armiger vs rogue vs fighter vs slayer?

[snuggleform]

How do you guys rank their martial abilities? I know it can be complicated. Why should I pick one over the others for the martial slot?

[Lou the Lou]

They're all good. Like different flavors of ice cream. Fighter is vanilla, rogue is chocolate, armiger is vanilla with chocolate chips, and slayer is rocky road.

It's personal preference, really. Slayer is a little more active with its studied target, and the fighters get more feats, rogues get sneak attack... what do you want them to do?

[snuggleform]

I'm just looking for someone who doesn't have spells to cast (so not an eldritch rogue for instsance) and is just good at pushing out auto attacks.

I don't mind clicking study target once in a while - does that make the slayer better because he has to push a button once in a while? Does the rogue's sneak attack do more damage overall because the rogue can't naturally wear heavier armor and has a condition to meet for sneak attack? Is fighter the best becase of the massive amount of combat feats? I don't even know what the armiger's selling point is honestly.

[Beldr]

Mutation warrior and basic paladin are the best classes for auto attack + occasional button press.

[Lou the Lou]

Originally posted by Beldr:

Mutation warrior and basic paladin are the best classes for auto attack + occasional button press.

Paladin, definitely. Really nice passive bonuses, good buffs, and Mark of Justice. Built right, they're crazy good in this campaign.

Originally posted by snuggleform:

I'm just looking for someone who doesn't have spells to cast (so not an eldritch rogue for instsance) and is just good at pushing out auto attacks.

I don't mind clicking study target once in a while - does that make the slayer better because he has to push a button once in a while? Does the rogue's sneak attack do more damage overall because the rogue can't naturally wear heavier armor and has a condition to meet for sneak attack? Is fighter the best becase of the massive amount of combat feats? I don't even know what the armiger's selling point is honestly.

If you don't have any martial class in your party, make it a Paladin. They're tanky, do great damage, and buff the party just by existing. Sneak attack is big damage, but rogues are flimsy. Melee glass cannons, but they kill things really quickly.

[fulf]

Don't sleep on demonslayer ranger either. Nothing is stopping you from playing melee and ranger styles can also be a huge boon in that regard. Not to mention an animal companion is bonus damage and an extra body.

Armiger and base-class fighter are super similar, all those combat feats can let you do some great things but generally mutation warrior or 2h fighter are better picks if you want to be 'optimal' about it.

Rogue has 3/4th BAB but hitting stuff is rarely an issue because you're unlikely to want to use piranha stance (negligible damage boost in the grand scheme of those sneak attack dice). You kind of have to play dual wield unless you go Rowdy so most Rogues end up feeling the same I think. There are more than a few enemies that cannot be flanked, though.

Slayer gets around that problem by being a full BAB with more incentive to use power attack/piranha. And they get ranger styles. Rogue has more out-of-combat utility with all those proficiencies, Slayer's more versatile in combat but I think (?) lower damage under optimal circumstances. Very easy and powerful class to play.

[Azure-Ghost]

Fighters get the most feats and Access to special Fighter Talents like improved Weapon Focus / Weapon Specialisation to improve their damage with a chosen weapon, they also get armor training allowing them to suffer less penalties (full speed medium armor rather early and heavy armor at mid levels as well as penaltys to body skillchecks (stealth/mobility/athletics)) from wearing armor and get a higher amount of dex bonus while doing so (normally you get only max +1 armor from dex while wearing the heavier armors, fighters get up to +5)

Armiger is pretty much the same as a fighter but loses 2 bonus feats and changes the fighters anti fear saving throw bonus to anti charm/compulsion (which are stuff like sleep / hold insanity spells and such) and gains 1 more skillrank per level up , knowledge world as a class skill as well as being able to choose one of the hell knight orders, giving unique boni (for example the scourge order reduces the willsaves of all nearby enemies by 2-4 for 3 rounds if you land a killing blow, helping your will influencing effects, Order of the Nail gives you one favoured enemy like a ranger would (+2-6 attack rolls/dmg against a type of enemy depending on your level) or the Pyre order who gives you selfheal (healing 5 -15 hp per round depending on your level for as many rounds as you have levels in that class) each time you take fire damage.

Slayer only gains a Sneakattack Dice every 3 instead of every 2 levels as rogues and vivisectionists get but they have full BAB (higher hit chance and higher amounts of attacks , gain Weaponstyles (allowing you to take specific feats without the required attributes like the two weapon fighting feats without having any points in dex) and have the the study target ability which gives them additional damage and hitchange to a chosen target (autocasts on sneakattacking)
They also start with material weapon prof. so they have a better starting weapon selection than rogues.
Oh they also only gain 1 less feat than fighters (miss the one on lvl1) but have to choose from a list similar to rogues bonus feats instead of the fighter ones.

[snuggleform]

Good information guys thanks.

Maybe let me ask this another way - which martial class has the highest attack bonus (with passives and such, not just BAB)? I really hate getting into situations where the enemy has crazy AC and I just can't land any hits at all.

[Azure-Ghost]

There isn't that much difference that it would matter in that case, you're better off reducing the enemies AC by causing them to be flatfooted (demoralizing/flanking for example) using debuffs like the witch/shaman hexes, remove their armor item bonus (if they wear any) via combat maneuver sunder armor, dispell their buffs (either dispell spells of buffs/weaponeffects like holy weapon that can cause dispell on hit)
and at the same time buff your material classes (bard song, attack bonus spells, strengh/dex buffs)