My casters can only cast magic once :(

[joonkimdmd]

I just had a wizard join my team.
But she can only cast one offensive skill.
Same goes for my other teammates. For example, Woljif(?) can cast burning hand only once.

Without these offensive skills, they are nothing but just auto hit melee characters.
Should I just treat them as auto hit melee characters and use 1 skill per day? I think that's very ineffective way of using them, but what other choice do I have?

If I need to put points into wisdom so the wizard can cast more spells, well....don't I have to be level 10 or higher to actually put decent amount of points and distinguish him from now?

And also, how is wizard different from sorceress?

[Balekai]

If you're low level this is normal. Spell slot selection, especially on wizard, if extreme limited. All casters are super under powered until like level 3-5. Some notes:

- The spellcasting attribute for Wiz is INT not WIS. Spell slots increase with leveling and at certain break point in INT. They learn spells from scrolls and have access to all spells only restricted by opposing school mechanics. This variety of spells comes at the cost of casts per day.

- Sorcerers use CHA as their casting stat and are spontaneous casters. That means instead of having to memorize spells manually before rest, Sorcs get a total amount of spells they can cast per spell level per day. They can pick any spell of that level and cast it on a whim. This comes at the cost of spell diversity/variety/utility. Their spells are also full round actions rather than a Standard Action thus slower to cast.

- With Arcane spellcasters, cantrips are how you damage and crowd control early on (Daze). they have infinite casts and are usually superior to weapons for low BAB casters. This is because cantrips like acid slash, jolt and ray of frost are ranged touch attacks, which bypass DEX bonus to AC (EDIT: As Zuul pointed out this is wrong and opposite to how it works. They ignore AC from equipment like armor and shields). It. Enemies are a lot easier to hit with melee/ranged touch attacks. Especially high DEX enemies. Oh and you can use them endlessly as auto attacks.

- Early on because of the lack of spell slots, you want to learn/use buffs or crowd controls skills with long durations. And only when you really need them (like in boss fights). Like Kingmaker you don't want to rest too much in this game so using spell slots intelligently is crucial.

Edit: For typos/clarity (I got distracted). :p

And just to clarify Wiz spells. The Hat is right there's more steps to WIZ than Sorc and it can be confusing to new players.

1. First you learn a spell from scrolls or from leveling up.
2. Then you have to go to your spell book and manually choose to memorize a spell, which will then be available to cast AFTER resting.
3. You can replace and move around spells at anytime, but must always rest after doing so in order to cast them again.

Sorc do not do steps one a 2. They just have to rest to replenish their spells per day.

[The Hat]

Also make sure you are going back to the spellbook as some characters level up, some classes need you to assign memorized spells, others have a set limit per day.

[LeThall]

Press I, look into your Mage and go to SpellBook.. there you can see your spellslot. If you want more of the same damage/CC/buff spell, repeat the same spells in your spellslot

[Dante]

I picked up Abundant casting on all my casters and later improved abundant casting. They amount of spells I can sling per day is nuts. Still not as nuts as the damage output my 2 bow users deal... Do I need 2 rangers in the party? Absolutely not. Do I enjoy murdering everything within 50 feet in a single turn because the two of them get a combined 9 attacks per round with improved crit range and average crits of 50 damage? Yea, I like that.

Oh, and their damage splashes to nearby targets on kill or crit.

[Zuul]

Balekai eredeti hozzászólása:

If you're low level this is normal. Spell slot selection, especially on wizard, if extreme limited. All casters are super under powered until like level 3-5. Some notes:

- With Arcane spellcasters, cantrips are how you damage and crows control early on. they have infinite casts and are usually superior to weapons for low BAB casters. This is because cantrips like acid slash, jolt and ray of frost are ranged touch attacks, which bypass DEX bonus to AC. Enemies are a lot easier to hit with melee/ranged touch attacks. Especially high DEX enemies. Oh and you can use them endlessly as auto attacks.

Just wanted to call this bit out. This is basically the exact opposite of how touch attacks work. DEX is almost the only thing that helps defend against touch attacks. The reason being you are trying to “touch” them. So their dexterity (ability to dodge), dodge perk, etc etc helps to keep you from touching them. The thing you ignore is their actual physical armor. So touch attacks are fantastic for heavily armored enemies, while lightly armored high Dex opponents are the hardest target for them.

[Tech Enthusiast]

New to the rulebook and did not play game 1.
Just wanted to add one question, that kinda fits here and does not need an own topic,...

... do casters actually get viable down the line, or is this a ruleset that favors rangers a lot?
Just did the first cave and it is kind of depressing how useless my caster feels and how OP the bow users (3 of them? really? oh my) feel compared.

I enjoy playing caster types usually, but if the balance does not change dramatically, i am fine with rerolling a ranger or whatever else that just has to hit stuff to have an impact. ;-)

[Zuul]

Tech Enthusiast eredeti hozzászólása:

New to the rulebook and did not play game 1.
Just wanted to add one question, that kinda fits here and does not need an own topic,...

... do casters actually get viable down the line, or is this a ruleset that favors rangers a lot?
Just did the first cave and it is kind of depressing how useless my caster feels and how OP the bow users (3 of them? really? oh my) feel compared.

