4th Floor Room 402

[CloakedSchemer]

Alright. Just gonna bite the bullet and ask. I've managed to complete 401 and 403 just fine, the latter taking more time than the former. But 402 has me stumped. Especially since there seem to be so few clues. I've figured out some things easily enough that it's Ronnie and Jessica's appartment, that Victor is Jessica's cousin and seated 1, James is seated at 5, Jessica is planning to leave Ronnie, there's probably an abortion involved.

But a few things I can't figure out for the life of me. So if I could get a hint in either direction, that'd be great.

1. Who is Carol? Aside from her name on the fridge post-it I can't find anything related to her
2. How do you figure out the seating for 2, 3 en 4?
3. Nothing seems to show who died? Ronnie could have found the letter and poisoned Jessica, or Jessica could have poisoned Ronnie to get away from him. But nothing points into either direction as far as I can tell?

[Angry Rabbit]

1. I've got nothing on Carol other than the post-it note too. She's a possible red herring since it looks like she didn't show.
2. Seat 1: Victor. He was in AA, so he's drinking coffee, not wine. The only setting with a mug instead of a wine glass.
Seat 2: I'm inclined to believe this was James. The wine glass is set for a left handed person and there is no lipstick on it, indicating a man was seated here.
Seat 3: Jessica. The wineglass has lipstick on it. If you check Jessica's purse, you'll find the same shade of lipstick in her purse. You know it's Jessica's purse because of the cigarettes and nicotine patches and the ash tray on the phone table. You will also need to use the flashlight to correctly identify the color on the glass, otherwise it just looks the same color as the wine.
Seat 4: Ronnie. The husband is going to sit next to his wife, so he's either going to be at 2 or 4, and since we've already placed 2, that means he's at 4.
Seat 5: Carol, due to the process of elimination. It should be noted though, this setting was also for a left handed person.
3. Thanks to knowing who sat at Seat 3 you now know Jessica is the victim. Though who killer her, I'm at a loss. I thought it was Ronnie, given he had contact info for a doctor in an abortion clinic, indicating Jessica was pregnant but Ronnie didn't want the child. A letter from Jessica's mom also indicated that Jessica had 'endured enough' with Ronnie and needed to leave him. It seemed pretty obvious that Ronnie killed her for not wanting the child. The only other person even remotely suspicious would be Carol, since she didn't show up. But if she didn't show up, then she couldn't have poisoned Jessica. I'm still trying to figure out who the killer actually was.

[CloakedSchemer]

Fair on the lipstick, I didn't notice that.

Here's a thought on the killer in that case:
: I've we're assuming 5 was a no-show, then we might be able to assume that the killer was seated at 2. It's the sole plate without some blood marking. Meaning the killer didn't want to poison himself. Going by silverware the person is righthanded, so not James. That would mean Carol was seated at 2 and is the killer.

[Angry Rabbit]

That's a good point about the silverware. I had noticed that too, but ultimately went with the wine glass placement. Most people typically drink with their strong hand, afterall. I'll have to try Carol as the killer and see if that works.

Can we now talk about the real crime here? Who the hell serves stew on a plate?

[Erin]

Ok so I figured out the killer (402) through trial and error, but... why? It was Carol, but there is literally NO information about her ANYWHERE in the whole apartment other than her name showing up on the guest list. I am quite confused.

[`lanzaa']

coming to a conclusion as to who was seated where and who was killed were both intertwined for me. this logic might be flawed and a lot of it can be circumstantial but it worked for me.

two initial clues we are given is that victor doesnt drink alcohol and james is left handed. seat 1 is the only seat that doesnt have wine so this is most likely victor. seat number 2 has the wine in a left handed position but the utensils are in a right handed postion leaving this ambiguous. going to seat 5, both the utensils and wine glass are in a left handed setup so this is most likely james. this leaves seats 2 3 and 4 undetermined.

if you examine ronnie's wallet on the counter near the front door, you see a receipt for celine's kitchen on valentines day (02/14). if you look at the purse hanging, you see matches from celine's kitchen. we know there are two women at this event, jessica and carol so this is presumably one of theirs. at this point we should also already know that ronnie and jessica are a couple and are living in this house.

a letter in the back from a margaret in LA to jessica shows that jessica visited margaret (her mom) at somepoint and that theyre having issues with ronnie.

if we look at the calendar on the wall we see that during feb 11-17th, someone was in LA presumbling visting their mom as on the 15th it says mom's birthday. with the letter from before showing that jessica's mom lives in LA, this is very likely jessica who is out of town. further proof that this is jessica's mom is the happy birthday to my daughter card that is on the coffee table.

as jessica was not in new york on valentines day, it is very unlikely that the purse hanging is hers since that person has the celine's kitchen matches from the date with ronnie. again there is only one other women at this event, so it is very likely carol's purse.

