kicking the pope out of italy

[chaddy]

so i have a situation i formed the roman empire, but i only vassalized the pope to get the title. anyway i got Rome and turned it into my capital but the county next to it is owned by the pope who has become my vassall,
i set him free and then attack him again to claim that land but it again just vassalized him... how do i get rid of him, i cant give him titles... can keep him happy easy enough but he still spawns holy wars against me.. any suggestions?

[snuggleform]

I think there's only one way to get rid of the pope for good, and that's to use the "dismantle the papacy decision." You need to control the entire region of Italia (including malta, sicily, sardinia, not merely what the empire of italy shows), then flip to a muslim faith (there are other faiths that work too but it's very easy to flip to Ash'ari as they're numerous and closeby), and make sure the pope has no land or vassals. He will always have minimum 1 title, but at long as he reads 0/7 domain and no vassals he will be unlanded, which is one of the requirements. If you have the right faith, control Italia, and the pope is unlanded, you get a decision to remove the head of faith from the catholics for good.

[brownacs]

The Pope became your vassal? That's weird. Snuggle's right in that the specific decision is the only way to actually remove the Pope from the game but you should be able to make him 'unlanded' without. I'm 99.9% certain I've had Dharmic and Bori Empires control the (former) Papal States without the Pope becoming my vassal. I remember being annoyed about it.

[snuggleform]

Oh and sometimes for whatever reason you may have to chase the Pope around a bit. I don't know why, but even if you take all his lands in one war, sometimes (not always) he moves to a random location. He once jumped from Italy to Sweden, had to chase him around to unland him. Damn sneaky pope >_>

[CrUsHeR]

Quite sure that the pope has to be your vassal if you control rome?

Same like e.g. the arab caliph has the nestorian patriarch as vassal

[chaddy]

yeah i control Rome but he has the province next to it,
i tried giving him another title and then take the one in italy, cause i'm fine with him being my vassal but i kinda want to control the whole duchy.

[humble_fool]

Originally posted by snuggleform:

sometimes for whatever reason you may have to chase the Pope around a bit

I love this game

[sbudy]

My solution to the pope problem was conquering most of the Catholic realms and converting them to my (custom Christian) faith. He's still there and he's still declaring Crusades against me, but they never actually happen since he does not have enbough volunteers to counter my huge army. A bit extreme solution but then you have it.
....The sneakier way to do this is conquering all the Catholic realms except the holy sites counties, (e.g. all of Britannia except Kent, all of Germania except Cologne), and then conquering the holy sites.
At some point on the game (if you are going for World Domination) Crusades are the only remaining challenge (at least until dear Temujin shows up), it's a pity giving them up.

[Kvinden]

Why can't you move the pope from Roma to Avignon ?

[brownacs]

Originally posted by sbudy:

(at least until dear Temujin shows up)

Did they nerf him or something? Might just be my anecdotal bias but I feel like the Mongol Empire used to get a lot further.

[snuggleform]

Originally posted by brownacs:

Originally posted by sbudy:

(at least until dear Temujin shows up)

Did they nerf him or something? Might just be my anecdotal bias but I feel like the Mongol Empire used to get a lot further.

I think there's just a lot of variance in how far he gets. I saw temujin declare war on my constantionople so his reach felt quite daunting, but in other runs he made it way less far than that.

[brownacs]

Originally posted by snuggleform:

I think there's just a lot of variance in how far he gets. I saw temujin declare war on my constantionople so his reach felt quite daunting, but in other runs he made it way less far than that.

I feel like that happened a lot more a year ago but it's probably just me.

[snuggleform]

Originally posted by sbudy:

My solution to the pope problem was conquering most of the Catholic realms and converting them to my (custom Christian) faith. He's still there and he's still declaring Crusades against me, but they never actually happen since he does not have enbough volunteers to counter my huge army. A bit extreme solution but then you have it.
....The sneakier way to do this is conquering all the Catholic realms except the holy sites counties, (e.g. all of Britannia except Kent, all of Germania except Cologne), and then conquering the holy sites.
At some point on the game (if you are going for World Domination) Crusades are the only remaining challenge (at least until dear Temujin shows up), it's a pity giving them up.

The pope can actually declare wars over areas that are not holy sites so if that is the point of you avoiding them, then you're in for a rude awakening. In addition to the holy sites he's very likely to declare war on the "heartlands" which I think is france and where the HRE are. And he can even declare holy war anywhere else in range but with very low probability.

[brownacs]

Originally posted by snuggleform:

In addition to the holy sites he's very likely to declare war on the "heartlands" which I think is france and where the HRE are.

I think Spain's in there too. Reconquista and all. Either that or the cycle crusades against the Sultanate (/Kingdom) of Asturias were (/are) a bug.