Alignments (Solved)

[Trolldrool]

My biggest gripe with WotR so far I think is the way alignments work. In my latest playthrough I decided to go Lawful Evil for the Devil unlock. And at some point I discovered that I was halfway through Lawful Neutral. This is because Lawful acts pull you towards Lawful Neutral and Evil acts pull you towards Neutral Evil.

Since there are no Lawful Evil options, if I keep performing Lawful acts and there either aren't enough Evil acts or the ones there are boil down to "I'm going to kill this person I've never met just because I can." I end up situations where I either have to act like a maniac and kill random people or perform Chaotic acts to get back to Lawful Evil.

And when my Irori Order of the Scourge Hellknight has to be Chaotic in order to be Lawful Evil, I hope it's understandable that something feels off.

Edit: Thank you to Morgian for informing me about the Scroll of Atonement.

[Drake]

Doing chaotic stuff won't help you, chaotic choices will pull you towards chaotic neutral. All choices have the neutral hidden alignement. So a lawful choice is lawful neutral, a good choice is neutral good etc.
Which is actually logical, if you only pick lawful choices, you're pure lawful, not evil anymore. If you don't want to go toward lawful neutral don't pick too lawful choices, use the non aligned choices to say where you are, and then pick evil to go back (but beware that evil will make you go toward neutral evil).

[Morgian]

Buy a scroll of atonement when needed.

[Procrastinating Gamer]

This is why Owlcat should've left Alignment as a grid rather than turning it into a disc. If it was a grid, then Good and Evil choices would just shift you up or down, with no change to your position on the Law/Chaos axis.

[Trolldrool]

Originally posted by Drake:

Doing chaotic stuff won't help you, chaotic choices will pull you towards chaotic neutral. All choices have the neutral hidden alignement. So a lawful choice is lawful neutral, a good choice is neutral good etc.
Which is actually logical, if you only pick lawful choices, you're pure lawful, not evil anymore. If you don't want to go toward lawful neutral don't pick too lawful choices, use the non aligned choices to say where you are, and then pick evil to go back (but beware that evil will make you go toward neutral evil).

Chaotic helps to some degree if my Lawful Neutral is close to the outer edge as it pulls the dot downwards towards the edge between Lawful Neutral and Lawful Evil.

And I actually like that I can choose between Lawful and Evil actions. What's annoying is that so many of the Evil actions are just kill random people for no reason. Which is as far removed from Lawful Evil as Chaotic Good. As if the only way to be evil is to act like a demon.

Originally posted by Morgian:

Buy a scroll of atonement when needed.

I wasn't actually aware this was a thing. Thank you so much!

[T.W. Hamill]

Yeah the “evil” choices forcing you ro murderhobo are kinda dumb.

[JustSmile]

Originally posted by T.W. Hamill:

Yeah the “evil” choices forcing you ro murderhobo are kinda dumb.

Don't take those then? You don't HAVE to pick every [Evil] tag...

[JustSmile]

Originally posted by Trolldrool:

What's annoying is that so many of the Evil actions are just kill random people for no reason. Which is as far removed from Lawful Evil as Chaotic Good. As if the only way to be evil is to act like a demon.

Remember, you don't HAVE to pick murderhobo options, there's plenty of reasonable evil lines. The game gives you an option to kill non-essential npcs and if you take it you're obviously doing evil - hence those are tagged as [Evil].

I'm a bit tired of people complaining this RPG gives too many options... -.-

[T.W. Hamill]

Originally posted by JustSmile:

Originally posted by T.W. Hamill:

Yeah the “evil” choices forcing you ro murderhobo are kinda dumb.

Don't take those then? You don't HAVE to pick every [Evil] tag...

Every one? No, but i can count on my two hands the number of "evil" options that werent "i dont like you, die". (And yes, i see you staring at my 7 fingers on my right had, QUIT STARING IT ISNT POLITE).

And you have to take some, because if you choose a lawful or chaotic option, it will ALSO marginally move you towards Neutral on the good/evil axis, so you have to go back, or you WILL eventually end up in Neutral.

I picked NE as my starting alignment, and just picking law/chaos options in relatively equal proportion (keeping me solidly in the middle of the Chaos/Law axis), by chapter 3 i ended up a SINGLE good choice from Neutral. Because each Law/Chaos choice also moved you closer to Neutral.

So you DO have to pick Murder Hobo evil li nes because 85% of them are that and you cant get by on just the 15% remaining.

Its annoying that by trying to stick by/RP an alignment, you have to act schizoid (murder hobo one minute, saint the next) if you're trying to stay centered on law/chaos, or crazy-ass-mofo and Judge Dredd if you want to stay centered good/evil.

[phadin]

Originally posted by Morgian:

Buy a scroll of atonement when needed.

Is that still in this game? I didn't see it on the scroll sellers list.

Either way, the sphere thing makes sense and I prefer it. If your'e lawful good, but you ONLY pick good choices and never do anything Lawful, then you aren't 'really' lawful good. You're neutral good. You're not doing anything lawful. the game represents this properly by using the circle. If you want to stay in one of the corner alignments, you need to acknowledge BOTH of your alignment axis. You'can't just pick one and avoid the other.

[JustSmile]

Originally posted by T.W. Hamill:

Originally posted by JustSmile:

Don't take those then? You don't HAVE to pick every [Evil] tag...

Every one? No, but i can count on my two hands the number of "evil" options that werent "i dont like you, die".

That is downright wrong? Every time you meet a non-critical side NPC you are allowed to murderhobo the dude - but that's it. There's far more [Evil] tagged dialogue lines in the game than any other simply because of that. I've rarely gone through a quest conversation without several [Evil] convo options that had nothing to do with random killing - though plenty to do with being a dismissive, greedy ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥.

Every time I see people complaining about prevalence of 6- [Evil] Imma kill you now I can't help but despair. Why are you complaining the game gives you more options?

[phadin]

Originally posted by T.W. Hamill:

Originally posted by JustSmile:

Don't take those then? You don't HAVE to pick every [Evil] tag...

Every one? No, but i can count on my two hands the number of "evil" options that werent "i dont like you, die". (And yes, i see you staring at my 7 fingers on my right had, QUIT STARING IT ISNT POLITE).

And you have to take some, because if you choose a lawful or chaotic option, it will ALSO marginally move you towards Neutral on the good/evil axis, so you have to go back, or you WILL eventually end up in Neutral.

I picked NE as my starting alignment, and just picking law/chaos options in relatively equal proportion (keeping me solidly in the middle of the Chaos/Law axis), by chapter 3 i ended up a SINGLE good choice from Neutral. Because each Law/Chaos choice also moved you closer to Neutral.

So you DO have to pick Murder Hobo evil li nes because 85% of them are that and you cant get by on just the 15% remaining.

Its annoying that by trying to stick by/RP an alignment, you have to act schizoid (murder hobo one minute, saint the next) if you're trying to stay centered on law/chaos, or crazy-ass-mofo and Judge Dredd if you want to stay centered good/evil.

I'm not going evil on my current playthrough, but I've seen plenty of evil chioces that are not murder-hobo.

They acknowledge some people WANT to play murder hobo by giving an option in a lot of cases to just go 'evil' and kill whoever you're talking to. You're not expected to do that to play 'evil'. Often, a lot of those are extra chances to go evil independent from the usual opportunities to choose an alignment response. You also have more evil choices if you're pursuing one of the evil mythic paths like Lich, Demon, or Swarm. For example, you need to make a couple of 'evil' alignment choices to keep the bugs and use them in the attack on Drezen.