Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Enhanced Edition

Pathfinder: Wrath of the Righteous - Enhanced Edition

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Accuracy?
I get that this is a DnD game and it's all a die roll. But is this game MEANT for every character to be missing every attack? I feel like despite being an archer with like. 15 dex I still miss whether i'm close, mid, or long range it's crazy to me. It honestly makes me wanna just go back to Divinity
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Showing 1-15 of 17 comments
pete3great May 6, 2024 @ 6:31am 
Your Dex is only 15? I'm guessing you didn't take any of the necessary archer feats either.
Soul May 6, 2024 @ 6:37am 
15 dex as an archer I think is kinda low actually....

usually for classes in this game you want to put your points into the main attribute your class uses as high as possible within reason...

like 18-20 range..... for me 19 is a sweet spot since you get 5 extra point while leveling to bring your base stat to 24 which is an even number....

plus as the game progresses and you gain levels you gain more Base Attack Bonus.... (BAB)....

plus feats like point blank shot to get a +1 to hit and damage for any enemy within 30 feet..... and precise shot to negate the penalty for firing at an enemy engaged in melee with another character... which is a -4 penalty btw.....

so pretty much your archer with 15 dex... has a +2 to hit through dex bonus.... without those 2 feats I mentioned your taking a -4 for firing into melee on top of that so a -2 to hit things engaged in melee... hitting is gonna be a lot harder for you....

however if you had say 19 dex.... you'd be getting a +4 to hit.... and with those 2 feats.... you'd get a extra +1 to hit and damage for enemies within 30 feet and able to negate the penalty for firing into melee.... so a +5 to hit total..... and by time you reach level 4 you could put a point into Dex to make it from 19 to 20... giving you an extra +1 to hit... for a total of +6 to hit...
Drake May 6, 2024 @ 8:44am 
For people new to the DnD D20 system, it's important to have some kind of visualisation.

+1 to attack = +5% base hit chance.
And very important, stat don't mean anything, only stat modifiers has any value. 15 Dex = +2 dex modifier, so 15 dex is only +10% hit chance.

Considering that without point blank and precisie, hitting an enemy that is close to an ally is -4 to attack, that means you have -20% hit chance.

Pathfinder ability scores and feats need to be read. that's an actual requirement. You need to understand how the system works if you want to do any damage. Otherwise you'll just hit the air.

It's not just all dice rolls. The point is to negate the dice rolls.
Last edited by Drake; May 6, 2024 @ 8:45am
Originally posted by TumultulousTTV:
I get that this is a DnD game and it's all a die roll. But is this game MEANT for every character to be missing every attack? I feel like despite being an archer with like. 15 dex I still miss whether i'm close, mid, or long range it's crazy to me. It honestly makes me wanna just go back to Divinity

As an archer, you need your Dex to be as high as possible as it determines your Accuracy. Additionally you want to avoid melee at all costs, as you'll get attacked if you shoot in melee range (be careful; of reach weapons). Lastly you NEED Precise Shot feat, as you will get a constant -4 to hit enemies if they are engaged in melee with an ally.

Keep in mind, that feats like rapid shot also reduce your accuracy but give more attacks. Combine all of that with the right buffs such as bless, cat's grace, ect and you shouldn't miss to often. My Brown Fur is an elf and has long bows, and is consistently hitting enemies for 5-6 damage, when they arent casting spells. Despite being a mage--- and that's probably the last thing to mention.

Class matters, if you roll up a fighter you have MORE base accuracy then say a mage does so be sure you have the right class to be an archer. I like the Slayer for an archer build as it gets both sneak attack, full BAB (Base Attack Bonus aka accuracy rating), and lots of other perks on top of it.

hope this helps.
Last edited by AzureTheGamerKobold; May 6, 2024 @ 10:16am
jonnin May 6, 2024 @ 10:16am 
This game is a hack & slash designed for min/max over RP. If you assume that 'core' is normal, you are going to be facing enemy 5 to 10 levels higher than you in short order: normal (in terms of similar RPGs) is more like core with the monsters tuned back to 'moderately weaker'.
And even at that ^^ setting, you need to be having high + to hit: +5 from your class stat (dex, str, etc) and + 3 or so from feats and spells rather early in the game (by the end of act 1). Just about every single fight you end up casting like 10 buff spells on your group by end of act 2, and constant crowd control as well (eg grease / web conj specialist caster)

and on top of that some enemy require touch spells to hit at all, so you probably have an inflict divine caster frontline toucher or a ray (ranged touch) caster in the back.

-------
for an archer specifically, some things that work:
you need to start with a 19 dex. Pick a race that has +2 to dex (lots! human, elf, 1/2 elf, orc, tiefling, dhampir***, kitsune, halfing, and probably others all can get this). 20 is reached at level 4, so the extra points stripped out of wisdom etc hurts saving throws and is more harm than good to start at 20. You can start with 16 or better str to get some extra damage from composite bows.
high BAB class (prefer slayer for sneaks)
sneak attacks (prefer slayer)
ranged cleave (mythic ability)
vital strike (rogue/rowdy or late game feat)
so for lan, your early game archer, I build him like this:
2 levels of monk (to get precise strike and bow feats. I go for composite longbows)
1 level of rogue, rowdy (I move him into trickery and stealth skills, and he becomes my main rogue as well)
and then slayer the rest of the way. His first mythic is ranged cleave and at that point I target the easiest to hit, lowest health things in each monster cluster and boom, everything in a grease sized radius is smacked for 50 or so damage. This all but carries me through acts 1&2 at which point you have to start micromanaging him as to whether he vitals or shoots multiple times/round.
If you prefer you can pick up 1 level of an arcane caster in there to get like acid splash & cold ray to use ranged touch/critical hits on high armor targets.
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the game provides too many archers, so having one as a main character is a little redundant (but, archery is powerful, so it works). There are at least 3 archer companions and probably 2 more that could build for it.


