Ascendant Poison

[Gorwe]

Is there any mod or such that implements this? I could've sworn I saw a mod that had it. But it was github, so good lukk on finding it again!

[Schlumpsha]

You are looking for Magic Time[github.com]. That one has Mythic Poison. I'd wait until the mod gets updated for 1.3 though.

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

You are looking for Magic Time[github.com]. That one has Mythic Poison. I'd wait until the mod gets updated for 1.3 though.

Don't care. Remember, I'm on 1.17 and I get the full experience(just found a lovely mod that fixes the HD spells - unfortunately, not the Dictum family).

Thank you very much. Now I am pretty certain what I want for my Lich. Arc.Emforce or Cult Leader. Now, that is the question! (Blight Druid is for the Swarm I think)

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

You are looking for Magic Time[github.com]. That one has Mythic Poison. I'd wait until the mod gets updated for 1.3 though.

One question though. What's the situation with Demons and Disease spells? Are they immune to that as well? Finally, it'd be nice to have Ascendant Psyche(ignores Mind Immunity), but meh.

[Schlumpsha]

Originally posted by Gorwe:

One question though. What's the situation with Demons and Disease spells? Are they immune to that as well? Finally, it'd be nice to have Ascendant Psyche(ignores Mind Immunity), but meh.

Not as a rule. Only specific demon kinds are immune to diseases as well. Noteable omox and shir.

Sadly, no Ascendant Psyche available as of now through mods.

[MjKorz]

Ascendant Poison and Psyche are great ideas, the more ways to bypass various immunities (at a cost) - the better. Do these mythic abilities come from some kind of Pathfinder rulebook or are they entirely homebrew?

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by MjKorz:

Ascendant Poison and Psyche are great ideas, the more ways to bypass various immunities (at a cost) - the better. Do these mythic abilities come from some kind of Pathfinder rulebook or are they entirely homebrew?

Don't know whether they exist at all. They're just an idea to allow more builds.

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

Originally posted by Gorwe:

One question though. What's the situation with Demons and Disease spells? Are they immune to that as well? Finally, it'd be nice to have Ascendant Psyche(ignores Mind Immunity), but meh.

Not as a rule. Only specific demon kinds are immune to diseases as well. Noteable omox and shir.

Sadly, no Ascendant Psyche available as of now through mods.

How about Ability Damage Immunity? I sense a NASTY combo with an Assassin(which I can play now! <3 ). I believe only Gallu are immune to it?

And with all of this, I can play a Blight Druid later to see the Swarm. Beautiful. Thank you very much!

[Schlumpsha]

Both Baphomet and Nocticula are immune to ability damage. Probably Deskari too. Not much else on the demonic front. Gallus are immune to bleed but not to ability damage. Oh, both gibrileth and coloxus are also immune to diseases. Forgot about those.

[MMJ]

Demon lords are immune to a lot of things in general, first and foremost all the spells/class feature and whatever of the "you fail your save ? You're dead !" type.

[Gorwe]

How important would "Ascendant Psyche" be in reality? It is a very nice idea, but I don't think it's as necessary as Asc.Ltng or Asc.Psn(or even Asc.Fire) are.

[Schlumpsha]

I'd say pretty important for those specialising in Enchantment in general. Lots of critters are immune to mind effects. And should Ascendant Psyche also play a part in the fear department, then even more so.

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

I'd say pretty important for those specialising in Enchantment in general. Lots of critters are immune to mind effects. And should Ascendant Psyche also play a part in the fear department, then even more so.

I mean, aren't Serpent / Undead Arcanas a thing? What would remain mind immune then? Vermin? That's like 1pt of Crossblooded Sorc.

[Schlumpsha]

Yes, and while nice they are very limiting. Not mentioning build specific. Any non-sorcerer will have a hard time. Or sorcerers without the right bloodline for that matter.

Lots of demons and other outsiders are also immune to mind effects. Plus aberrations, oozes and constructs, amongst others.

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

Yes, and while nice they are very limiting. Not mentioning build specific. Any non-sorcerer will have a hard time. Or sorcerers without the right bloodline for that matter.

Lots of demons and other outsiders are also immune to mind effects. Plus aberrations, oozes and constructs, amongst others.

Aberrations, oozes, constructs and elementals shouldn't pose any problem - there's so very few of them.

Now, which "demons and other outsiders" did you have in mind? I recall Gallu demons screwing Necro school.

[Gorwe]

Originally posted by Schlumpsha:

You are looking for Magic Time[github.com]. That one has Mythic Poison. I'd wait until the mod gets updated for 1.3 though.

That's a lovely little mod!

[MjKorz]

Originally posted by Gorwe:

How important would "Ascendant Psyche" be in reality? It is a very nice idea, but I don't think it's as necessary as Asc.Ltng or Asc.Psn(or even Asc.Fire) are.

Assuming it bypasses both Mind-affecting and Compulsion immunities? Game changing. Currently, all demon lords including Areelu are immune to Compulsion spells, which means that they are immune to ALL offensive enchantment spells... except Command and Greater Command, because these spells do not have the Compulsion descriptor (even after the latest patch that updated the descriptions of these two spells, which means Owlcat intended them to work this way).

Problem is, (Greater) Command spells are only available to divine casters (with the sole exception of Witch who gets the basic Command spell, but not the Greater variant), which means that any Enchanter that wishes to be viable from start to finish needs to be a divine caster. In theory, an arcane caster could acquire the Greater Command spell by dipping loremaster, but Loremaster is bugged and does not give you any extra spells from outside your spellbook.

Greater Command being exclusive to divine casters opens up a new can of worms: Clerics do not have the bonus feats to be good DC casters and even though Oracles can get a decent number of feats by going Seeker, they have extremely limited Enchantment spell arsenal (no mind fog or hideous laughter which is a crippling disadvantage) since there is no Enchantment focused Mystery.

Alternatively, Greater Command can also be acquired by an Azata from its mythic spellbook, but this presents another problem: Azata does not merge spellbooks, which means that Azata mythic spell DC does not scale with the main casting stat. This creates a massive DC disparity between Azata regular Enchantment spells and Enchantment spells from the regular Azata spellbook. My personal Azata Enchanter build casts Mass Hold Monster at a DC of 83 (without taking into account will debuffs from stuff like Display of Power and robe of Mephistopheles), but Greater Command is cast from the mythic spellbook at a DC of only 65 due to no main casting stat scaling.

If an arcane caster could actually have the means to bypass Compulsion (and mind-affecting to a lesser degree) immunities, there would no longer be a need to rely on Greater Command and they could actually use their entire Enchantment arsenal without having to jump through major hoops. Any good caster mythic archetype could work as an Enchanter: Demon, Azata, Aeon. Currently, only Azata can be a truly effective enchanter.