Outremer is Trash, TRASH! Do Not Form It!

[fancyjackkester]

So I started as the count of Dublin, and slowly worked my way up to King of Ireland. After switching from Insular to Catholic to Holy War on the Lollard Welsh, I formed Wales. Halfway through conquering Scotland, the Pope called for the first crusade for Jerusalem. Despite being literally the furthest away in the world and possessing only a measly 4k troops, I somehow came in first place in crusade contribution (probably because the AI troops ran around in circles instead of doing a siege) and started playing as my Amazonian Genius granddaughter since I was getting a bit bored in Britannia.

Fast forward 250 years, and I've finally formed the Outremer Empire after joining Byzantium, having a Catholic crusade after . BUT UNFORTUNATELY FOR ME, Outremer culture, which wasn't even on the map and spawned from my Irish culture, says it is part of the Frankish culture group and wasn't even halfway through the High Middle Ages while my Irish culture had gotten almost done with everything in the Late Middle Ages technologies due to playing a few Learning focused characters. If I wasn't playing in Ironman mode this wouldn't be a problem because I could just reload, but now I'm facing a crisis as my domain limit has dropped by 3 and my 6 sons are going to divide the land by partition after I spent two whole characters reconsolidating Palestine and Outrejordain as my primary holdings. I don't even have High Partition anymore, so I'm really screwed unless I spend all of my character's Prestige and Piety disinheriting all but one of my heirs.

So please Paradox, please fix Outremer to be a copy of the culture that forms it instead of a bunch of backwards losers who are 200 years behind in technology!

[Crim]

So it's not Outremer that's trash at all

Summary
"I worked really hard to develop the Tech in my Culture, and lost those techs when I did a Culture Switch"

[Mr armchair general]

Originally posted by Talamare:

So it's not Outremer that's trash at all

Summary
"I worked really hard to develop the Tech in my Culture, and lost those techs when I did a Culture Switch"

This answered the whole thing basically lol.

[fancyjackkester]

The Outremer culture does not exist on the map until you form it, so I think it's kind of stupid that it isn't the same as the culture you're playing as with the bonus of Desert Combat tech. Plus, every other vassal in the empire is still Irish and benefiting from the higher domain limit and primogenitre since none of them changed culture with me, my ruler is the only Outremer in existence and made many of the tech advancements herself.

[eye81]

it really should just make the culture mirror whatever culture that you are when you create it unless its already been created.

[Steinaar]

A few things to note on this thread.

1) Ai is so annoying when they do not assist or do circles. Worst one is they go by boat and encircle you entirely after chasing them to the coast. Annoying as all +1

2) Yes amazonian and genius traits, funny I just started trying to breed these into my lineage..you're smart OP i like you. +1

3) Only a fool learns from his own mistakes, a wise man learns from others. Thanks for explaining how changing cultures works, this over rides your laws and succession doctrines yikes.

OP just close out the game and come back tomorrow with a renewed perspective, challenge accepted not all is lost.

P.S Talamare this might be true and good point but misery loves company. I'm sure it was a hard pill to swallow for jackkester.

[Messsucher]

Originally posted by eye81:

it really should just make the culture mirror whatever culture that you are when you create it unless its already been created.

What's the point of a new culture, if it is a carbon copy of your existing culture? How you can even argue that it is different culture?

Regarding OP, you changed culture, your society went backwards, they adapted old ways instead of keeping your super modern ways. IRL example: Taliban.

Everything is working, not broken, not bugged.

[fancyjackkester]

I disinherited all but one of my sons, as soon as he inherited everything I reconverted the single Outremer county spawned by the decision back to Irish and everything’s back on track. Super annoying is all it was.

[Donathan Cheadledge]

Originally posted by Messsucher:

Originally posted by eye81:

it really should just make the culture mirror whatever culture that you are when you create it unless its already been created.

What's the point of a new culture, if it is a carbon copy of your existing culture? How you can even argue that it is different culture?

Regarding OP, you changed culture, your society went backwards, they adapted old ways instead of keeping your super modern ways. IRL example: Taliban.

Everything is working, not broken, not bugged.

