how to deal with gargoyles at regills camp?

[Anri of Astora]

they are SWARMING my party and NPC footmen/archers are total joke. Core difficulty.
they are immune to pit/oil they have 10/5 physical dr and 10 elemental resistance WTF /facepalm

[Pellona]

Magic weapons, glitterdust for blind, web, ember sleep. At that point u have mythic 1, arcane blasters can ignore 1 elemental damage resist with the mythic ability

[Naked Granny]

Originally posted by Pellona:

Magic weapons, glitterdust for blind, web, ember sleep. At that point u have mythic 1, arcane blasters can ignore 1 elemental damage resist with the mythic ability

By that point you should have level 3 spells. Slow is the ultimate against creatures with multiple attacks per round (like gargoyles with all those bite/claw/claws).

[DarkFenix]

Their DR is bypassed by magic weapons. If you still have mundane weapons equipped by then I'm not sure what the hell you're doing...

You can still use a multitude of different spells on them.

The facepalm is that you've made your party a one-trick pony, now you've encountered something your one trick doesn't work against and it's somehow the game's fault.

[Naked Granny]

Originally posted by DarkFenix:

Their DR is bypassed by magic weapons. If you still have mundane weapons equipped by then I'm not sure what the hell you're doing...

You can still use a multitude of different spells on them.

The facepalm is that you've made your party a one-trick pony, now you've encountered something your one trick doesn't work against and it's somehow the game's fault.

That's basically the end of this thread.

People rely on grease / pit too much. I blame Treantmonk. His "guides" are such trash, and noobs just keep reading them.

[Anri of Astora]

So I'm gonna explain what I have at the moment:
1) MC: Divine Archer +11 ar with +2 longbow + leopard with 33 ac (mythic creature, also main tank)
2) Offtank Camellia - 30 ac, lvl2 spirit hunter+lvl5 flamewarden - rarely can hit gargoyles, almost invincible. +1 fire short sword with +2 heavy shield (two-weapons fighting)
3) Ember - focused on healing and firemagic (mythic) still useless against gargoyles
4) Nenio, lvl3 scroll savant+lvl3 vivisectionist+lvl1 arcane trickster. almost useless agains gargoyles.
5) Lann, literally demigod
6) Daeran - healing+ arrow of law caster. almost useless.
I dont have any sort of slow ang gargoyles crit like crazy, I lose my party during third wave all the time.

Not sure if retraining everyone would be my only option -.-

[Naked Granny]

Originally posted by P.M.M.L.:

So I'm gonna explain what I have at the moment:
1) MC: Divine Archer +11 ar with +2 longbow + leopard with 33 ac (mythic creature, also main tank)
2) Offtank Camellia - 30 ac, lvl2 spirit hunter+lvl5 flamewarden - rarely can hit gargoyles, almost invincible. +1 fire short sword with +2 heavy shield (two-weapons fighting)
3) Ember - focused on healing and firemagic (mythic) still useless against gargoyles
4) Nenio, lvl3 scroll savant+lvl3 vivisectionist+lvl1 arcane trickster. almost useless agains gargoyles.
5) Lann, literally demigod
6) Daeran - healing+ arrow of law caster. almost useless.
I dont have any sort of slow ang gargoyles crit like crazy, I lose my party during third wave all the time.

Not sure if retraining everyone would be my only option -.-

...

You have a party of literally nothing but two archers and four pure spellcasters?

And you're using a single animal companion with a measly 33 AC as your only tank....

...

And you're wondering why you're getting swarmed and overwhelmed when your grease / pit doesn't work? For starters, grease isn't a good idea if you rely that heavily upon archers. Because prone targets get +4 AC against ranged attacks.

Camellia is not good at doing any damage whatsoever if you just leave her as a shaman. She's only a potential damage dealer if you multi her into Rogue for dex-to-damage. Otherwise, she's a pure tank with nothing but buffs to recommend her. And of her buffs, she can offer Barkskin and Protective Luck / Chant hexes and that's the only thing she can do that other people don't do better. And you can't fit both of those hexes on her while also getting any levels in Rogue by level 5 for that fight.

Ember is definitely not a tank, and her toolkit is almost exclusively for debuffing single target bosses, not controlling crowds (though she could have Web at this point). The main problem with ember is that her Charisma SUCKS for any difficulty higher than Normal. Even on normal, enemies have a 50% success against her save DCs at bare minimum. She's not a real mage. She's just a Daeran with choices between a few modestly-useful hexes (Protective Luck / Cackle again, at this point).