I enjoy playing caster types usually, but if the balance does not change dramatically, i am fine with rerolling a ranger or whatever else that just has to hit stuff to have an impact. ;-)

High level casters are god tier. Even at low levels they can massively effect the outcome of a fight. They just can’t do it “often”. At low level a wizard can basically stun lock a single under 5 HD humanoid permanently with repeated uses of the cantrip daze. A single grease spell can trivialize an entire encounter.

[Illudium]

Tech Enthusiast eredeti hozzászólása:

New to the rulebook and did not play game 1.
Just wanted to add one question, that kinda fits here and does not need an own topic,...

... do casters actually get viable down the line, or is this a ruleset that favors rangers a lot?
Just did the first cave and it is kind of depressing how useless my caster feels and how OP the bow users (3 of them? really? oh my) feel compared.

I enjoy playing caster types usually, but if the balance does not change dramatically, i am fine with rerolling a ranger or whatever else that just has to hit stuff to have an impact. ;-)

Casters get a hell of a lot better as they level. Tabletop Pathfinder is based on the 3.5 Edition of D&D, which was absolutely notorious for how absurdly overpowered mages get at high levels. Not necessarily in terms of raw damage (though there's plenty of that too), but their sheer amount of battlefield control/manipulation/buffing/etc. can absolutely trivialize high-level combat. This game isn't *as* imbalanced about that, but it's still a thing.

[fortesama]

Tech Enthusiast eredeti hozzászólása:

New to the rulebook and did not play game 1.
Just wanted to add one question, that kinda fits here and does not need an own topic,...

... do casters actually get viable down the line, or is this a ruleset that favors rangers a lot?
Just did the first cave and it is kind of depressing how useless my caster feels and how OP the bow users (3 of them? really? oh my) feel compared.

I enjoy playing caster types usually, but if the balance does not change dramatically, i am fine with rerolling a ranger or whatever else that just has to hit stuff to have an impact. ;-)

Extremely viable. Dedicated casters are really weak level 1-4. Even level 5 if you're playing a class that doesn't gain access to 3rd level spells until level 6. Once you hit 3rd level spells, that's when the really juicy stuff (haste, stinking cloud) begin to show up, and only gets better from there.

Late game, dedicated casters are completely unmatched in their combat options. While they won't usually be your number one DPS dealers, they'll generally be unstoppable everywhere else.

Spells are VERY powerful in this game, and the appropriate spell can instantly end fights by crippling the opposition so badly that your fighter types can just mow through them without resistance.

Even at low levels though, picking the right spells will allow casters to be useful. Grease can take out several attackers at once while your own team picks them apart one by one instead of having to deal with them all at once. Glitterdust basically removes melees with low will saves, making them largely harmless. Scare can send half the fight running, allowing you to play divide-and-conquer.

[Herr Glaube]

LeThall eredeti hozzászólása:

Press I, look into your Mage and go to SpellBook.. there you can see your spellslot. If you want more of the same damage/CC/buff spell, repeat the same spells in your spellslot

B opens the spellbook directly.

[Balekai]

Zuul eredeti hozzászólása:

Balekai eredeti hozzászólása:

If you're low level this is normal. Spell slot selection, especially on wizard, if extreme limited. All casters are super under powered until like level 3-5. Some notes:

- With Arcane spellcasters, cantrips are how you damage and crows control early on. they have infinite casts and are usually superior to weapons for low BAB casters. This is because cantrips like acid slash, jolt and ray of frost are ranged touch attacks, which bypass DEX bonus to AC. Enemies are a lot easier to hit with melee/ranged touch attacks. Especially high DEX enemies. Oh and you can use them endlessly as auto attacks.

Just wanted to call this bit out. This is basically the exact opposite of how touch attacks work. DEX is almost the only thing that helps defend against touch attacks. The reason being you are trying to “touch” them. So their dexterity (ability to dodge), dodge perk, etc etc helps to keep you from touching them. The thing you ignore is their actual physical armor. So touch attacks are fantastic for heavily armored enemies, while lightly armored high Dex opponents are the hardest target for them.

I knew I was wrong when I was typing it (changed the wording like 4 times knowing something was up) but couldn't wrap my head around it for some reason this morning. My brain really isn't working. I guess I needed a lot more sleep than 2 hours. :p

Thanks for the clarification. Going to add a note to the original post. :)

[Tech Enthusiast]

Thank you guys.
Glad to hear I can keep the caster without crippeling myself too much.
Fine with playing a weaker class that I enjoy, but the first few fights really made me question just HOW weak is fine for me to still enjoy it. ;-)

Ill manage while getting to level 6 hehe.

[Balekai]

Good luck. :) :)

[joonkimdmd]

When do magics start doing more damage than regular bow attacks?

[joonkimdmd]

Balekai eredeti hozzászólása:

If you're low level this is normal. Spell slot selection, especially on wizard, if extreme limited. All casters are super under powered until like level 3-5. Some notes:

- The spellcasting attribute for Wiz is INT not WIS. Spell slots increase with leveling and at certain break point in INT. They learn spells from scrolls and have access to all spells only restricted by opposing school mechanics. This variety of spells comes at the cost of casts per day.

What scrolls? If I have a scroll of healing, he can cast heals?