Friends and Foes?

[PaleEnchantress]

I just bought the royal package. Friends and Foes is pretty much the only DLC I do not have. The reviews make me reluctant to purchase it.

People are saying the only thing it does is add more ways, and frequency with, you can be betrayed. Is that literal or an exaggeration? The last thing I want is a pack that discourages diplomacy because you can't trust anyone.

Does it add new diplomatic options and subterfugue for the player, make alliances more rewarding, anything like that?

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by PaleEnchantress:

I just bought the royal package. Friends and Foes is pretty much the only DLC I do not have. The reviews make me reluctant to purchase it.

People are saying the only thing it does is add more ways, and frequency with, you can be betrayed. Is that literal or an exaggeration? The last thing I want is a pack that discourages diplomacy because you can't trust anyone.

Does it add new diplomatic options and subterfugue for the player, make alliances more rewarding, anything like that?

Stay away from this DLC, because this DLC has so many Bugs, that nobody can list them all.

Like Characters are getting more than 4 personality traits(Because 4 is the absolut Limit, but this DLC Events are still ignoring it)

Or characters murdering their own childs, because of House Feud against their own House(without the sadistic trait).

[jerrypocalypse]

The reviews for it are overblown. Personally, I love the events from Friends & Foes. It's a great event pack, particularly if you enjoy the emergent storytelling in the game. There are plenty of "good" events that it adds, but players choose to only acknowledge the negative ones, many of which have non-negative outcomes.

Because of Friends & Foes, an heir I wasn't looking forward to playing (but my only option just due to bad luck with kids on that ruler) became one of my most memorable and interesting ruler's to play in recent memory, simply due to some of the fun rival/friend events in the DLC.

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

The reviews for it are overblown. Personally, I love the events from Friends & Foes. It's a great event pack, particularly if you enjoy the emergent storytelling in the game. There are plenty of "good" events that it adds, but players choose to only acknowledge the negative ones, many of which have non-negative outcomes.

Because of Friends & Foes, an heir I wasn't looking forward to playing (but my only option just due to bad luck with kids on that ruler) became one of my most memorable and interesting ruler's to play in recent memory, simply due to some of the fun rival/friend events in the DLC.

There is not a single event in this DLC, who works as it should.

This DLC is not even wroth it, if it where free.

And reviews are right, this is badest DLC Paradox has ever released.


I recently got an Event from this DLC, who my character complains about his son, is like a child, but he is a child and not an adult.
So this was a good Example for me, how bad this DLC Events are coded.

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

There is not a single event in this DLC, who works as it should.

That's a hyperbolic statement if I've ever seen one, and is intentionally misrepresentative. Opinions are fine, but this is a straight falsehood.

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

This DLC is not even wroth it, if it where free.

And reviews are right, this is badest DLC Paradox has ever released.

I personally think it's worth every penny and feel it's quite good.

[Rex is back, baby!]

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

There is not a single event in this DLC, who works as it should.

That's a hyperbolic statement if I've ever seen one, and is intentionally misrepresentative. Opinions are fine, but this is a straight falsehood.

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

This DLC is not even wroth it, if it where free.

And reviews are right, this is badest DLC Paradox has ever released.

I personally think it's worth every penny and feel it's quite good.

Agreed. I haven't had issue with it and the events are entertaining! Great for immersive storytelling. Feud mechanics have been really fun. I had a Romeo & Juliet situation in one game, and an international spy thriller assassination plot in another game.

Back during the "Castle" update, there were gamebreaking bugs with the DLC, but currently in the "Robe" build, it has been running smoothly. To give credit where credit is due, PDX does squash [edit: game-disrupting, non-minor] bugs near-immediately upon discovery.

Treat it as a cosmetic enhancement, but for storycrafting. It only seeks to add to the role play and narrative game. Of course, if you've the money to spare.

edit note: I consider a bug as something that disrupts game flow or breaks the game. Something minor, like graphical, or a spelling error... is low priority/concern to me. Adding this edit so people understand my logic and implications^^

[jerrypocalypse]

Originally posted by Rex is Returning in March 2023:

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

That's a hyperbolic statement if I've ever seen one, and is intentionally misrepresentative. Opinions are fine, but this is a straight falsehood.


I personally think it's worth every penny and feel it's quite good.

Agreed. I haven't had issue with it and the events are entertaining!

Back during "Castle" there were bugs with the DLC, but in the "Robe" buikd I've seen nothing.

It's basically just a cosmetic upgrade. If you want more flavor tooings on your ice cream, go for it.

It doesn't takeaway from the game, and there, in my many hours of playthrough, aren't any bugs that destroy my immersion.

Back in the Castle update, opinion would be different, but I'll give PDX credit where credit is due. They're quick to exterminate the bugs they find.

I'd certainly agree with that sentiment.

[Rex is back, baby!]

Originally posted by PaleEnchantress:

I just bought the royal package. Friends and Foes is pretty much the only DLC I do not have. The reviews make me reluctant to purchase it.

People are saying the only thing it does is add more ways, and frequency with, you can be betrayed. Is that literal or an exaggeration? The last thing I want is a pack that discourages diplomacy because you can't trust anyone.

Does it add new diplomatic options and subterfugue for the player, make alliances more rewarding, anything like that?

To add. It gives more options and nuance to the rival and friend mechanics.

Both can help or hinder diplomacy and intrigue. In my current game, I became BFFs with the current Byzantium emperor through events.

The Fued mechanics are really fun, especially if it is late game and big Dynasty vs big Dynasty.