now at this point i realize there are a bunch of assumptions. for example just because jessica was out of town during valentines day doesnt mean ronnie and her didnt go to celines at a later time. but i am just going with what the game gives me and the clues that i have found.

so with this, we have established that the purse belongs to carol, the only other female at the party. in the bag is a lipstick that specifically says does not leave marks. if we look at the wine glass of the deceased, we see a clear lipstick stain. as this is very likely a woman, and carol's lipstick leaves no stains, this has to be jessica. seat number 3 is now jessica, the one that was killed.

this leaves seats 2 and 4. going back to ronnie's wallet we have a card from an abortion clinic. now this might be a big stretch but i think it is carol who is pregnant from the affair, the like source of ronnie's and jessica's strained relationship. inspecting one of the wine bottles in the kitchen shows that a full wine glass is one that is 1/3 filled. looking at seat 2, it is the only wine glass that has not been touched. my theory was that carol was pregnant from the affair, and since she's pregnant she is not drinking any alcohol. therefore seat 2 is carol and seat 4 is ronnie.

like i said earlier lottsss of assumptions here this was my logic for answering the above two questions and whether i followed it correctly or not, i did get the answers right.

i guessed who the killer was and got that right as well but have found no logical conclusion as to why that person was the one who did it.

[Sterling]

Originally posted by `lanzaa':

there are a bunch of assumptions. for example just because jessica was out of town during valentines day doesnt mean ronnie and her didnt go to celines at a later time.

like i said earlier lottsss of assumptions here this was my logic for answering the above two questions and whether i followed it correctly or not, i did get the answers right.

i guessed who the killer was and got that right as well but have found no logical conclusion as to why that person was the one who did it.

the valet receipt for celine's in ronnie's wallet had the date of valentines on it, so not an assumption! jessica was out of town.

but as for who the killer was, I still don't get it either. presumably the poison was in the drink, but wouldn't the hosts/homeowners (jessica and ronnie) be the ones who prepared everything? like how would carol even execute that? did she point at the window and yell "LOOK OVER THERE" and dump it into the drink next to her while everybody was turned?
I feel like maybe we're supposed to make the logical leap of *ronnie wanting his side piece to get an abortion is basically him choosing jessica, therefore carol's mad* despite the letter from jessica's mom hinting that ronnie objectively, openly sucks and could do something like that too

[Erin]

Originally posted by `lanzaa':

if you examine ronnie's wallet on the counter near the front door, you see a receipt for celine's kitchen on valentines day (02/14). if you look at the purse hanging, you see matches from celine's kitchen. we know there are two women at this event, jessica and carol so this is presumably one of theirs. at this point we should also already know that ronnie and jessica are a couple and are living in this house.

if we look at the calendar on the wall we see that during feb 11-17th, someone was in LA presumbling visting their mom as on the 15th it says mom's birthday. with the letter from before showing that jessica's mom lives in LA, this is very likely jessica who is out of town. further proof that this is jessica's mom is the happy birthday to my daughter card that is on the coffee table.

as jessica was not in new york on valentines day, it is very unlikely that the purse hanging is hers since that person has the celine's kitchen matches from the date with ronnie. again there is only one other women at this event, so it is very likely carol's purse.

now at this point i realize there are a bunch of assumptions. for example just because jessica was out of town during valentines day doesnt mean ronnie and her didnt go to celines at a later time. but i am just going with what the game gives me and the clues that i have found.

so with this, we have established that the purse belongs to carol, the only other female at the party. in the bag is a lipstick that specifically says does not leave marks. if we look at the wine glass of the deceased, we see a clear lipstick stain. as this is very likely a woman, and carol's lipstick leaves no stains, this has to be jessica. seat number 3 is now jessica, the one that was killed.

this leaves seats 2 and 4. going back to ronnie's wallet we have a card from an abortion clinic. now this might be a big stretch but i think it is carol who is pregnant from the affair, the like source of ronnie's and jessica's strained relationship. inspecting one of the wine bottles in the kitchen shows that a full wine glass is one that is 1/3 filled. looking at seat 2, it is the only wine glass that has not been touched. my theory was that carol was pregnant from the affair, and since she's pregnant she is not drinking any alcohol. therefore seat 2 is carol and seat 4 is ronnie.

Omgggg how did I miss some of this?? I did not notice the matches in the purse, nor the note on the lipstick that it didn't leave marks. I didn't pay attention to the calendar and how you could flip to different months and how Jessica was out of town in LA, so it more than likely was Carol and Ronnie that went to Celine's together on Valentine's Day. He probably did knock her up (abortion clinic card).

