Trample Feat

[Agent]

How precisely does the mounted combat feat Trample work? Does the mount do the trample or does the rider have to do the trample? If the former that seems like a good deal, if the latter it seems like a problem to have to devote a full round to the trample when I could do a bunch of damage dealing attacks instead, plus the huge increase in micromanagement required?

So, yeah, is it something my horse will automatically do or a dubious full-round action on the part of my character?

[[TGC] MadGod]

Trample is a feat your mount can perform.

You need to overrun an opponent. It is a combat maneuver that is deceptively powerful.

It allows you to knock your opponent prone AND do damage.

Afterwards, the mounted character can attack the prone enemy and they have -4 AC.

If they stand up, they get an AoO of both you and your mount.

So even if you do that "doubious" maneuver, it is worth it and only costs an attack.

[Agent]

Maybe that's how it works in PnP but I tested it out, and it sure looks like if a cavalier (or somebody else I guess) takes the Trample mounted combat feat, it is basically a replacement for charge. The rider has to initiate it and you can't be next to the target or it says you're too close.

And since the rider has to initiate it with a standard action, he or she can't attack the prone enemy because they've already used their action. The enemy moves before you can attack again, though of course you are correct that you get an attack of opportunity when they stand up. Still, given the bonus to-hit and damage from charging (particularly with a cavalier), this seems like a straight downgrade and a feat to avoid. The CMB is much harder to hit with than a charge, and does less damage.

If your MOUNT would automatically try to trample stuff next to you while you attacked stuff that would be one thing, but requiring the rider to use a standard action to initiate the trample and only being able to do it instead of a charge makes it extra no bueno.

Should work as a toggle where you can toggle it on or off and the mount tries to trample anything you attack when its on or does regular attacks on your target if its off. As is, no takey.

[Agent]

If anybody sees something I'm missing with this feat let me know, but like I said as far as I can tell it simply acts as a replacement for charge and a mostly worse one at that given the opportunity cost of the feat. The big majority of the time a cavalier would almost certainly prefer the double or triple damage from the charge rather than a medium chance of knocking the target over with a bit of damage.

[Agent]

I dunno, now it looks like you use it instead of MOVING not charging and it tries to knock over anything nearby, which is cool, but that appears to include friendlies which is less cool? Eh I can't figure it out.

[Agent]

Ok, sorry for spamming the topic but in case anyone is reading it; that's what it is. You toggle on trample and then don't click on an enemy (that will basically act like a gimped charge), you MOVE AROUND with the trample toggled and will attempt to overrun and knock down anything you move past. I just knocked down 2 Brimoraks in one move with my test.

Be uh warned that you will try to knock down your buddies if they are nearby.

So yeah, a charge will do more damage but only hits one enemy. You can hit multiple grouped up enemies with trample in one turn. Probably best paired with a feat that lets you do more than one AoO per round, otherwise all the enemies past the first can stand up without being whacked.

[[TGC] MadGod]

Originally posted by Agent:

If anybody sees something I'm missing with this feat let me know, but like I said as far as I can tell it simply acts as a replacement for charge and a mostly worse one at that given the opportunity cost of the feat. The big majority of the time a cavalier would almost certainly prefer the double or triple damage from the charge rather than a medium chance of knocking the target over with a bit of damage.

Medium chance? Usually, the CMB of a large mount is so high mid/end game that it is an almost guaranteed knockdown unless you play on <insert inane difficulty here>.

Currently, I am rather struggling with the fact that mounted combat is bugged anyway and my trip mastodon mount does not really do as I tell it. Therefore I have shelved that build until mounted combat is finally fixed.

And if they actually made that Trample/Overrun targets friendlies and is more a stampede thing than a maneuver, then it spells trouble for my cavalier builds. :(

[Cutlass Jack]

Basically Trample lets you designate a spot (not a target) and you and your mount charge to that spot, damaging and knocking down things between you and the spot you designate. This includes friendlies.

This is situationally useful. But you can use it in situations where charge doesn't work. I made great use of it to run over someone in a boss fight that was invisible. I couldn't target them, but I trampled to the spot I knew they were standing, knocking them on their ass and seeing their position in the process.

[IKerensky]

Originally posted by TGC von Anrantz:

Trample is a feat your mount can perform.

You need to overrun an opponent. It is a combat maneuver that is deceptively powerful.

Quite powerfull manoeuver... except it is not in game neither are the feats relative to it...

[Agent]

Originally posted by TGC von Anrantz:

Medium chance? Usually, the CMB of a large mount is so high mid/end game that it is an almost guaranteed knockdown unless you play on <insert inane difficulty here>.

Maybe it's because I tested it on the wrong thing, but when I tested against a bunch of Brimoraks I had maybe a 50% of the overrun working (needed about an 11) and a 25% of knocking them prone (since I guess you need success+5 for prone?). As compared to maybe a 75% of a charge hitting and basically one shotting the one I hit.

Perhaps that changes as you say in mid or late game (I'm level 6) but at this level it was clearly a low reward scenario, particularly with how finicky it is for hitting more than one target.

(This is on Classic)