Nenio is potentially useful if she has Slow and Heroism. Drop some Webs, drop some Slow, put Heroism on your archers. If she's level 5 in Scroll Scholar, you can use scrolls for offensive spells. Their caster level will still suck, but the save DCs should match her spells, so they might stick. Expensive, but potentially affordable for important fights like this. Unless you're scrolling, you won't have enough spell slots to spend on actual AoE damage, and those gargs are resistant to fireball anyway so don't waste time trying it.

Daeran is a healbot. And nothing else.

I recommend you kick Ember out. Kill her on any subsequent play throughs. Kick Daeran out. A dedicated healbot who does nothing else is a waste of a party slot. Bring Sosiel. Optimize his equipment. He's potentially a little worse as a tank than Camellia if she has Iceplant + that ring that makes Iceplant even better, but he hits harder without multiclassing and can steroid himself with Divine Favor / Aid (might want to use potions / scrolls for Bull's Strength instead of spell slots). Recruit a Fighter mercenary with the Two-Handed Fighter archetype. Use Finnean if you don't have any better two-handers. Use Seelah instead of Sosiel if you don't have difficulty with healing (relying on potions / scrolls).

Pay attention to enemy statblocks. Some of those gargs have a Fiendish template applied as well, which gives them an extra requirement to bypass their DR and more / different energy resistances.

[urartu]

That encounter is one of the hard ones really.

Ember should have Ascendant Element (Fire) so her scorching ray etc. murders people along other fire-based spells. That mythic ability allows one element to ignore immunities and resistances.

Does Nenio have access to Haste? Or do you have Haste scroll at hand? After a point that spell really becomes necessity. Also Stoneskin etc. helps alot against physical attackers along blur/displacement, mirror image etc.

[JustSmile]

Originally posted by Aunt Tony:

Camellia is not good at doing any damage whatsoever if you just leave her as a shaman. She's only a potential damage dealer if you multi her into Rogue for dex-to-damage.

That's wrong. Fencing Grace is a single feat and that gets her dex-to-damage without dipping into another classes. Sure, it also locks her into rapiers, but they're a high crit range weapon so they're good.

She never cleans house, but if she stays a shaman for some 12-13 levels at least she's a very durable tank with respectable damage.

[Lord_WC]

Don't play on core, it's not 'core' (as per ruleset), but hard. On core you will need semi-optimal builds (sorry to say this but divine archer is not that).

[Anri of Astora]

Originally posted by Aunt Tony:

wall of text

Thanks Tony, thats a lot to think about. I'll reconsider my tactics.

Originally posted by Lord_WC:

Don't play on core, it's not 'core' (as per ruleset), but hard. On core you will need semi-optimal builds (sorry to say this but divine archer is not that).

BUT ACHIEVEMENTS

[Dao of Yakitori]

Originally posted by Lord_WC:

Don't play on core, it's not 'core' (as per ruleset), but hard. On core you will need semi-optimal builds (sorry to say this but divine archer is not that).

What are the good builds? I'd say Alchemists and Kineticists.

[erian]

Originally posted by Aunt Tony:

Originally posted by P.M.M.L.:

So I'm gonna explain what I have at the moment:
1) MC: Divine Archer +11 ar with +2 longbow + leopard with 33 ac (mythic creature, also main tank)
2) Offtank Camellia - 30 ac, lvl2 spirit hunter+lvl5 flamewarden - rarely can hit gargoyles, almost invincible. +1 fire short sword with +2 heavy shield (two-weapons fighting)
3) Ember - focused on healing and firemagic (mythic) still useless against gargoyles
4) Nenio, lvl3 scroll savant+lvl3 vivisectionist+lvl1 arcane trickster. almost useless agains gargoyles.
5) Lann, literally demigod
6) Daeran - healing+ arrow of law caster. almost useless.
I dont have any sort of slow ang gargoyles crit like crazy, I lose my party during third wave all the time.

Not sure if retraining everyone would be my only option -.-

...

You have a party of literally nothing but two archers and four pure spellcasters?

And you're using a single animal companion with a measly 33 AC as your only tank....

...

And you're wondering why you're getting swarmed and overwhelmed when your grease / pit doesn't work? For starters, grease isn't a good idea if you rely that heavily upon archers. Because prone targets get +4 AC against ranged attacks.

Camellia is not good at doing any damage whatsoever if you just leave her as a shaman. She's only a potential damage dealer if you multi her into Rogue for dex-to-damage. Otherwise, she's a pure tank with nothing but buffs to recommend her. And of her buffs, she can offer Barkskin and Protective Luck / Chant hexes and that's the only thing she can do that other people don't do better. And you can't fit both of those hexes on her while also getting any levels in Rogue by level 5 for that fight.

Ember is definitely not a tank, and her toolkit is almost exclusively for debuffing single target bosses, not controlling crowds (though she could have Web at this point). The main problem with ember is that her Charisma SUCKS for any difficulty higher than Normal. Even on normal, enemies have a 50% success against her save DCs at bare minimum. She's not a real mage. She's just a Daeran with choices between a few modestly-useful hexes (Protective Luck / Cackle again, at this point).

