Some traits are just terrible with no upside to them at all

[DaniTheHero]

Compassionate is a terrible trait, literally has only downsides for example.

Or when you are educating a child and you have to choose between shy,impatient and Gluttonos which are all terrible, which Shy diplomacy is impossible and feasts are a nono, with impatient people dislike you by default, and gluttonos is a sin like everywhere and you always get obese.

y dis

[kaiyl_kariashi]

because people aren't perfect.

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by kaiyl_kariashi:

because people aren't perfect.

No but all traits should have a purpose, for example Lazy is a "bad" trait that makes you lose -1 of all skills, but you there's no other major drawback and you get some better stress loss.

Callus although a "bad" trait allows a better character to play intruige easier.

Gluttonos for example has no upsides, it's literally there to make your character worse.
Same with Compassionate, you can't even put people in jail without going mad.

And the Shy,Impatient,Gluttonos problem is worse because you HAVE to pick one of those 3 if the option shows up, always ruins a character.

[The Former]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by kaiyl_kariashi:

because people aren't perfect.

No but all traits should have a purpose, for example Lazy is a "bad" trait that makes you lose -1 of all skills, but you there's no other major drawback and you get some better stress loss.

Callus although a "bad" trait allows a better character to play intruige easier.

Gluttonos for example has no upsides, it's literally there to make your character worse.
Same with Compassionate, you can't even put people in jail without going mad.

And the Shy,Impatient,Gluttonos problem is worse because you HAVE to pick one of those 3 if the option shows up, always ruins a character.

All traits do have a purpose. Sometimes that purpose is to make life more challenging for a character. You'll enjoy the game a lot more if you don't try to min/max everything.

Also, these all have upsides. Impatient gives you +20% Monthly Prestige and +15% Hostile Scheme Power. Gluttonous gives you +10% Stress loss. Every trait has some kind of mechanical upside, it's just that some are deliberately meant to make life difficult.

[CrUsHeR]

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

Originally posted by kaiyl_kariashi:

because people aren't perfect.

No but all traits should have a purpose, for example Lazy is a "bad" trait that makes you lose -1 of all skills, but you there's no other major drawback and you get some better stress loss.

Callus although a "bad" trait allows a better character to play intruige easier.

Gluttonos for example has no upsides, it's literally there to make your character worse.
Same with Compassionate, you can't even put people in jail without going mad.

And the Shy,Impatient,Gluttonos problem is worse because you HAVE to pick one of those 3 if the option shows up, always ruins a character.

Lazy actually gives a lot of stress for many ambitious choices.

Callous already makes you unsexy and unpopular. Also a sin in some religions.

Gluttonous, well that's just fat people with zero self-control. Why should this have an upside?

etc. etc.



Anyways, these are all factors to express the personality of each character. This is clearly designed in a "nobody's perfect" fashion, so you always gotta consider yourself lucky when an heir only has traits which suit a certain productive (and not necessarily your favorite type of) playstyle.

[Illusion17]

I despise humble. I dunno if they changed it, but you weren't able to take some decisions such as forming new kingdoms or empires with a humble leader.

[VipreRX]

"Some traits are just terrible with no upside to them at all"

That is correct. Sometimes life just sucks with no upside at all and sometimes your kid is just plain ugly.

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by CrUsHeR:

Originally posted by DaniTheHero:

No but all traits should have a purpose, for example Lazy is a "bad" trait that makes you lose -1 of all skills, but you there's no other major drawback and you get some better stress loss.

Callus although a "bad" trait allows a better character to play intruige easier.

Gluttonos for example has no upsides, it's literally there to make your character worse.
Same with Compassionate, you can't even put people in jail without going mad.

And the Shy,Impatient,Gluttonos problem is worse because you HAVE to pick one of those 3 if the option shows up, always ruins a character.

Lazy actually gives a lot of stress for many ambitious choices.

Callous already makes you unsexy and unpopular. Also a sin in some religions.

Gluttonous, well that's just fat people with zero self-control. Why should this have an upside?

etc. etc.



Anyways, these are all factors to express the personality of each character. This is clearly designed in a "nobody's perfect" fashion, so you always gotta consider yourself lucky when an heir only has traits which suit a certain productive (and not necessarily your favorite type of) playstyle.

I still think these 3 shouldn't be lumped into the same choice

[Crim]

Compassion is a weakness!

[DaniTheHero]

Originally posted by Talamare:

Compassion is a weakness!

it really is arguably the worst trait in the game XD

[Azunai]

all traits have an upside and a downside. of course in some cases the upside is much less valuable than the downsides.

but imo traits are fine. CK3 is supposed to be a bit of a roleplaying game after all. character traits don't have to be balanced.

that being said, some of the traits could use some refinement. for example a shy character has a hard time with everyone, but if they actually manage to make friends or to romance their spouse despite the difficulties then interactions with their friends/soulmate/lover probably shouldn't incur the normal stress gain they get for interacting with strangers.

[someblk]

I mentioned elsewhere with shy, although I can understand it impacting personal interactions (for example, swaying, feasts, etc) it should NOT be giving stress for hiring people or forming alliances, for example. Rulers have subordinates to deal with hiring and diplomats to deal with alliances, so being shy should have absolutely no impact on these types of interactions.

[The Former]

Originally posted by someblk:

I mentioned elsewhere with shy, although I can understand it impacting personal interactions (for example, swaying, feasts, etc) it should NOT be giving stress for hiring people or forming alliances, for example. Rulers have subordinates to deal with hiring and diplomats to deal with alliances, so being shy should have absolutely no impact on these types of interactions.

I can agree with that. Technically you don't have to hire someone yourself, you could send someone else to do it as a surrogate. Alliances... Well, that one maybe, because you'd have to interact directly to convince the other ruler of the marriage's value.

[CrUsHeR]

Sorry but an actually shy person is entirely unfit for a public office like a king or emperor. That's just an attribute you have to avoid at all costs.

Not to be confused with introvert, probably the majority of great historical figures falls into that category.

[T-Murdah]

Of course the game has negative traits as much as positive traits.

Some of them are really annoying paired with the stress-o-meter, but it's a necessary feature. You just need to adapt to the characters.

[Night Hunter]

So, like in reality, some traits ARE simply better than others in most contexts. That said, Compassionate, for example, does not only have downsides - it has +2 diplomacy and +5 attraction opinion (it also has reduced dread, which can be contextually good or bad). It can be good or bad for various contextual events and decisions.

This is a role-playing game and alternate history simulator more than a power-gaming fantasy game - not everything is supposed to be great all the time for your character, which is why there are things in the game that are mostly or entirely disadvantageous instead of everything being advantageous or completely balanced. You're trying to power game instead of playing your character's actual personality, which is not the approach intended by the game design (the stress mechanic was intentionally added to incentivize role playing the characters instead of simply maximizing outcomes in terms of the game mechanics - so stop trying to imprison people as a compassionate character, stop trying to hold mass social events as a shy character, etc.).