Confused about the new Death/Infirm changes.

[DaniTheHero]

I have a character with tons of health+ modifiers and many counter illness ones.
He also has infirm.
His health is "fine" so in no danger of death, but the moment he ages to 70 he instantly dies. Rolled back the safe multiple times to confirm.

Why is that?

[Klutch]

i think the death from natural causes roll happens one year before death

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by Klutch:

i think the death from natural causes roll happens one year before death

That's.. terrible. What's the point of a health modifier then. That character would've lived till over 80 with these stats..

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by Klutch:

i think the death from natural causes roll happens one year before death

No, the Death Rolls only happens, if a Character is under 3 Health Points, check the Defines File, for this.

You only get a 1 year more, when you have the Perk, but your character as already died, so increasing your Health after you have gotten the Event, don't save you.

[JC]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by Klutch:

i think the death from natural causes roll happens one year before death

That's.. terrible. What's the point of a health modifier then. That character would've lived till over 80 with these stats..

Why are you so sure 70 isn't what he made it to because of all the bonuses, maybe he should of been dead at 55?

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by JC:

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

That's.. terrible. What's the point of a health modifier then. That character would've lived till over 80 with these stats..

Why are you so sure 70 isn't what he made it to because of all the bonuses, maybe he should of been dead at 55?

Well first of all his health indicator is fine, not poor.

Second, this is my 1231312 playthrough. When a character has a Strong, A Physical trait, the two traits from the Learning tree that give health, the learning tree focus that gives health, some Tournament/Hunting trait bonuses and more, the guy would obviously live above 80 in normal circumstances.

It's also something clearly predetermined and not a random death role, because my save was from January and the death occurred at the 26 of September every time, regardless of how many times I rolledback to the first month. Unless something was entirely changed this patch that I don't understand..

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by JC:

Why are you so sure 70 isn't what he made it to because of all the bonuses, maybe he should of been dead at 55?

Well first of all his health indicator is fine, not poor.

Second, this is my 1231312 playthrough. When a character has a Strong, A Physical trait, the two traits from the Learning tree that give health, the learning tree focus that gives health, some Tournament/Hunting trait bonuses and more, the guy would obviously live above 80 in normal circumstances.

It's also something clearly predetermined and not a random death role, because my save was from January and the death occurred at the 26 of September every time, regardless of how many times I rolledback to the first month. Unless something was entirely changed this patch that I don't understand..

Did you get the "dead in one year" notification from the Know Thyself perk prior to your January save?

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Well first of all his health indicator is fine, not poor.

Second, this is my 1231312 playthrough. When a character has a Strong, A Physical trait, the two traits from the Learning tree that give health, the learning tree focus that gives health, some Tournament/Hunting trait bonuses and more, the guy would obviously live above 80 in normal circumstances.

It's also something clearly predetermined and not a random death role, because my save was from January and the death occurred at the 26 of September every time, regardless of how many times I rolledback to the first month. Unless something was entirely changed this patch that I don't understand..

Did you get the "dead in one year" notification from the Know Thyself perk prior to your January save?

I did, but I then picked up two health modifiers right after thanks to learning events. Usually that negates it from my own experience

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Did you get the "dead in one year" notification from the Know Thyself perk prior to your January save?

I did, but I then picked up two health modifiers right after thanks to learning events. Usually that negates it from my own experience

That's why. The Know Thyself alert triggers when you would normally die. So if you didn't have the perk, you would have immediately died at that moment. It instead gives you one more year to live that cannot be changed. So that's why you keep dying on the same date.

Know Thyself basically gives you a free extra year of life from the point you should have died, and boosting your health from that point on won't help

[spasti696969]

They roll some of that stuff ahead of time to prevent save scumming.

The way someone explained it to me once, "Know Thyself" triggers when you would have "died" normally. They roll a dice and add or subtract a few weeks from the current date. I've never had it be more than a month. So when you get the notification check the date and plan accordingly.

So in addition to giving you time to plan your succession and prevent the realm from breaking, Know Thyself basically also gives you an extra free year of life. It's my favorite perk in the game by far.

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by spasti696969:

They roll some of that stuff ahead of time to prevent save scumming.

The way someone explained it to me once, "Know Thyself" triggers when you would have "died" normally. They roll a dice and add or subtract a few weeks from the current date. I've never had it be more than a month. So when you get the notification check the date and plan accordingly.

So in addition to giving you time to plan your succession and prevent the realm from breaking, Know Thyself basically also gives you an extra free year of life. It's my favorite perk in the game by far.

This must've been due to some change, I could always delay that roll with save scumming or simple save reloads.

[Klutch]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

I did, but I then picked up two health modifiers right after thanks to learning events. Usually that negates it from my own experience

That's why. The Know Thyself alert triggers when you would normally die. So if you didn't have the perk, you would have immediately died at that moment. It instead gives you one more year to live that cannot be changed. So that's why you keep dying on the same date.

Know Thyself basically gives you a free extra year of life from the point you should have died, and boosting your health from that point on won't help

I didn't know it gave you a whole exxtra year, that makes that perk even better than I thought and it was already a good one

[The Former]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by JC:

Why are you so sure 70 isn't what he made it to because of all the bonuses, maybe he should of been dead at 55?

Well first of all his health indicator is fine, not poor.

Second, this is my 1231312 playthrough. When a character has a Strong, A Physical trait, the two traits from the Learning tree that give health, the learning tree focus that gives health, some Tournament/Hunting trait bonuses and more, the guy would obviously live above 80 in normal circumstances.

It's also something clearly predetermined and not a random death role, because my save was from January and the death occurred at the 26 of September every time, regardless of how many times I rolledback to the first month. Unless something was entirely changed this patch that I don't understand..

Perhaps that was an issue. People were complaining for a while about the many characters living to be 100+.

[Angel]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

I did, but I then picked up two health modifiers right after thanks to learning events. Usually that negates it from my own experience

That's why. The Know Thyself alert triggers when you would normally die. So if you didn't have the perk, you would have immediately died at that moment. It instead gives you one more year to live that cannot be changed. So that's why you keep dying on the same date.

Know Thyself basically gives you a free extra year of life from the point you should have died, and boosting your health from that point on won't help

this is very good info to know, thanks for sharing

[DaniTheHero]

I don't think I like this change then.
What's the point of finishing the health tree then?
Before all this, you would focus on that tree, instead of trees that would actually impact your power or growth for the sake of life extension. You lose many bonuses you could of had to allow your current character to live longer and do more things.

If he's gonna die at about 70 anyways, you may as-well forget about stacking health modifiers and the associated decisions/Traits/Tree.

A character should not randomly die due to an unavoidable event you can't even re-roll when your own health indicator is in the healthy parameters (Fine instead of Poor).

The challenge in the game needs to come from Gameplay/Combat improvements, better AI, and more in depth Vassal/Realm relationships, not by killing your character randomly and sooner than before to cause unexpected and completely RNG based chaos.

[jerrypocalypse]

The health tree still makes you live longer. It just sounds like you had multiple debuffs that would have caused you to die around 69, triggering Know Thyself.

Also, because of the way the health system works (variable amount of health lost each time interval), the sooner you get the health boosts, the longer you'll live. If you hit poor health at like 50 and wait until 60 to get the health boosts, it's not going to do as much as if you boosted yourself in your 20s.

This isn't a recent change, it's been this way for a while. I found out about it from a mod/dev post several months ago in a discussion about the Know Thyself perk