Not a bug but it's questionably implemented. This culture is not a culture that would've historically existed before the game's start dates, so why it is specifically tied to being a Frankish group? And why would a crusader state suddenly forgo half the technical innovations of their predecessor culture? The 'embrace the old ways' thing doesn't really stick if the game is simultaneously claiming that they're not even part of the same culture *group* as their founders.

Sure OP might've made a bit of a gameplay blunder but the actual mechanic is nonsensical.

[Steinaar]

Originally posted by fancyjackkester:

I disinherited all but one of my sons, as soon as he inherited everything I reconverted the single Outremer county spawned by the decision back to Irish and everything’s back on track. Super annoying is all it was.

Glad to hear things worked out for you and you heeded the challenge vs quit. +1

Donathan Cheadledge makes a valid point here, why would you forego your past knowledge even if you changed cultures.

Something to take note of on cultures in real life, I've been around the world and what I find is when interacting with other cultures both parties are keen to share knowledge with each other. So I find ways people live and think in one area of the world and I share my knowledge of things I find relatable of importance. Never does one truly lose knowledge. I can see losing some benefits from living where I do now if I lived in a less diverse area of the world. When I went to war we had to help them with irrigation, electricity, housing, schooling etc not just fight the bad guys. If I were to live in this area permanently I can see losing some aspects. Otherwise I never forgot how I lived where I do now. It's a hard one to code for sure.

[Crim]

Originally posted by Steinaar:

Originally posted by fancyjackkester:

I disinherited all but one of my sons, as soon as he inherited everything I reconverted the single Outremer county spawned by the decision back to Irish and everything’s back on track. Super annoying is all it was.

Glad to hear things worked out for you and you heeded the challenge vs quit. +1

Donathan Cheadledge makes a valid point here, why would you forego your past knowledge even if you changed cultures.

Something to take note of on cultures in real life, I've been around the world and what I find is when interacting with other cultures both parties are keen to share knowledge with each other. So I find ways people live and think in one area of the world and I share my knowledge of things I find relatable of importance. Never does one truly lose knowledge. I can see losing some benefits from living where I do now if I lived in a less diverse area of the world. When I went to war we had to help them with irrigation, electricity, housing, schooling etc not just fight the bad guys. If I were to live in this area permanently I can see losing some aspects. Otherwise I never forgot how I lived where I do now. It's a hard one to code for sure.

Completely unrelated to OP
In one of my games, My King died without a male heir, the moment he did he got declared war by 2 different major powers (both of which bought a ton of mercs for some reason), lost 2/3rds of his Kingdom, then had my aunt declare war on me instating her as Queen, finally a get a secret revealed that she's the one that murdered my King!... I literally went from a major King to a Count within a year while I was powerless kid to stop it...

It took a while but damn did it feel good when I clicked the Execute button on her

[eye81]

Originally posted by Messsucher:

Originally posted by eye81:

it really should just make the culture mirror whatever culture that you are when you create it unless its already been created.

What's the point of a new culture, if it is a carbon copy of your existing culture? How you can even argue that it is different culture?

Regarding OP, you changed culture, your society went backwards, they adapted old ways instead of keeping your super modern ways. IRL example: Taliban.

Everything is working, not broken, not bugged.

because outremar was just frankish but because of the large distance between the holy land and france outremar would grow parallel with french instead of with french. from a gameplay pov its basically a detriment since then you wont get that hot development from france. and since outremar was from french invaders if in this games case they were irish instead maybe the culture should rename itself to somthing more irish sounding.

[Crim]

Outremer apparently gets access to the strongest Cavalry in the game

[RedTurkey]

Note that only your capital change culture, so if you have another county that you directly controls and that have the Irish culture, you can switch your capital to there and switch culture with the decision to adopt local culture to recover your techs.

[Messsucher]

Originally posted by eye81:

Originally posted by Messsucher:

What's the point of a new culture, if it is a carbon copy of your existing culture? How you can even argue that it is different culture?

Regarding OP, you changed culture, your society went backwards, they adapted old ways instead of keeping your super modern ways. IRL example: Taliban.

Everything is working, not broken, not bugged.

because outremar was just frankish but because of the large distance between the holy land and france outremar would grow parallel with french instead of with french. from a gameplay pov its basically a detriment since then you wont get that hot development from france. and since outremar was from french invaders if in this games case they were irish instead maybe the culture should rename itself to somthing more irish sounding.

Ok there is complications.