Build Discussion: would "Pure Seeker" be good?

[Lyserus]

By "pure seeker" I mean:
Seeker(sorc)5+Seeker(oracle)5+Mystic Theurge 10

You get:
1. Charisma as your only main cast stat

2. With two lv5 seeker feats you can get the two spell penetration feats (or taking them with other means and use seeker feats for later, since you are gonna get them pretty late)

3. Of course, access to both arcane and divine up util lv7 spells, with the tons of slots and spontaneous casting (get abundant spell for maximum effect), you will never run out of spells in any situation

I am just a noob so please advice on if this is viable (or versatile) enough to be fun, and any suggestions to further improve it is welcome :)

[Lyserus]

The reason I come up this build idea because:
1. I dont consider spellbook merge (or legendary lv 40)0as those are path specific and I dont want to restrict the build to a path
2. I love spontaneous casters way more
3. Divine arcane Johnny Sue fantasy (XD) actually I just want a caster that can do all things: namely damage, cc, support and heal

[MjKorz]

Mystic Theurge is arguably the worst spellcaster build you can make.

You don't want "tons of slots and spontaneous casting" with massively delayed spell progression. You want rapid spell progression and a small number of core spells that actually work 95%-100% of the time.

If you want to play a "Seeker", just play a Seeker Sorcerer 20.

[Raikon]

Might not be that bad as an azata. You could go full support mode. Still, might not be bad, does not mean its good. The majority of spells in this game just arent very impactful. One of the reasons the prestige class isnt very good. As a newer player your probably better off going seeker oracle for angel, or seeker sorcerer for lich.

[Koveras]

Mystic Theurge isn't even particularly good for legends. It is the dream concept that does not work, a perpetual motion engine.

[mudakonn]

Running out of spells is not really a issue - running out of lvl 9 spells really is. But if your spell progression lags then you are way behind with lots of casts of some irrelevant spells.

On contrary being AHEAD of level progression - running reduced party, doing skillcheks for yourself leads immense power spikes. You are dominating with higher spells, higher caster level and DC-s

[hilburnashua]

You already know you won't be getting 8th+ spells. What you get out of this build will depend a bit on what you intend to do with it and what the other members of your party can do. As a buffer you can actually hit the party with almost, all of them really, buffs in the game except group mind blank depending on what spells you take for sorcerer/oracle. With Greater Enduring Spell most of those good buffs will last 24 hours. But you won't be getting those buffs for 4 levels behind the other party members (so when Daerun can cast 5th your character will be casting 3rd lvl spells) which does have some obvious down sides but is still workable.

As a nuker (and I did this on my way to Legendary so I was a sorcerer/oracle/mystic theurge all the way to the start of act 5) you are also perfectly viable. Ray spells (scorching) will be your primary weapon for a long time. At level 20 Hellfire Ray will be better but not really until then. Metamagically enhanced spells take a full round to cast (so long as the spell isn't also quickened, preferably by means of a rod). Fireballs. controlled fireballs, fire snake and firestorm and sirroco (enhanced with selective + mythic favorite metamagic to exclude your friends) will be your bread and butter AoEs. All of which can be enhanced with rods to help with damage. Most of the other elements don't provide enough good spells to really be worth it and there are at least 3 items in the game that give additional damage to fire spells, and I don't recall any that do something similar to cold/electricity/acid or even negative. You won't have the raw damage capability of someone running hellfire rays as a lvl 20 caster, and you will have more resists even with mythic spell penetration, but it is far from an unworkable build (at least on Core or lower). And a lot of the Mythic Paths work well with it (Legendary, Angel, Aeon. Gold Dragon not so much and I don't have any experience with the others although watching a friend Trickster would also be very, very strong).

As a debuffer/controller .... I tend to think you want the higher level spells as much as possible and you tend to need the Undead bloodline if you want to use mind effecting spells like Hideous Laughter (which can be a stupidly powerful Best Joke, heighten metamagic and a few of the items that boost mind effecting spells). But you need to focus pretty tight into one lane to be effective if you start running into things that are immune to your abilities (like things immune to stat drain/negative levels and you are a necromancer doing enervation/curses) you are going to be grinding your teeth.

Dispeller - you won't be useful at this at all. Even Spell Specialization only adds +2 to your caster level which isn't going to be enough to realistically be removing the buffs from the enemies you want to do it the most, boss enemies.

