Can someone please explain Eldritch Archer?

[Brian Sirith]

I restated to it and now Hilor is dead and I'd like to figure how it works.

Magus apparently can hit AND cast in the same turn. As I understand the archer can:

- Either cast a spell OR use his bow.
- Use certain class abilities to enhance his bow / ranged weapon.

I'm not sure whats the point of having spells? Switching when needed?

[kaymarciy]

Originally posted by Brian Sirith:

- Either cast a spell OR use his bow.

No, as long as you toggle on their "Ranged Spell Combat", Eldritch Archer can cast a spell AND use his bow at the same time. And if you activate "Ranged Spellstrike" your ranged spell will be delivered with the arrow. This would be useful in situations when your chance to hit with your weapon is somehow higher than your chance to hit with rays (pretty much never; if I recall correctly, Archers don't get Dimensional Strike and Arcane Strike isn't worth much). That would also cause you to have a marginally higher chance to crit with the spell...

At least it used to work in Kingmaker unless they somehow broke it in WoTR

[Rhapsody]

It's not limited to just bows either, and the effect extends to spells from other spellbooks as well.

[Stink Bug]

Also, a spell-combating ELdritch Archer (and magus in general) are more useful in Turn-based mode where the attack and casting animations don’t delay hitting the enemy. Also much easier to use swift actions too.

[seeker1]

I tried it out. I thought it might be close to the arcane archer (which I think exists in Pathfinder but wasn't implemented in the game). It really isn't.

An arcane archer can "load" a spell into an arrow and then switch its trigger point to impact. So even without reach spell, they could, for example, put some touch spell "onto" an arrow and have it trigger when it hits. Even cooler, they could load something that normally emanates out from the caster like Stormbolts and have it "detonate" from where the arrow impacts. This is without even getting into the other ways they can magically enhance arrows (beyond spells).

It's true I think they are limited to bows. I think the eldritch archer can indeed use crossbows, staff slings, even thrown weapons with ranged spellstrike. But otherwise, I like the arcane archer better and wish we had it.

Basically, the EA gets to fire a ray or orther ranged touch spell and hit with a missile in the same round. They basically cast spells, and they fire their weapon at the same time, for a double hit. I found it underwhelming and uninteresting. Arcane archer would have been much cooler.

[Selvokaz]

I brought up a similar question and everyone jumped down my neck, simply because I think I pointed out that and it might not work anymore, but at some point you could use a magus to use spellstrike with a ranged weapon, again i dont know if it still works, but it did in the past and thus made EA seem pointless.

[-0[]0-]

Originally posted by Brian Sirith:

I restated to it and now Hilor is dead and I'd like to figure how it works.

Magus apparently can hit AND cast in the same turn. As I understand the archer can:

- Either cast a spell OR use his bow.
- Use certain class abilities to enhance his bow / ranged weapon.

I'm not sure whats the point of having spells? Switching when needed?

An arcane archer can toggle on ranged and touch spells [but not AOE spells] to hit with their bow, as an extra attack.

One major benefit is that you can develop the skills to be able to actually hit those shots [being able to shoot into combat without penalty etc] so I find that for specific spells the Magus is far more effective at delivering/hitting.

What I do is take a couple of levels of Slayer and get some Bow related feats so I can use my bow better, then I go into Magus.

[seeker1]

So here's something interesting. Let's say you have a ray spell with a range of 50 feet, but you're using (say) a throwing axe with range of 20 feet.

Your ranged spellstrike still has only a 20 ft range.

Also, if you want your missile to "deliver" say a shocking grasp or vampiric touch, a "true" touch spell, you need reach metamagic.

Which, again, even without a bow or missile, another mage could do with reach metamagic, anyway.

[-0[]0-]

Originally posted by seeker1:

Also, if you want your missile to "deliver" say a shocking grasp or vampiric touch, a "true" touch spell, you need reach metamagic.

Which, again, even without a bow or missile, another mage could do with reach metamagic, anyway.

In Kingmaker I believe there is another feat which extends "touch range", or it is automatically extended. Now I'm curious.

[Rhapsody]

Originally posted by seeker1:

So here's something interesting. Let's say you have a ray spell with a range of 50 feet, but you're using (say) a throwing axe with range of 20 feet.

Your ranged spellstrike still has only a 20 ft range.

