What's the point picking paladin?

[Revon8701]

when a cleric just does it better >.> "

1.in almost every avenue of skills

2.not restricted into one path (lawful good)

3.better spells over all

4. can choose crusader cleric and be a front fighter with ease

like besides fear negation , and the are immune to disease etc. (clerics can learn spells for that)

what possible reason should u pick a paladin ?

[MjKorz]

Cleric does not compete with the Paladin, they both synergize perfectly well. A perfect party has both.

Cleric with Glory domain buffs Paladin with Touch of Glory for +20 charisma -> Paladin casts Mark of Justice and you might as well forget the existence of enemy AC:

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2810080099

Here's also a funny piece of information: the perfect Paladin is also a Hellknight.

[Dryad]

Paladins also have Charisma bonus to saves, smite evil, can boost ally saves and can spot heal afflictions such as fatigue and exhaustion

[Razer]

The same question can be asked of any paladin vs cleric in any DnD game or world. Clerics are generally always better. So, Roleplaying I would say. You get a few unique abilities. Paladins will have full bab progression and can do more damage and have more hitpoints. Other than that, due to the cleric spell list they will be superior. So choose superior spellcasting over superior damage dealing.

[Schlumpsha]

To roleplay an especially annoying holier-than-thou hypocrite? They even come equipped with a stick in their behinds if Order of the Stick is to be trusted.

More seriously... there is little reason to pick Paladin over Warpriest. Even Owlcat thoughts were similar in their decision of shelving the Antipaladin class for Warpriest in Staunton's case.

[Revon8701]

Originally posted by MjKorz:

Cleric does not compete with the Paladin, they both synergize perfectly well. A perfect party has both.

Cleric with Glory domain buffs Paladin with Touch of Glory for +20 charisma -> Paladin casts Mark of Justice and you might as well forget the existence of enemy AC.

i agree on that point sir i give u that but ... is there not any other classes that debuff as good as a paladin ?

WITH over all better damage ?

like don't get me wrong i love paladins but i feel like they are just meat shields with debuff armor spells , and or a semi ok heal

like low-mid tier damage

[Dryad]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

To roleplay an especially annoying holier-than-thou hypocrite? They even come equipped with a stick in their behinds if Order of the Stick is to be trusted.

Seelah called, she would like to know where her stick is.

[MjKorz]

Originally posted by Revon8701:

Originally posted by MjKorz:

Cleric does not compete with the Paladin, they both synergize perfectly well. A perfect party has both.

Cleric with Glory domain buffs Paladin with Touch of Glory for +20 charisma -> Paladin casts Mark of Justice and you might as well forget the existence of enemy AC.

i agree on that point sir i give u that but ... is there not any other classes that debuff as good as a paladin ?

WITH over all better damage ?

like don't get me wrong i love paladins but i feel like they are just meat shields with debuff armor spells , and or a semi ok heal

like low-mid tier damage

Paladins do not debuff, they give your party massive attack bonus vs single high value targets and this attack bonus stacks with all the cleric attack bonuses. This is a MASSIVE bonus in the ranges of 20+ in the endgame.

Of course, there are alternative ways of beating enemy AC. You can disable the enemy with a DC caster and make him helpless or you can just instantly kill a high value target with instant death spells or you can stack any number of debuffs, but the paladin is still extremely and uniquely powerful and is in no way inferior to the cleric, because these two classes do not compete, they synergize.

[Schlumpsha]

Originally posted by Dryad:

Seelah called, she would like to know where her stick is.

No problem. She should make an appointment with her local healer. They can most likely provide her with a freshly scribed radiograph scroll displaying all kinds of lost objects.

[Dryad]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

More seriously... there is little reason to pick Paladin over Warpriest. Even Owlcat thoughts were similar in their decision of shelving the Antipaladin class for Warpriest in Staunton's case.

I don't think it's paladin that's the problem. Anti paladin is the class with the problem when you read its ethos and rules and realize that so many more people would be clamoring for kill anything dialogue options and TT players have stories of them being used to justify murderhobo tendencies unnecessarily.

[Gorwe]

Mark of Justice?

But yeah. Besides that, both Cleric and Warpriest are better. Possibly even Purifier Oracle. But I can't overstate how useful MoJ is vs high priorities.

[Dryad]

Originally posted by Gorwe:

Mark of Justice?

But yeah. Besides that, both Cleric and Warpriest are better. Possibly even Purifier Oracle.

Never used Mark of Justice and I rampaged through the campaign on Core. Both my MC and Seelah in party, no Sosiel until the end. Paladin is quite capable of performing very well.

[Schlumpsha]

Originally posted by Dryad:

I don't think it's paladin that's the problem. Anti paladin is the class with the problem when you read its ethos and rules and realize that so many more people would be clamoring for kill anything dialogue options and TT players have stories of them being used to justify murderhobo tendencies unnecessarily.

Paladin, Antipaladin... same class, same problems. Only difference is that one is the ex-class of the other. Both are equally ill suited when it comes to their ethoses and rules. Mainly because each deity will demand their own flavour of good or evil.

Though Antipaladins have it more easy, given that some archetypes are either any evil or Lawful Evil instead. Which would work better for Devil, Lich and Swarm inside WotR. Paladins on the other hand are already a pain because of the rather limited Good and Lawful choices, most which conflict with their guidelines anyway.

[Gregorovitch]

The big point of a paladin is smite/mark of justice.

[Dryad]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

Originally posted by Dryad:

I don't think it's paladin that's the problem. Anti paladin is the class with the problem when you read its ethos and rules and realize that so many more people would be clamoring for kill anything dialogue options and TT players have stories of them being used to justify murderhobo tendencies unnecessarily.

Paladin, Antipaladin... same class, same problems. Only difference is that one is the ex-class of the other. Both are equally ill suited when it comes to their ethoses and rules. Mainly because each deity will demand their own flavour of good or evil.

Though Antipaladins have it more easy, given that some archetypes are either any evil or Lawful Evil instead. Which would work better for Devil, Lich and Swarm inside WotR. Paladins on the other hand are already a pain because of the rather limited Good and Lawful choices, most which conflict with their guidelines anyway.

I disagree on Antipaladin being easier to roleplay than Paladin, but that's not a rant I'm going to go on here.

The secondary reason I think we didn't get it for this game is the enemies you meet. Since Antipaladin base requires good aligned enemies to function as well as Paladin does against evil enemies and you're primarily fighting against evil-aligned enemies, paladin easily is far more functional than Antipaladin just by virtue of the different smites they have.

[Aliceskysareblue]

Originally posted by Revon8701:

when a cleric just does it better >.> "

1.in almost every avenue of skills

2.not restricted into one path (lawful good)

3.better spells over all

4. can choose crusader cleric and be a front fighter with ease

like besides fear negation , and the are immune to disease etc. (clerics can learn spells for that)

what possible reason should u pick a paladin ?

higher hp, higher bab, crusaders do not compete with paladins.

paladins smite evil and mark of justice really help against demon. they also can either get a mount or get dvine bond and several weapon enchants which really help against enemies.

they arent caster those spells are largely utilitarian.


there is a antipaladin mod, works pretty well, although as others say the classes main feature smite good is uselesa at least until the capstone, tyrant though works better.