Playable Dark Elf Race in DLC?

[King of Games]

Itd be cool to be able to play as dark elf. Youre allowed to play as a vampire or tiefling, so i dont think it would break the story to let the player play as a dark elf.

[Drake]

You don't play a vampire, you play a dhampir, which is different (a dhampyr is the offspring of a woman and a vampire).
In the north of the avestan, there is a big community of vampires (especially in the ustalav, which is just on the border of the worldwound), so dhampirs are not uncommon there.
Tiefling, like aasimar are common planar scions, it's not that rare, you even see a few as npcs.

Drows on the other hand are way more difficult to justify. First, a lot of drows worship demons, so they might just get killed on sight when entering kenabres, instead of being rescued, not even talking being tracked down by elves from kyonin.
Second, drows very rarely interact with people from the surface, they either just dwell undergroud in the darklands or disguise themselves to pursue shady deeds in dark corners of some cities.

They're just not a race you can play in any campaign.

[Schlumpsha]

Playable drow would make sense in an Second Darknesss or Ironfang Invasion AP where we traverse the Darklands, should Owlcat ever make adaptions of them. Not so much in a crusade where Kyonin is pretty much the biggest ally. Surface elves have a tendency of eradicating any and all records or eye witnesses of drow. They're paranoid like that.

[malkavius77]

Originally posted by Drake:

You don't play a vampire, you play a dhampir, which is different (a dhampyr is the offspring of a woman and a vampire).
In the north of the avestan, there is a big community of vampires (especially in the ustalav, which is just on the border of the worldwound), so dhampirs are not uncommon there.
Tiefling, like aasimar are common planar scions, it's not that rare, you even see a few as npcs.

Drows on the other hand are way more difficult to justify. First, a lot of drows worship demons, so they might just get killed on sight when entering kenabres, instead of being rescued, not even talking being tracked down by elves from kyonin.
Second, drows very rarely interact with people from the surface, they either just dwell undergroud in the darklands or disguise themselves to pursue shady deeds in dark corners of some cities.

They're just not a race you can play in any campaign.

That's literally like how half of the playable races are in D&D style games lol. Drow are probably even worse in D&D but are playable.

[King of Games]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

Playable drow would make sense in an Second Darknesss or Ironfang Invasion AP where we traverse the Darklands, should Owlcat ever make adaptions of them. Not so much in a crusade where Kyonin is pretty much the biggest ally. Surface elves have a tendency of eradicating any and all records or eye witnesses of drow. They're paranoid like that.

while that is true, the commander is different because of their gift, so regular elves qould really have a choice. As far as the beginning of act 1, they could just have people decide to imprison the PC Drow for questioning after healing them, then the demons attack.
Edit:This would skip the little Fair tutorial, but since its a DLC race OwlCat could just run under the assumption that the player already understands the basic of the game

[King of Games]

Originally posted by Drake:

You don't play a vampire, you play a dhampir, which is different (a dhampyr is the offspring of a woman and a vampire).
In the north of the avestan, there is a big community of vampires (especially in the ustalav, which is just on the border of the worldwound), so dhampirs are not uncommon there.

i would agree with you, but my current PC is a evil Dhampir that cuts people/demons/anyone in half with a scythe and drinks their blood in front of the entire party, so i mean most npcs or companions dont really seem to make a big fuss about the PC doing horrific or monsterous things. Only a few npcs have any reaction to the drow you can save early on and taking into account the Commanders gift i dont think itd make that much difference if a drow is leading the crusade

[redeyedraven]

Originally posted by Drake:

They're just not a race you can play in any campaign.

There is a DLC that adds a roguelike-style dungeon tho.

[Shahadem]

Originally posted by Drake:

You don't play a vampire, you play a dhampir, which is different (a dhampyr is the offspring of a woman and a vampire).
In the north of the avestan, there is a big community of vampires (especially in the ustalav, which is just on the border of the worldwound), so dhampirs are not uncommon there.
Tiefling, like aasimar are common planar scions, it's not that rare, you even see a few as npcs.

Drows on the other hand are way more difficult to justify. First, a lot of drows worship demons, so they might just get killed on sight when entering kenabres, instead of being rescued, not even talking being tracked down by elves from kyonin.
Second, drows very rarely interact with people from the surface, they either just dwell undergroud in the darklands or disguise themselves to pursue shady deeds in dark corners of some cities.

They're just not a race you can play in any campaign.

A lot of humans also worship demons but for some reason humans aren't kill on sight...

Also what about that goblin in Kingmaker? He managed ok.

[Schlumpsha]

Originally posted by Shahadem:

A lot of humans also worship demons but for some reason humans aren't kill on sight...