Also, if you want your missile to "deliver" say a shocking grasp or vampiric touch, a "true" touch spell, you need reach metamagic.

Which, again, even without a bow or missile, another mage could do with reach metamagic, anyway.

Well, Reach metamagic feat probably isn't worth a feat slot, and it also increases spell level. Reach rods exist of course.

[seeker1]

The arcane archer prestige class does not need Reach metamagic. That's my point.

They can load an AoE or cone spell onto an arrow that normally emanates from them personally, but now the emanation/detonation point is the point of impact. Imagine there's a big ogre up front but 50 ft away with lots of goblins behind him. You hit him with an arrow that's enhanced with cone of cold from 50 feet away, and now the cone blasts all those goblins behind him.

That's really cool.

Besides, yes, they can put a "true" touch spell onto an arrow, WITHOUT reach metamagic.

I think that's really cool. The EA just can't do that. Plus there's the seeker arrows that can go through cover and concealment, even around objects, and of course, their death/slayer arrows.

[-0[]0-]

Originally posted by Brian Sirith:

I restated to it and now Hilor is dead and I'd like to figure how it works.

Magus apparently can hit AND cast in the same turn. As I understand the archer can:

- Either cast a spell OR use his bow.
- Use certain class abilities to enhance his bow / ranged weapon.

I'm not sure whats the point of having spells? Switching when needed?

Ok the answers are here, good detailed reading:

https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/185180/does-the-magus-spell-strike-work-on-both-melee-and-ranged-touch-spells

https://rpg.stackexchange.com/questions/134255/eldritch-archer-ranged-spellstrike-is-a-ray-cast-in-this-way-subject-to-armo

Here are the highlights -

For the Eldritch Archer, the Spellstrike converts 'Touch' attacks to be carried by your ammunition. [Bolt or Arrow]. Because they are no longer 'Touch' attacks, the enemy now has the benefit of their Armor for their Armor Class. [A true 'Touch' attack doesn't care about Armor]

The rays and such won't work, however other spells can be carried by the Ammunition.

For my Magus [up to around level 10 in Kingmaker] I was using Acid Arrow and Scorching ray which were working fine with the bow. So I would get the effect of those and then also multiple normal attacks with the bow. And each of those attacks could carry Arcane enhancements such as further elemental damage. When I ran out of Acid Arrow or Scorch, I could get some free specialized damage by using my cantrip acid splash or freeze ray etc.

Very powerful damage dealers who can get around a lot of specific resistances.

[Brian Sirith]

Just wanna say... this is very interesting info. Waiting for the next fight to try things out.

[jsaving]

Having done a couple of eldritch archer runs, you're nearly always best-off using spellstrike to deliver a hellfire/scorching ray onboard an additional arrow even though you're then targeting normal AC for the attack. The standard EA build would be Neoseeker's EA2/ES8/EK10 (very similar to InEffect's Kingmaker archer) though I'd personally recommend EA2/ES12/EK6, which unlocks advanced talents though you do lose out on 1 point of AB.

[Damian]

I respecced Woljif to an eldritch archer and hes a super important party member now. The way to use eldritch archer is haste buffing elemental barrage abuser. So he gets a FREE cast attack with his FULL attacks with the bow, I use scorching ray and snowball exclusively. With abundant casting (first level only, no point in improved abundant) and an item that added a bunch of spell slots to 1st, 2nd and 3rd level spells, I have tons of spell ammo that lasts the length of any dungeon. So Ive got all that ok great, then I have a ton of haste spells, I think I have like 14 hastes and Ive only ever used maybe 9 in a row before end of dungeon/rest. I haste every fight unless its a ridiculously easy fight., The haste is a free cast as well or swift so you can cast and attack, I cast haste then shoot a full attack of 6 attacks. I also take elemental barrage asap as eldritch archer can add 3 elements to his arrows, so every 2 shots add 3 hits of elemental barrage, as your mythic level goes up this just gets higher and higher damage added. The buff to add 3 elements lasts a long time (like 10 minutes) and the most times Ive had to reactivate the buff was maybe 3 times in a dungeon and I can use it around 7 times so Ive never run out.

So main points of eldritch archer:
- haste bot
-elemental barrage and 3 elements running full time for tons of extra damage
- free cast attack each round (when not buffing haste)