Use Magic Device skill, how to?

[Jhonrock]

So, I rolled a merc Eldritch Archer yesterday and I'm really impressed with how good this class is. I'm still at lvl 12 but the amount of damage I can dish out with this class is insane, my sorcerer can't even hold a candle to it.

But there is a thing that is annoying me with this class. I CAN'T USE HURRICANE BOW. Seriously? A caster-archer who cannot use such ideal spell? A ranger can use it. A wizard can use it. But a ranger/wizard hybrid can't?

So, to compensate this deficiency, I was thinking of using the scroll, but I also got suprised with the fact that the Eldritch Archer class can't use the hurricane bow scroll without the UMD skill.

And here are the questions.

How this skill works? Like, how many levels of this skill I need to have to use a certain scroll? Does my character level coun'ts toward the caster level for the purpose of spell damage or duration? And what about my metamagic roads, does them apply?

I tried to understand how this skills works but got really confused. I never used it before.

[Invisible]

First of all the skill level gives you a bonus for the d20. Every staff / scroll has a diffculty ratiing for the D20 roll. So the higher your Magic Device skill the more likley you will cast it. If you fail nothing happens and you can try it again (scroll is not destroyed). In combat situations a high skill is neccessary to cast something realiable.

Hurricane Bow you can cast before the combat starts, so you can "miss" multiple times unitl you have success.

Casting Level is sadly the level on the staff /scroll. So if you have a scroll with level 1 caster level it will be cast as level 1 wizard etc.

High level staffs are later available with caster level 7 or 10.

As magus class you should have access to "staff mastery" magus arcana. This can help to get a higher level for staffs.

Magic device is only needed for not class stuff.

[Bishop]

Originally posted by Jhonrock:

How this skill works? Like, how many levels of this skill I need to have to use a certain scroll? Does my character level coun'ts toward the caster level for the purpose of spell damage or duration? And what about my metamagic roads, does them apply?

The roll is d20 + umd skill against 20 + spell level if I remember correctly. So should be 21 for hurricane bow. Or just 20 from wand. The caster level is defined by scroll, there are some ways to improve it (scroll wizard subclass, trickster umd feat etc.) but otherwise it's static.

But magus is an arcane caster and while they don't have that spell in their book they should be able to cast it from scrolls without umd check. Or so I thought.

[Jhonrock]

Originally posted by Invisible:

First of all the skill level gives you a bonus for the d20. Every staff / scroll has a diffculty ratiing for the D20 roll. So the higher your Magic Device skill the more likley you will cast it. If you fail nothing happens and you can try it again (scroll is not destroyed). In combat situations a high skill is neccessary to cast something realiable.

Hurricane Bow you can cast before the combat starts, so you can "miss" multiple times unitl you have success.

Casting Level is sadly the level on the staff /scroll. So if you have a scroll with level 1 caster level it will be cast as level 1 wizard etc.

High level staffs are later available with caster level 7 or 10.

As magus class you should have access to "staff mastery" magus arcana. This can help to get a higher level for staffs.

Magic device is only needed for not class stuff.

Uuummmm... so I should look for a wand instead of the scroll? Is it even possible to buy wand for that?

Originally posted by Bishop:

Originally posted by Jhonrock:

How this skill works? Like, how many levels of this skill I need to have to use a certain scroll? Does my character level coun'ts toward the caster level for the purpose of spell damage or duration? And what about my metamagic roads, does them apply?

The roll is d20 + umd skill against 20 + spell level if I remember correctly. So should be 21 for hurricane bow. Or just 20 from wand. The caster level is defined by scroll, there are some ways to improve it (scroll wizard subclass, trickster umd feat etc.) but otherwise it's static.

But magus is an arcane caster and while they don't have that spell in their book they should be able to cast it from scrolls without umd check. Or so I thought.

Yeah, kinda bonkers the fact that a Magus subclass can't use an arcane spell scroll, but thats how it is.

[Stink Bug]

Originally posted by Bishop:

Originally posted by Jhonrock:

But magus is an arcane caster and while they don't have that spell in their book they should be able to cast it from scrolls without umd check. Or so I thought.

It’s not on the Magus spell list (which is NOT the same as the sorc/wizard’s, Magus is more limited to “pay” for their martial abilities) so no casting without UMD. And for the OP, it’s not on the Magus spell list in the first place because the overarching class itself is focused on melee, this ranged archetype is the exception.

[jsaving]

Often, people who want to role-play an eldritch archer will multiclass into eldritch scoundrel to gain access to the full wizard spell list. The meta build would be 2 levels of eldritch archer, 8 levels of eldritch scoundrel and 10 levels of eldritch knight though I personally prefer EA2/ES12/EK6.

[Ghost]

there's really only one choice here... skillmax UMD

[mbradtke]

whats the point to multiclass in eldritch archer 2 levels though? you loose scoundrel progress and for what? there are better dips probably, f.e 2 warrior or whatever full BAB class, i dont think the spellstrike feature is worth it to be honest c.c not at higher levels so much, does spellcombat even work with bow?

[Bishop]

Originally posted by mbradtke:

whats the point to multiclass in eldritch archer 2 levels though? you loose scoundrel progress and for what? there are better dips probably, f.e 2 warrior or whatever full BAB class, i dont think the spellstrike feature is worth it to be honest c.c not at higher levels so much, does spellcombat even work with bow?

2 level dip in eldritch archer gives plus one attack per round at the cost of -2 ab to all other attacks (well -3 technically, magus is a medium bab class). It may be not that bad on lower difficulties or for characters that already have high ab.

[jsaving]

The normal -2 AB penalty from spellstrike doesn't apply to the eldritch archer version, plus splashing those 2 EA levels enables you to fire scoundrel spells like scorching/hellfire ray as part of a spellstrike. Not every ES should use a bow, but if you do want to go that route then you'd absolutely benefit from the EA2 splash.

[Bishop]

Originally posted by jsaving:

The normal -2 AB penalty from spellstrike doesn't apply to the eldritch archer version, plus splashing those 2 EA levels enables you to fire scoundrel spells like scorching/hellfire ray as part of a spellstrike. Not every ES should use a bow, but if you do want to go that route then you'd absolutely benefit from the EA2 splash.

Nah it uses the same ability as melee magus, just modifies it to affect ranged combat. It gives the same -2 penalty.

[jsaving]

Not sure where my mind was there, of course you are right. One other benefit of having the extra attack is, if you've gotten to at least 12th level as an eldritch scoundrel and taken an advanced talent with an on-hit effect (like crippling strike), then you're able to apply it one extra time per round.