Best melee weapon after Gravesinger nerf?

[Matunus]

Which melee weapon do you consider the best after Gravesinger got nerfed in the recent patch? Falchions, fauchards, elven curve blades and estocs all have increased crit range, but which do you consider the best choice?

[Deo]

Publicado originalmente por IlluminaZero:

Yeah - That design oversight is why the meta animal companions are basically horses (riding) or dogs (tripping)

With addition of Sable Marine, you can now include Gryphon into "horse" category. It's large from the get go, so you can ride it from level 1.

It has ranged point and click pounce attack, which makes both Gryphon and rider do full attack, and target considered flat-footed for it. He also trips everything in 5 meters range when he lands after this attack (with huge bonus to CMB).

Insane 1 lvl dip.

[Mauman]

Publicado originalmente por Matunus:

Publicado originalmente por mk11:

Horses can be enlarged by Animal Growth but all other normal mounts are not enlarged by it because they are already enlarged at level 7 (or 4).

OK, then it was, because I had dogs and wolves.

Believe me when I say this is a blessing in disguise.

I had to respec out of Sable because the stupidly huge size of the griffon was actively making it harder for me to play the game.

[IlluminaZero]

Sable Marine looks amazing and is def something I am considering prioritizing when/if I get to playing a "final" game with all DLC.

I know in KingMaker party members obstructed each other and Wrath of the Righteous removed that in turn based specifically. IE you can move "through" companions in turn based. Is the Sable being too large primarily a real time thing?

Party members obstructing each other is among the reasons my last Kingmaker replay was annoying AF lol. You can "feel" the loss of features going from WOTR -> Kingmaker and its painful.

[Matunus]

Publicado originalmente por Mauman:

Publicado originalmente por Matunus:

OK, then it was, because I had dogs and wolves.

Believe me when I say this is a blessing in disguise.

I had to respec out of Sable because the stupidly huge size of the griffon was actively making it harder for me to play the game.

I currently play sable company marine (1 level dip for the mount) and never had any problems because of it's size. I'm still not quite sure, whether it is as good as dog/wolf though.

[Trolleur_Durden]

I've had a few issues here and there with the hippogryff, when skydiving to an enemy near a slope or unwalkable terrain. The dive attack can actually whiff and fail by making you land to the nearest available area, which can be too far away from the target.

[winter]

Publicado originalmente por Razer:

But I just don't like the look of a Fauchard in this game and I don't understand why they use a Bill as a depection of it and make it an Exotic weapon which is rediculous as it was a piece of farming equipment.

Yea, the problem is with exotic weapons, game mechanics and flavor clash somewhat.

Mechanics wise, exotic weapons have to be stronger than common weapons to justify taking a feat for them, makes sense mechanically. But flavor wise, this doesn't make sense. Why would a weapon that no one uses be better than those everyone uses, or the other way around: if exotic weapons are strictly superior, why is nobody using them?

[sbudy]

Damn, I've built on Gravesinger for my Angel->Legend Mystic Theurge. I don't really want to go to scimitars and Seelah already took the Fauchard. Guess I'd have to stick with my bows (sigh).

[IlluminaZero]

There is a basis for it in history - For much of history bows were far superior to crossbows and even early firearms assuming the bow wielder was sufficiently competent. Having a sufficiently competent archer is a big IF though. (Archery in general is badly presented in fiction IMO. Hercules was associated with the Bow for a reason...)

As to the specific weapons that Pathfinder deems worthy of this kinda exception? Yeahhhhhhh. I think Fauchard is "exotic" because of how it draws inspiration from "Eastern" Polearms. It would be kinda neat and hilarious if the Pollaxe was added as the ultimate dueling weapon.

[mjuang84]

Falchions are still great. Especially the Jinx Falchion you can get as early as Act II. That's because it does increased damage if the enemy is suffering from a mental status debuff.

So many things are mental status debuffs, including Evil Eye.

[Triple G]

Publicado originalmente por winter:

if exotic weapons are strictly superior, why is nobody using them?

Simple, because feats are the most limiting factor in a build, and there are a couple requirements of certain feats - and some feats are just too good to miss out on them, as they´re OP compared to others. So exotic weapons are only "viable" with certain classes, which get extra feats.

Else You have like 10 feats - You want probably around 3 teamwork feats, something for the critical chance, something for damage for the class. And that´s pretty much all the feats You have. While additional feats would probably go into some defensive stuff - or more offensive potential. Critical range is nice, but You can have 18-20 without the exotic weapon feat, while You have 17 - 20 with any other 19 - 20 weapon - and the critical feat, if You don´t go for a keen buff.

So in short, as TL;DR:
It´s about getting a 10% higher crit chance for any weapon with the critical feat (which also unlocks extras when doing a critical hit), or a 5% higher crit chance when choosing the exotic weapon feat.

[GunStarX]

Publicado originalmente por mjuang84:

Falchions are still great. Especially the Jinx Falchion you can get as early as Act II. That's because it does increased damage if the enemy is suffering from a mental status debuff.

So many things are mental status debuffs, including Evil Eye.

Isn't it only an extra 2d4 damage now?

[Razer]

Publicado originalmente por GunStarX:

Publicado originalmente por mjuang84:

Falchions are still great. Especially the Jinx Falchion you can get as early as Act II. That's because it does increased damage if the enemy is suffering from a mental status debuff.

So many things are mental status debuffs, including Evil Eye.

Isn't it only an extra 2d4 damage now?

Isn't it multiplied on a crit? That makes it worth it alone.

[Triple G]

Publicado originalmente por GunStarX:

Isn't it only an extra 2d4 damage now?

and that doesn´t matter - what does damage in the game is what is after the "+". Else You can expect it rolls a 1. It´s okay, when You do like 60d6 damage, because it means You do at least 60. But it doesn´t matter much, if You do 1d4+46 or 1d10+46, or 2d6+46.

[GunStarX]

Publicado originalmente por Razer:

Publicado originalmente por GunStarX:

Isn't it only an extra 2d4 damage now?

Isn't it multiplied on a crit? That makes it worth it alone.

I'm not sure, I haven't used it since they nerfed it into oblivion. It used to include your strength and power attack bonus on the extra damage

[Razer]

Publicado originalmente por GunStarX:

Publicado originalmente por Razer:

Isn't it multiplied on a crit? That makes it worth it alone.

I'm not sure, I haven't used it since they nerfed it into oblivion. It used to include your strength and power attack bonus on the extra damage

Sounds like that's just a bug they fixed. So not a nerf.