Early "advanced" succession laws?

[Dimwit Donald (very high IQ)]

Are there any cultures or religions that allow early adaptation of primo-/ultimogeniture or even heir designation?

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

[Dizzy Ladybug]

not primogeniture, but some Iberian cultures like Basque has Visigothic Codes for High Partition very early on. you can hybridize to get that tradition

[AC Denton]

Originally posted by Albatross:

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

Uhhh CK3 has both Tanistry Elective and level 4 Crown Authority allows you to designate your heir lol

Edit:
and yes a, 8 year old game (at time of CK3 release) with 15 expansions is expected to have more than a 3 year old game with two expansions lol

[Dimwit Donald (very high IQ)]

Originally posted by dizzy ladybug:

not primogeniture, but some Iberian cultures like Basque has Visigothic Codes for High Partition very early on. you can hybridize to get that tradition

Thanks.

Originally posted by AC Denton:

Originally posted by Albatross:

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

Uhhh CK3 has both Tanistry Elective and level 4 Crown Authority allows you to designate your heir lol

Crown authority 4 is very early indeed when you're starting as a tribal ruler lol.
Besides, I was asking *if*, not saying it doesn't... lol

Originally posted by AC Denton:

Originally posted by Albatross:

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

Edit:
and yes a, 8 year old game (at time of CK3 release) with 15 expansions is expected to have more than a 3 year old game with two expansions lol

Except CK2 came out 2012 and the last DLC came out in 2018, so that's a timespan of content creation for about 6 years.
So, CK3, already being past half-time compared to CK2, can be expected to never have remotely as much content as CK2 did. Maybe, if they had called it CK Arcade, CK Reboot or CK Lite people would have had a better idea of what to expect.
If you're gonna be a smart-ass, at least do it right.

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by Albatross:

Are there any cultures or religions that allow early adaptation of primo-/ultimogeniture or even heir designation?

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

Well, there is one easy solution for an faked "Primogeniture".

But this requires an Duchy Title and that your Ruler is the only Ruler in this Duchy, because you can make this Duchy Elective and since you are the only Ruler in this Duchy, you are the only one, who is allowed to Vote.
(Not counting Barons, because Barons have no Vote Rights.)

This works for small Duchies, but for big Duchies, like Bohemia, you need a very high Stewardship to control it alone around 50 or more.


But never add an Elective Law to an Empire, because it breaks currently the entire Election.


But another good thing for an good Succession is by removing every Ruler, who is not of your Dynasty and replace them with your Dynasty Members.

[Dimwit Donald (very high IQ)]

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

Originally posted by Albatross:

Are there any cultures or religions that allow early adaptation of primo-/ultimogeniture or even heir designation?

I 'member, in CK2, the crazy Irish had this thing called Tanistry and some asians could designate the main heir from their children.

But then again, CK2 had all kinds of things that CK3 doesn't have...

Well, there is one easy solution for an faked "Primogeniture".

But this requires an Duchy Title and that your Ruler is the only Ruler in this Duchy, because you can make this Duchy Elective and since you are the only Ruler in this Duchy, you are the only one, who is allowed to Vote.
(Not counting Barons, because Barons have no Vote Rights.)


But never add an Elective Law to an Empire, because it breaks currently the entire Election.

Well, that's nice and all, but it limits my realm to a size of about 4 or 5 counties. I'm usually a bit more expansive.

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by Albatross:

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

Well, there is one easy solution for an faked "Primogeniture".

But this requires an Duchy Title and that your Ruler is the only Ruler in this Duchy, because you can make this Duchy Elective and since you are the only Ruler in this Duchy, you are the only one, who is allowed to Vote.
(Not counting Barons, because Barons have no Vote Rights.)


But never add an Elective Law to an Empire, because it breaks currently the entire Election.

Well, that's nice and all, but it limits my realm to a size of about 4 or 5 counties. I'm usually a bit more expansive.

Not, when you remove any Ruler, who is not part of your Dynasty and replace them with Dynasty Members.

And this is best way to get Renown and it makes an Realm easy to control, because all Dynasty Members will like eachother more, because of same Dynasty and this can be increased with Dynasty Legacies and Culture Traditions.

[VoiD]

As a tribal ruler sucession isn't an issue, just conquer more lands for all of your sounds, give them their inheritance while you're still alive and they will get nothing when you die, so long as you can keep ownership over the highest title in the region.

IE: Starting as a danish duke take control of the kingdom and give each one of the duchies to your other sons, if you have even more sons you can try conquering a few duchies outside of your realm, if they don't have enough lands to form their own kingdoms you should be fine.

If you do conquer too many lands (often through the invasion CB) then either try to form a new kingdom, and if your rules allow, try setting your secondary kingdom titles to some form of elective law, then simply vote your favored heir on all of your kingdoms, I've managed to take the 3 scandinavian kingdoms, england and scotland as I was forming the north sea empire under control for a couple of generations a year ago.

Of course, there's also the option of purposelly going after small kingdoms to allow your sons to inherit their own lands, while not hurting your core domain, and as independant kings you'll have access to some permanent allies and more dynasty splendor, if you ever feel like taking those kingdoms back later on as the house head you can get a claim on them with a simple click.