Oversimplified it gives you more options to manipulate opinion modifiers and stress events. A rival dies or gets humiliation? Stress relief. A friend? Heartbreak.

Efit: also, it adds music and expands that memory system.

[Ēarendel]

There was a mod to fix the bugs on it. HOWEVER. It is a widely known and reported issue, that your spouse will always cheat on you, even if the odds are stacked against it, simply because, the event is programmed to do so without accounting for anything.

[Emperor2000]

Originally posted by Rex is Returning in March 2023:

Originally posted by PaleEnchantress:

I just bought the royal package. Friends and Foes is pretty much the only DLC I do not have. The reviews make me reluctant to purchase it.

People are saying the only thing it does is add more ways, and frequency with, you can be betrayed. Is that literal or an exaggeration? The last thing I want is a pack that discourages diplomacy because you can't trust anyone.

Does it add new diplomatic options and subterfugue for the player, make alliances more rewarding, anything like that?

To add. It gives more options and nuance to the rival and friend mechanics.

Both can help or hinder diplomacy and intrigue. In my current game, I became BFFs with the current Byzantium emperor through events.

The Fued mechanics are really fun, especially if it is late game and big Dynasty vs big Dynasty.

Oversimplified it gives you more options to manipulate opinion modifiers and stress events. A rival dies or gets humiliation? Stress relief. A friend? Heartbreak.

It does not give more options, it creates Rivalries, where there should no rivalries between 2 characters, because they still have +100 opinion of eachother, even CK2 has respect the opinion of Characters, where CK3 still ignores Opinions completly.

And the Feud mechanic is still broken, without the Unofficial Patch Mod, because it is still possible that a House can feud itself or characters murdering childs besides having the forgiving and compassionate traits.

This DLC alone cause the AI to forgot their personality.

[Ēarendel]

Originally posted by Rex is Returning in March 2023:

Originally posted by jerrypocalypse:

That's a hyperbolic statement if I've ever seen one, and is intentionally misrepresentative. Opinions are fine, but this is a straight falsehood.


I personally think it's worth every penny and feel it's quite good.

Agreed. I haven't had issue with it and the events are entertaining! Great for immersive storytelling. Feud mechanics have been really fun. I had a Romeo & Juliet situation in one game, and an international spy thriller assassination plot in another game.

Back during the "Castle" update, there were gamebreaking bugs with the DLC, but currently in the "Robe" build, it has been running smoothly. To give credit where credit is due, PDX does squash bugs near-immediately upon discovery

Treat it as a cosmetic enhancement, but for storycrafting. It only seeks to add to the role play and narrative game. Of course, if you've the money to spare.

My guy, they can't fix an apparent hair color bug for 3 years now, is that your definition of near-immediately?

[Rex is back, baby!]

Originally posted by Ēarendel:

HOWEVER. It is a widely known and reported issue, that your spouse will always cheat on you, even if the odds are stacked against it, simply because, the event is programmed to do so without accounting for anything.

Citation Needed. I've only had my spouse cheat on me 1 in 3 games. So "always cheat on you" is hyperbole. Edit: Plus, it made her get the "loyal" trait, so that's a +1 in my book.

Originally posted by Emperor2000:

It does not give more options, it creates Rivalries, where there should no rivalries between 2 characters, because they still have +100 opinion of eachother, even CK2 has respect the opinion of Characters, where CK3 still ignores Opinions completly.

And the Feud mechanic is still broken, without the Unofficial Patch Mod, because it is still possible that a House can feud itself or characters murdering childs besides having the forgiving and compassionate traits.

This DLC alone cause the AI to forgot their personality.

Moving forward, please avoid "should" arguments. Refer to OP's original question:

"Does it add new diplomatic options and subterfugue for the player, make alliances more rewarding, anything like that?"

Yes or No. Why?

The arguments you are trying to push are subjective and refer to ideological differences. Specifically, optimism vs pessimism. Your approach is pessimistic. My approach is optimistic. We won't agree with each other, so please stick to the actual content of the question. I have not experienced the same as you, I have not seen anything that I would warrant "broken." I did, during "Castle," but since I started playing again Mid-February, I have not. So, I have to disagree with you. If you still want to convince me, I'm going to ask for citation and evidence. Please keep it to the topic.

Originally posted by Ēarendel:

My guy, they can't fix an apparent hair color bug for 3 years now, is that your definition of near-immediately?

My intention of 'near-immediately' was for game-breaking and serious bugs. I apologize if that implication was not apparent. .We're here to discuss the Friend and Foes DLC and what is functionally brings, not harp on PDX and CK3's design in general.

I think this argument is grasping at straws. I never have experienced this bug, so I cannot comment on the severity or immersion-breaking. Also, as you said, it is 3-years old. Friends and Foes came out in 2022. This bug predates the F&F update, so is unrelated. Part of the Vanilla experience, which OP already has.

[Seggellion]

The never ending family feuds are tiresome. Now it just forces me to play an intrigue character until I can wipe out the enemy family.

[kingsims]

Honestly you are better off Foes and Friends when its 50 - 75% off and then use the unoffical patch Mod in the workshop.

https://steamcommunity.com/sharedfiles/filedetails/?id=2871648329&searchtext=Patch

Without it there are game breaking chains. Its not required. Royal Court, Norse/Viking DLC, and Iberia DLC are all you need (It makes those regions very interesting and likewise with england.

The unoffical patch should be merged into the main game. You can still play ironman with the Unoffical patch, but you lose out achievements.