Nenio is potentially useful if she has Slow and Heroism. Drop some Webs, drop some Slow, put Heroism on your archers. If she's level 5 in Scroll Scholar, you can use scrolls for offensive spells. Their caster level will still suck, but the save DCs should match her spells, so they might stick. Expensive, but potentially affordable for important fights like this. Unless you're scrolling, you won't have enough spell slots to spend on actual AoE damage, and those gargs are resistant to fireball anyway so don't waste time trying it.

Daeran is a healbot. And nothing else.

I recommend you kick Ember out. Kill her on any subsequent play throughs. Kick Daeran out. A dedicated healbot who does nothing else is a waste of a party slot. Bring Sosiel. Optimize his equipment. He's potentially a little worse as a tank than Camellia if she has Iceplant + that ring that makes Iceplant even better, but he hits harder without multiclassing and can steroid himself with Divine Favor / Aid (might want to use potions / scrolls for Bull's Strength instead of spell slots). Recruit a Fighter mercenary with the Two-Handed Fighter archetype. Use Finnean if you don't have any better two-handers. Use Seelah instead of Sosiel if you don't have difficulty with healing (relying on potions / scrolls).

Pay attention to enemy statblocks. Some of those gargs have a Fiendish template applied as well, which gives them an extra requirement to bypass their DR and more / different energy resistances.

Its so wrong on so many levels.
First. Camelia is extremly potent melee combatant on levels 5+ .Less then maximised mc, but better then most companions. On level 5 she takes fencing grace and gets keen enchantment that boosts her damage immensely(and is extremly good at trigering outflank). Plus she gets bane weapon very early that boosts her damage even more.Plus she can trigger elemental barrage easily and that also boosts her damage even further.Considing that a lot of enemies are immune to sneaks taking rogue levels actually lowers her damage.She is also not best main tank, but very good as offtank.
Second. Daeran is actually far better then Sosiel. You have plenty melee characters, but few pure casters. Daeran is excellent at debuffing and buffing(and some damage). Intimidate as autocast(for shattered defense) and focusing on evocation. Sosiel on the other hand has very few slots even with abudant casting,specially on critical spell levels that leads to being underbuffed. Only reason to skip Daeran for Sosiel is that if your mc is backline divine caster.
This all speaking from unfair perspective.

[Naked Granny]

Originally posted by erian:

Its so wrong on so many levels.
First. Camelia is extremly potent melee combatant on levels 5+ .Less then maximised mc, but better then most companions. On level 5 she takes fencing grace and gets keen enchantment that boosts her damage immensely(and is extremly good at trigering outflank). Plus she gets bane weapon very early that boosts her damage even more.Plus she can trigger elemental barrage easily and that also boosts her damage even further.Considing that a lot of enemies are immune to sneaks taking rogue levels actually lowers her damage.She is also not best main tank, but very good as offtank.
Second. Daeran is actually far better then Sosiel. You have plenty melee characters, but few pure casters. Daeran is excellent at debuffing and buffing(and some damage). Intimidate as autocast(for shattered defense) and focusing on evocation. Sosiel on the other hand has very few slots even with abudant casting,specially on critical spell levels that leads to being underbuffed. Only reason to skip Daeran for Sosiel is that if your mc is backline divine caster.
This all speaking from unfair perspective.

...

Today I learned that straight up Cleric is not a "pure caster" but a healbot ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ ORACLE is?

And I guess if one attack per round at +5 to-hit for 1d6+6 damage (assuming you took Piranha Strike because...) is "extremely potent melee combatant", no wonder you think Daeran is a superior cleric compared to a real cleric... Because you probably think clerics do nothing but cast cure wounds.

[Draken]

Ember's sleep is incredible against the gargoyles. I remember some of the gargoyles having a will save of +4. Ember should have a DC of 19 at this point. (10 base + 4 from 1/2 witch level + 5 from charisma with a +2 headband).

So they have to roll 15+ to not instantly be taken out of the fight. You should also be able to keep protective luck permanently on your tank via cackle. Which means any gargoyle has to roll two attack rolls and take the worst.

For me Ember accounted for 1/3 of all the gargoyles. My kineticist and Lann took out the rest while Seelah tanked and Camelia and Woljif buffed and did some minor chip damage. Woljif also coup-de-graced the sleeping ones when he had time.

[kingsims]

There is an amulet that you get. If you build it after getting your mythic powers from the grey garrison. its called The Covenant of the Inheritor. Its a 30m AOE weapon buff, which makes the weapon becomes good aligned and is treated as cold iron. So it should bypass DR.