*** not recommended for beginners. Dhamphir require inflict wounds to heal. The game dumps a LOT of scrolls at you for this, so its playable, but its also easy to accidentally heal (hurts!) them or otherwise be aggravated (eg your oracle is your best healer but limited spell choices, learning inflicts at each level is painful and even if you had an inflictor, they are now pulling double duty as touch-damage AND healer... not so hot).
Last edited by jonnin; May 6, 2024 @ 10:58am
15 DEX for archer is too low,
if you played any DnD CRPG, Even for Solasta, the easiest game of them all, You will know 15 DEX for archer still too low.
You don't need all the Ability Scores to be high, but make sure you specialize your character.
And of course, read the game rules and combat logs, otherwise you may get -4 hit without realizing it.


edit:
Ranged are very viable and powerful throughout a run. Melee outclass them but not to the point that they aren't playable.

Even though ranged are weaker than Melee, Ranged is still very good at handling minions, especially caster minions, and if your archers can't hit most of your enemies, it just means you're not skilled enough to play the game , So just read the instructions.

Last edited by 渺羽 (Nihilmace); May 7, 2024 @ 6:22am
Deo May 7, 2024 @ 5:44am 
Originally posted by TumultulousTTV:
I get that this is a DnD game and it's all a die roll. But is this game MEANT for every character to be missing every attack? I feel like despite being an archer with like. 15 dex I still miss whether i'm close, mid, or long range it's crazy to me. It honestly makes me wanna just go back to Divinity
Go back to Divinity then, if you feel like it.

Pathfinder is a minmax game, through and through. If your main attack bonus attribute is below 20 at character creation - you might not bother yourself with hopes to hit enemy at all.

Also Wotr is heavy biased towards melee. Devs hate ranged builds. Not only your chance to hit enemies is low (no flanked bonus, no Outflank - nothing), you also have low number of attacks, and low damage due to how STR scaling works with bows (even composite is bad).

Sohei monk with Quarterstaff at level 3 will destroy everything he looking at, while ranged character will just work as cameraman (coz he missed his 1 attack per round).
mk11 May 7, 2024 @ 6:43am 
Originally posted by Deo:
Also Wotr is heavy biased towards melee.

A well designed ranged character will have killed multiple enemies by the time a melee character on foot has reached its first target.

WOTR is biased towards mounted melee because mounts allow move and full attack by the rider, mean you can max armour on the mount and damage on the rider, come with automatic teamwork bonuses
anfindel13 May 7, 2024 @ 7:38am 
Originally posted by mk11:
Originally posted by Deo:
Also Wotr is heavy biased towards melee.

A well designed ranged character will have killed multiple enemies by the time a melee character on foot has reached its first target.

WOTR is biased towards mounted melee because mounts allow move and full attack by the rider, mean you can max armour on the mount and damage on the rider, come with automatic teamwork bonuses

Agreed - both Lan and Aru are murderously efficient with ranged, as is Wendu (much as I dislike her), as long as they are given the right feats - they already have ability scores that lend themselves well to archer classes.
Bustin' Cider May 7, 2024 @ 8:05am 
Originally posted by TumultulousTTV:
it's all a die roll
I'd imagine "it's all a dice roll" would be the right way to say it no? Since die is plural.
Bustin' Cider May 7, 2024 @ 8:06am 
Or you could go with "it's all die rolls", but the way you wrote it, is off.
Raistlin May 7, 2024 @ 8:58am 
Originally posted by Virulant:
Originally posted by TumultulousTTV:
it's all a die roll
I'd imagine "it's all a dice roll" would be the right way to say it no? Since die is plural.
Die is singular. Dice is plural.
Bustin' Cider May 7, 2024 @ 12:35pm 
Originally posted by Raistlin:
Originally posted by Virulant:
I'd imagine "it's all a dice roll" would be the right way to say it no? Since die is plural.
Die is singular. Dice is plural.
ah, lol ok. I'll try and remember that now I've had this experience. I'm sure thats something I've known before and then got mixed up as I never use the word myself! Really should have checked, thanks.
Outlaw May 7, 2024 @ 2:09pm 
Originally posted by mk11:
Originally posted by Deo:
Also Wotr is heavy biased towards melee.

A well designed ranged character will have killed multiple enemies by the time a melee character on foot has reached its first target.

WOTR is biased towards mounted melee because mounts allow move and full attack by the rider, mean you can max armour on the mount and damage on the rider, come with automatic teamwork bonuses
Melee have broken synergy with outflank feat. Every crit give extra attack of opportunity to whole melee party, if this extra attack crit than it give another extra attack, so with 6-12 melee charasters (with pets count) it will be near endless extra attacks loop and every boss die in first round.
Slava Ukraini May 7, 2024 @ 2:09pm 
Originally posted by TumultulousTTV:
I get that this is a DnD game and it's all a die roll. But is this game MEANT for every character to be missing every attack? I feel like despite being an archer with like. 15 dex I still miss whether i'm close, mid, or long range it's crazy to me. It honestly makes me wanna just go back to Divinity

play on easy
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Date Posted: May 6, 2024 @ 6:08am
Posts: 17