You can also marry a very competent old woman that can't bear children, for the stat boosts, and only use concubines to reproduce, once you get a son remove all concubines and there won't be any issues. Then again, this is my least favorite method, and one I've only had to use back in CK2, as CK3 is overall easier and sucession usually isn't an issue, I don't think losing potential breeders in my dynasty is worth the possibility of maybe having to settle some minor sucession crisis from time to time. But if you don't really care about the dynasty then it's an easy way to simply ignore sucession laws before you can select your primary heir with high crown authority.

[Dimwit Donald (very high IQ)]

Hmm, ok... I'm really mostly trying to find a nice culture and faith to start with after not having played in years. But, like you say, the game seems so easy, that it probably doesn't matter much. I just conquer county after county, painting the map again...
It's good to know, though, that the heirs' "possessions" (received ahead of time) actually count when the remaining heritage is divided. Somehow I thought I remembered that wasn't the case. Maybe they changed that or it was something I remembered from CK2. That makes everything a bit more plannable, of course.

[CrUsHeR]

Scandinavian Elective:


1. Conquer & Create your local kingdom title - keep as many counties / duchies as you can

2. Take the decision to add Scandinavian Elective

3. Create a second kingdom, but DO NOT add Scandinavian Elective to this one
(remove that law if the 2nd kingdom already has it, example if you subjugate Sweden)

4. Always vote for your firstborn son, the primary heir


So what happens is that your primary heir always gets elected for your primary kingdom, and he always receives the second kingdom from partition.

Other children can only inherit counties and duchies outside of your primary kingdom, and of course any tertiary kingdoms from (confederate) partition.

This is de-facto primogeniture, as you are guaranteed to forever keep all the counties and duchies within your primary kingdom.

So you can go wild on the concubines and lovers, the number of your own children is irrelevant (as long as you have at least 1 eliglible son). Just like in real history.


Just take note - you have to accomplish both kingdoms and the elective title during your first ruler's lifetime. So any of the older historical rulers may not be ideal.

[CrUsHeR]

Originally posted by Albatross:

It's good to know, though, that the heirs' "possessions" (received ahead of time) actually count when the remaining heritage is divided. Somehow I thought I remembered that wasn't the case. Maybe they changed that or it was something I remembered from CK2. That makes everything a bit more plannable, of course.

FYI - if you grant your sons independence during your lifetime, they still stand to inherit a full share of your property.

So for example you rule Scandinavia as Emperor, grant a son England and make him independent, he will show up again in your "lost titles on succession".
Meaning he keeps England, but also gets any other kingdoms / duchies / counties from your remaining realm.

Instead you need to let the children inherit titles as normal, then after your death let your heir grant them independence.

[Dimwit Donald (very high IQ)]

So, what's inside your primary title never gets split, no matter whether it's a duchy, kingdom or empire? (Empires are probably excluded, I guess?...)

And something else: I had this awesome idea of breeding the perfect master race by cultivating all the (good...) inheritable traits. I noticed you can get all the requirements for that dynasty-booster-"perk" in the character builder already while staying below 400 cost, if you take beauty tier 3, strength tier 1 and intelligence tier 1.

However, all my children turned out less master race than expected (like beauty 1 and strength 1 only)... Seems like the only way to accomplish this sort of thing is by massive inbreeding. Sooo, are there any cultural or religious attributes that would make this easier by removing marriage restrictions or even reducing the risk of disability? I saw there was a character trait for this (something with blood...), and it's supposed to be inhereted, too, but none of the children actually received it.

[CrUsHeR]

Originally posted by Albatross:

So, what's inside your primary title never gets split, no matter whether it's a duchy, kingdom or empire? (Empires are probably excluded, I guess?...)

More or less.

Example you start within the Kingdom of Norway.
Keep all counties of the best duchies - Trændalog and Viken - for yourself, including the duchy titles.

Now enact the Scandinavian Elective Law for Norway via the "Adopt Special Succession Type" decision. Do not apply this manually to other titles.
Vote for your primary heir.

Then you steal the Kingdom of Sweden from Bjorn Ironside.
Remove its elective law (AI rulers always use it whenever possible).
You can use any kingdom title, though ideally within your own de jure empire.

Press F2 and check the succession tab: Primary heir gets everything.

Now you could go AFK and fast forward until 1453 - as long as you always vote for your primary heir in the Norway election, you will never lose a single title.

Further titles will still be split among extra sons; example if you conquer Moray in Scotland, your second son will receive that duchy on succession, but remain a vassal. If you conquer >50% of of Ireland, the second son will inherit that kingdom instead and become independent.

Though you can always conquer these realms back with very easy wars, if so desired.

Originally posted by Albatross:

(Empires are probably excluded, I guess?...)

Just tested this to be 100% sure:

If you create an empire, this empire-tier title will replace the second kingdom for the succession trick.


So in the exact case above:

Your primary heir keeps Norway and all the counties + duchies, and the Empire.
Your second son now gets Sweden.

If you destroy the title of Sweden, yet again nobody except your heir gets anything.

Same confederate partition rules apply now; external kingdoms stay in the realm, unless there is enough land to form a second empire.


https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=3145251730

Example game with 10 sons. Only the firstborn inherits.
You can see there's only the Norway kingdom with Elective attached (the scroll icon)

[VoiD]

And that's how politcs are done IRL