with upgrades and management i can't seem to find the perfect balance of expansion and harvesting required to win. Normal is so much easier, it's unreal. typical game has easy medium hard extreme. this game just has hard, extreme, and impossible. It would be nice to have values to put with perks as well. I know the digger perk lets them clear rubble with one hit but so does the leadership perk. do building speeds go up 10%? more info like that would better help my decision making process.

What generator perks do you all pick?

[Mesond]

Originally posted by spada:

yeah, I have yet to beat the seasoned lvl. even with upgrades and management i can't seem to find the perfect balance of expansion and harvesting required to win. Normal is so much easier, it's unreal. typical game has easy medium hard extreme. this game just has hard, extreme, and impossible. It would be nice to have values to put with perks as well. I know the digger perk lets them clear rubble with one hit but so does the leadership perk. do building speeds go up 10%? more info like that would better help my decision making process.

What generator perks do you all pick?

Food over scrap. Dig overgrowths like crazy early game. Once you get shields this is childs play. Clear a side. Defend the other. Then clear that. That's basically it. It's mainly a matter of making sure you keep the food coming and not making mistakes.

Suffered so much on nightmare (stil have yet to beat the first wave) that I mastered seasoned because I got the hang of the games mechanics.

[RaMeDaDa]

Like other commentor said, stack defense on the side you aren't there. 10+stalkers, 4-5 snipers and 3 engi should do. On your side you have car, 2-3 snipers and few stalkers (if you can afford 2-3), and engineer for safety first.

Spam 2 molotovs per horde.

[uncle joe]

Your fault lies in your characteristics.

[Teidor]

With that many people you should be able to beat it, however i can give you a VOD of one of my nightmare runs that may be able to help you see what you might be lacking:

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1049350794

Hope it helps!

[>>Tomoko<<~<3]

Originally posted by Teidorr.ttv:

With that many people you should be able to beat it, however i can give you a VOD of one of my nightmare runs that may be able to help you see what you might be lacking:

https://www.twitch.tv/videos/1049350794

Hope it helps!

thanks it certainly has!

[>>Tomoko<<~<3]

Originally posted by RaMeDaDa:

Like other commentor said, stack defense on the side you aren't there. 10+stalkers, 4-5 snipers and 3 engi should do. On your side you have car, 2-3 snipers and few stalkers (if you can afford 2-3), and engineer for safety first.

Spam 2 molotovs per horde.

Originally posted by Gandalf the White:

Just restart till you get digger perk because it's god tier, make sure your early pathing is efficient so you have enough food to pay the handcar and you get plenty of scrap to set up both the engi and digger hut so you can start research day 2.
There's no breach or map edge on the right side till wave 10 because it's not connected by the bridge, so take advantage of this by clearing and expanding right side during the day and taking all your troops over to the left side during the night and harvest the mushrooms during the nightly attacks which aren't anything till the mortar wave 5.
The defensive mortar you need to clear with diggers/molotovs don't spawn till 6 and no spawns will appear on the day of and after a siege which means if you clear the right day 5 you won't have to worry about it again till day 9.

During the midgame I focus on getting all the advantages and getting fuel as early as possible, I'll probably have 5 stalkers so 3 getting fuel 2 guarding the right with an engi and I'll expand left with 4 diggers and an engi.

Make sure when building pop cap to focus on what you can defend first cause having to rebuild more than a couple of times will be the death of you if you can't afford the final gen upgrade to then get drones so you can make use of those 3 extra stalkers.

Late game I just focus on upgrading walls and over saturating the right side with stalkers and snipers and keeping a small amount on the left side with Ivan and the handcar (since you have molotovs and the handcar you won't need more than 6 stalkers and 3 snipers with you)

I basically just ride the handcar left middle constantly day 20 on so i can see if there's a a dweller there to try reach max pop Cap. day 24 (or maybe abit before if you reach pop cap earlier and don't need food) just take your extra engis and any diggers you have left and turn them into stalkers/snipers. If you have 12 stalkers on the right and 7 snipers I can pretty much guarantee you your wall won't even be touched if you have double gun advantage so you get to have a somewhat exciting fight on the left because you actually have to use those molotovs you should have been stockpiling up to this point

im making my attempt now! we shall see how this fairs after reading everything in this thread. thanks to everyone for the advice!