Okay it's making more sense how it's plausible that the killer would be Carol. Perhaps she saw Jessica as a threat and wanted Ronnie to herself, so she figured she'd killer her and get her out of the way. She didn't drink the wine and she had nicotine patches in her purse because she knew she was pregnant. As for how it was done with the drugs in the wine, it's possible that maybe she was the first guest to arrive, and while Jessica and Ronnie were busy preparing stuff, she could have easily slipped the drug into Jessica's glass when no one was watching. Perhaps she even offered to help and so she poured some wine.

[CloakedSchemer]

I don't think the wine was poisoned, but the beef stew was. Would be easier to hide and explain why victor also has blood on his napkin. It then mixed with the wine to provide a lethal dose.

[stevo]

honestly thought it was pretty simplistic Carol was the mother, given the cards and presents left on the table and deducing from that. But everything else related to how and why the murder takes place... no idea, literally makes no sense beyond a WHOLE lotta assuming. Either way it's just so stupid and illogical. No one with sense poisons someone in a close quarters situation, much less leaves the bottle of poison there. It's a nonsense scenario

[CloakedSchemer]

The mother is called margaret or something, not Carol. Her name is on the letter you find next to the couch.

[Violin]

Ronnie dated someone while his wife was away and is searching for an abortion clinic. On the table, there is one coffee - belonging to the Alcoholic, one Glass is completely untouched and one contains only water. The water is for someone pregnant, and that was unknown beforehand, so the host expected her to drink. Also, in the womens purse, there are nicotin patches, for someone who needs to quit smoking quickly (because of a pregnancy for example). The house also has no ashtray. they're using a chipped platter, so no regular smokers living here. The purse is not Jessicas. The Lipstick is also "non smearing" which rules the owner out as the victim, as there is lipstick on it.

Ronnie gave his wife a VERY loving birthday card, almost dripping guilt for cheating on her (You can deduce this via the valet parking receipt in his purse for the restaurant, described as "romantic" in the book on the lower shelf, next to the tv. He went there with SOMEONE while his wife was gone) . This combined with the card from the abortion doctor tells me, that he has impregnated someone, but doesn't want to risk his marriage over her and badgers his love into terminating the pregnancy.

So, as he want's to keep his marriage intact, he won't murder Jessica. Her Cousin obviously adores her, so he is out too. This leaves Mr. Lefty and Carol. Obviously, Ronnie is serving the dinner as a way of sucking up to his wife, so his plates are untouched. There are now bowls on the table, they are on the counter, so someone is going to and fro and serving food, which leaves him no time to eat. Also, he obviously can't cook, as he has the recipe written down, but it is only for one Course and there are several courses there, so SOMEONE brought food.

So, my interpretation is like this:

Carol is either a co-worker of Ronnie or maybe an item with Mr. Lefthand, idk. She had an affair with Ronnie and is pregnant. She want's to keep the baby, as she is weaning herself of cigarettes and won't drink alcohol. He want's her to get an abortion and wants to make up to his wife. Carol laces the food she brought, most likely the first course, with the medicine. As she doesn''t drink, she has no averse effects. Ronnie has no time to eat, so he neither. The other two are suffering ill effects, but Carols glass is filled to the brim. The bottle says, that a wine glass is FULL once it is at the 1/3 mark, and Carols glass is about 3 times as full, the lethal dose of the poison, enough to kill her and make the others puke blood.

Why the AA Guy also coughs blood, idk. Maybe the caffeine? I actually didn't bother to check again

[Tankfriend]

Originally posted by Sterling:

but as for who the killer was, I still don't get it either. presumably the poison was in the drink, but wouldn't the hosts/homeowners (jessica and ronnie) be the ones who prepared everything? like how would carol even execute that? did she point at the window and yell "LOOK OVER THERE" and dump it into the drink next to her while everybody was turned?

Note how Carol's wine glass is on the left side of her plate, even though she is right-handed judging by the rest of her tableware. Putting her glass on the left also puts it directly next to Jessica's glass. My reasoning? Carol poisoned *her own glass*, and then switched it with Jessica's glass in an opportune moment.

[stevo]

why the fudge is the Mom birthday card on the table then lol. This is such a stupid and illogical red herring

[Nico]

This case is a reworking of the case from the demo, and you can find on the devs' blog different articles (like this one: https://www.eqstudios.com/post/expo-demo-breakdown ) that thoroughly explain how to reach conclusions for the demo version. Note that some things have been changed, so the solution can't be taken verbatim, but the gist of the story is the same.

[writerintheory]

Yeah, if I hadn't played the demo I don't think I would've known how to solve this one. I believe there was a clue on the answering machine before? That or there was some sort of elaboration on the restaurant Ronnie took Carol to, and there was also something about Ronnie and Jessica celebrating their anniversary at their favorite restaurant but then you could see the receipt wasn't for the right day so you could discern he was cheating? I think? So yeah idk why those clues were removed, it's really difficult to tell it was her otherwise. The only way I can see you can figure it out as it stands is something having to do with the drinks? Or the food possibly?