Unarmed worth it?

[Sever]

I was thinking of making an unarmed monk, but are weapon monks the better way to go?

Unarmed monk damage scales to 2d10, which is higher base damage than any weapon that I know of. However, do the special properties of weapons outweigh this?

Thanks for any help!

[GunStarX]

A class with lead blades like ranger can get a higher base damage from level 4 up. Not sure I would use a level 20 stat to base a build around.

[Kai-ron]

There are an abundant amount of weapon effects in this game.
Unarmed Monks are always solid.

Due to to the higher number of weapon effects available, a weapon monk might be fun and could open additional strategies and playstyles. :) Let us know what you went with and how it went.

[RandomDude2018]

You forget about the crit range/multiplayer. Some weapons are superior just because of that.

[Sever]

Originally posted by GunStarX:

A class with lead blades like ranger can get a higher base damage from level 4 up. Not sure I would use a level 20 stat to base a build around.

A ranger can make his weapons have a higher base damage than 2d10 at level 4? How do you do that?

[RandomDude2018]

Originally posted by Sever:

Originally posted by GunStarX:

A class with lead blades like ranger can get a higher base damage from level 4 up. Not sure I would use a level 20 stat to base a build around.

A ranger can make his weapons have a higher base damage than 2d10 at level 4? How do you do that?

You cast a spell called Lead Blades...

[Immortal Reaver]

Ironsoul (Metal Oread) can also get Lead Blades as racial spell-like ability once per day.

[corisai]

Originally posted by RandomDude2018:

You cast a spell called Lead Blades...

1) This spell alone is not enough to get even 2d10.
2) You can cast it on monk too.
3) Monk strong side is not basic unarmed damage but amount of attacks (bonus points for stacking different types of elemental damage to trigger barrage).

[Sotanaht]

"A monk’s unarmed strike is treated as both a manufactured weapon and a natural weapon for the purpose of spells and effects that enhance or improve either manufactured weapons or natural weapons."

If you can somehow cast Lead Blades on the monk (for example with a scroll, or by getting the spell on a Brown Fur Transmuter somehow), it will benefit their unarmed. Or at least it should by the rules. In fact it should also stack with Strong Jaw (pen and paper only unfortunately) and legendary proportions, allowing you to increase their unarmed damage a total of 5 categories (as per Strong Jaw, the damage would be whatever a Colossal sized monk would deal x2)

[seeker1]

The monk has some nice stuff they can add to their unarmed attacks. Stunning Fist, Quivering Palm, and just for damage, Elemental Fist. I played a monk throughout many of the IE games and rather enjoyed it. That was before Zen Archer existed.

I made Lann a kung fu monk. BTW, you can't get certain feats with him as a Zen Archer like Leg Sweep. To really see the Carl Douglas fun, you have to start him out as a regular (not Traditional - "Traditional" seems to lock you out of certain things) monk.

I am not a stat monkey. I don't watch the Combat Log, I look at the fun onscreen. I'm telling you, Lann was doing some serious kung fu fighting.

The thing is, there are some nice Oriental themed weapons in the game, so I sorta enjoyed killing things with kukris & kamas, and other folks are correct, some of those weapons carry some really nice on-hit enchantments so it's a tough call. But I just wanted to see him kung fu fighting. He had the weapons in other slots but I usually let him fight unarmed.

Homey can high kick.

[Sotanaht]

Originally posted by seeker1:

The monk has some nice stuff they can add to their unarmed attacks. Stunning Fist, Quivering Palm, and just for damage, Elemental Fist. I played a monk throughout many of the IE games and rather enjoyed it. That was before Zen Archer existed.

I made Lann a kung fu monk. BTW, you can't get certain feats with him as a Zen Archer like Leg Sweep. To really see the Carl Douglas fun, you have to start him out as a regular (not Traditional - "Traditional" seems to lock you out of certain things) monk.

I am not a stat monkey. I don't watch the Combat Log, I look at the fun onscreen. I'm telling you, Lann was doing some serious kung fu fighting.

The thing is, there are some nice Oriental themed weapons in the game, so I sorta enjoyed killing things with kukris & kamas, and other folks are correct, some of those weapons carry some really nice on-hit enchantments so it's a tough call. But I just wanted to see him kung fu fighting. He had the weapons in other slots but I usually let him fight unarmed.

Homey can high kick.

The only differences between Traditional monk and the base class are that the Traditional has his Ki-powers pre-selected, and gains an extra +2 to will saves. He may have fewer ki-powers overall and there are a couple he won't get, but he gets all of the obvious choices anyway and ki-powers mostly aren't even that good or important.

[seeker1]

Yeah, I prefer to have more freedom to make choices, whether they are optimal or not, which is why I didn't go that route.

[GunStarX]

Originally posted by corisai:

Originally posted by RandomDude2018:

You cast a spell called Lead Blades...

1) This spell alone is not enough to get even 2d10.
2) You can cast it on monk too.
3) Monk strong side is not basic unarmed damage but amount of attacks (bonus points for stacking different types of elemental damage to trigger barrage).

We're talking about 3d6 vs 2d10 so yes technically you have a potential for 2 points more damage, but the average is actually a 1 point difference. I'll say it again, it's a level 20 stat vs something available as early as level 1 depending on the class. Given that's it's a personal spell you will have to have your ranger/druid/hunter setup to scribe scrolls constantly to have it applied throughout the game. That might be okay early on, but as soon as you can get a level 7 scribe kit and buy a legendary proportions scroll for Nenio to scribe she can start scribbing that well before anyone can actually cast it.

Lead blades + legendary proportions on a 2d6/1d12 weapon gets you 6d6. You need level 16 as a monk to equal that setup

[corisai]

Originally posted by GunStarX:

Lead blades + legendary proportions on a 2d6/1d12 weapon gets you 6d6. You need level 16 as a monk to equal that setup

Are you serious about it? Because base damage is nothing (if only you're not using Vital Strike but ranger is a poor choice for it) and monk would have more full BAB attacks then ranger.
Technically I saw monk build with ~150-200 damage per hit and highly doubt ranger would ever be close to it.
P.S. And don't even mention a pet because of sohei :P

[GunStarX]

Originally posted by corisai:

Originally posted by GunStarX:

Lead blades + legendary proportions on a 2d6/1d12 weapon gets you 6d6. You need level 16 as a monk to equal that setup

Are you serious about it? Because base damage is nothing (if only you're not using Vital Strike but ranger is a poor choice for it) and monk would have more full BAB attacks then ranger.
Technically I saw monk build with ~150-200 damage per hit and highly doubt ranger would ever be close to it.
P.S. And don't even mention a pet because of sohei :P

I'm just pointing out the reality of base damage scaling, not the viability of cherry picked scenarios with unkown buffs applied.

[Gorwe]

Elemental Rampager ftw! You can claw, you can bite, you can shapeshift...probably the best Druid(for me).