Drow are killed on sight since there are no non-evil drow in Pathfinder. None. They are a irredeemable bunch like that. So the "shoot first, ask later" approach is the right call 9 out of 10 to make. Half-drow have a bit more leeway in that regard, but usually wind up dead in many corners of Golarion as well. Including inside drow ruled parts of the Darklands for being too weak. The situation of full blooded drow and half-drow on Golarion are starkly dissimilar to humans who just so happen to be closet cultist, really.

Originally posted by Shahadem:

Also what about that goblin in Kingmaker? He managed ok.

We never got playable goblins in Kingmaker precisely because they didn't fit into the game's setting. No one would agree to the coronation of a goblin king and its (in)ability of leading a country. Much less one in where 70+% are humans. Hence why Owlcat didn't made them playable in their first (and second) game even though goblins had a dynamic race model with showing equipment. That extra work was mainly due to reaching the Nok-Nok kickstarter stretch goal. Nok-Nok was never meant to be much more than a funny sidekick. And the writing reflects that walking joke character.

Though there are still mods for Kingmaker to unlock said goblin race to the player. Which, while still massively immersion breaking, is quite hilarious.

[Max Kojote, M.SC]

The reason for Nok-Nok also carries to our kobold friend in WotR. There's a reason why we have no playable kobolds either.

Note that unlike Dhampir and Tieflings (who may have evil 'in their blood' but no societal pressure to adhere to it), Drow are raised in a supremacist society that treat other races as "slaves or not yet slaves". With some making the rank of "servitor". And elves making the rank of "target for ruination". Combine that with the fact that nonconformists usually don't live very long and the fact that Pathfinder (to my knowledge) did not have a Drizz't character for potential redemption. It's not that there can't be any good drow, but we have no examples and ones who might have played the Drizz't role will play the role of corpse instead.

I mean, nothing is stopping them from possibly including something in the future. But it may need a bit of a stretch to write in.

[King of Games]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

No one would agree to the coronation of a goblin king

Thats true, but the PC in Wotr is a different circumstance. If a drow or goblin was given the gift, the queen could have them executed for being a goblin/drow but also lose their ace in the hole to have a fighting chance against the demon hordes.

I mentioned above about my PC being a evil bloodthristy Dhampir who devours humans and demons alike in the open and no one sees this as a problem. Same with Witches, they are shown to be hunted and often killed on sight with Embers story, but yet the PC still has the option to pick the Witch class.

As far as being hunted by other drow, that would make some interesting encounters throughout the game, i think thatd be a fun addition to a dlc.

[anfindel13]

However, in Pathfinder, both Dhampir and Witches are accepted in various countries, cultures and societies. Dark elves are deemed "kill on sight" by all other elven cultures and societies, throughout the world - hunting parties are sent out to seek out and execute any and all dark elves, no quarter given. There's even a dark elf character in the game, and one of the quests involves this very issue.

Were the Commander a Dark Elf, elven assassins would be raining down - elven lands would likely break off any and all diplomacy and trade with the Queen, for backing a dark elf.

I cannot imagine her taking a chance on putting a dark elf in charge of a big chunk of her forces, finances and so on.

[King of Games]

Originally posted by anfindel13:

However, in Pathfinder, both Dhampir and Witches are accepted in various countries, cultures and societies. Dark elves are deemed "kill on sight" by all other elven cultures and societies, throughout the world - hunting parties are sent out to seek out and execute any and all dark elves, no quarter given. There's even a dark elf character in the game, and one of the quests involves this very issue.

Were the Commander a Dark Elf, elven assassins would be raining down - elven lands would likely break off any and all diplomacy and trade with the Queen, for backing a dark elf.

I cannot imagine her taking a chance on putting a dark elf in charge of a big chunk of her forces, finances and so on.

i dont think the queen has much of a choice with how dire the current circumstances are, its seems bery very likely without the Commanders intervention the demons will over run everyone.

It would add some new dynamics with diplomacy with elven nations, they could give the player a chance to win them over or i guess let the elves fend for themselves against the demons.

Yes i finished the drow quest and was disappointed you could recruit her as a companion. Considering a crazy mutant cannibal, another crazy cannibals, and a succubus were party options.
Speaking of which with how insane and evil Camellia is I dont understand why she didnt start turning into a drow since that is how drow lore works in pathfinder

[Schlumpsha]

Originally posted by King of Games:

Speaking of which with how insane and evil Camellia is I dont understand why she didnt start turning into a drow since that is how drow lore works in pathfinder

Gotta be an elf for that. Cam's a half-elf.