Let us know if you find some fun builds with this.

But you won't be able to do all things effectively. Maybe on the first two difficulty settings. But with the limits of spells known, need to take metamagic feats and mythic feats to overcome spell resistance and boost DCs and the lower max spell level you can cast at respective levels you are going to have problems doing even two things. Example, as a healer your won't be getting the heal spell until you get your 6th level spells, at 16th level. Cure Serious Wound just doesn't cut it for in battle healing after level 12 or so. Also, if you picked channel energy from the oracle abilities those dice won't be increasing so they will only be useful for topping off your party after a fight. You also won't be any good at removing curses since that requires a caster check.

[t]

People will try to steer you away from Mystic theurge, and maybe they are right, but I say go for it. It is a fun and interesting build that is unique and actually quite viable in this game vs in Kingmaker or on the pen and paper.
The issues of Oracle/Sorcerer Mystic Theurge is slowed spell progression, lack of 8th and 9th level spells, and lower caster level.
However, going Lich or Angel will solve all of those issues. That is why Mystic Theurge is actually viable in Wrath of the Righteous. I wouldn't bother with Legend because it comes online at the very end of the game.

[hilburnashua]

Being able to cast 18+ 9th level spells a day makes Legend a sold build for Mystic Theurge. Sure, you cannot use it before act 5, and then you have to do a bit of running around. But as soon as you finish that you jump up to lvl 35 or so. Only real disappointment I had with Mystic Theurge and Legendary path was trying to stack Dragon Disciple and Loremaster didn't work as it should. It was adding the new caster levels directly to sorcerer/oracle levels of 4 so I was only gaining new spells as if I was a sorcerer/oracle 5 instead of 15. Bug reported it at the time but no idea if it was fixed. I know it isn't correct.

[Vae Victis]

I want spontaneous casters to be more fun but prepared are just better.

You can play anything on normal just fine but spontaneous casters are gimped on spell progression from being spontaneous and when they merge they get gimped again. They also have worse metamagic which makes them more appropriate for melee builds (in my mind).

[Azure-Ghost]

"actually I just want a caster that can do all things: namely damage, cc, support and heal"
Sounds like any Divine Caster to me. Especially Druids as they have the most diverse spellbooks... only issue is you need something to ignore Demons Electricity immunity as most Druid Spells are of that element.
Shamans are a bit less in the damage spell department but bring in better melee and add Hexes to the pool (including one that temporary removes enemies elemental immunity/resistance).

[Shahadem]

That isn't Pure Seeker...

[IlluminaZero]

Mystic Theurge makes it non-Pure Seeker as Shahadem mentioned - Due to delayed levels it also seems to work better with prepared casters due to ability to start leveling with Mystic Theurge sooner.

Mystic Theruge; and other prestige caster classes, will allow Legend to go > caster level 20. So thats a perk and something to consider.

You're probably better off going Seeker(Lich)->Legend(Seeker) or Seeker(Angel)->Legend(Seeker) for the Lich/Angel unique spells tho. You would have an expanded spell book, your progression would be smoother, and you would be a TRUE pure Seeker. ;)

[IlluminaZero]

While I initially thought this was inherently sub-optimal the "expanded arsenal" bug(?) + all the extra feats might lead to some really disgusting DCs with Legend.

[SmallGespenst]

honestly mixing Divine and Arcane casting makes for a poor build at any time since any team based RPG rewards specialisation much more than generalisation. sure you *can* go generalised but you'd get enough spell slots anyway and you'll be missing a lot of the high end spells, and killing both Bloodline progression and Mystery progression. also the Mystic Theurge capstone isn't in Wrath, so you don't get the once per day "cast two spells at once with +2 DC and Spell pen" that's a pretty hefty pay-off for table-top Theurges.

[Killial]

I played Mystic Theurge / Mythical Trickster route and I can tell - you don't need THAT MANY spells in a whole game. In addition, you will not have enough slots to have too wide spells arsenal.
And that's not even counting metamagic.....

Moreover, at a certain point, there are so many spells and metamagic variations available that you just start to get lost and confused... (especially if you are a noob and don't know what spells are really worth to use in the game).
Also that feel of lack all the quick access panels.
It's just a chaos (useless chaos).


The only real reason to play Mystic Theurge I see this is for roleplay.
Or... if you really like having tons of spells to choose from, just for the sake of the sense of quantity and the illusion of choice.