It's all too easy. Something's wrong.

[wordsmith101]

MC is solving the characters' problems way, way, way too easily. Vriska and Terezi are suddenly happy pals again, the fandom OTP Davekat (which I hate, but I don't think it's colouring my perception here much) is together several years early and Karkat has a safe place to go to avoid the drones, Gamzee is less lonely now and thus possibly less easily influenced by Scratch (though they seem to be going with the whole "he was evil all along" idea, which is a separate gripe I can go into if anyone cares), Jade and Rose aren't alone anymore, Dave is dealing with his sexuality crisis years before it even started in the comic... It's annoying as all heck if taken at face value, but remember Doc Scratch is masterminding this, and has prevented MC from "skipping ahead". Scratch does nothing without a purpose. What purpose does this solve?

[HeeCawRoo]

setting aside terezis route being even more unbelievable than the others, i figured were meant to realize the tradeoff -- even though these problems are being "fixed", its at the expense of the game and everything that was meant to be happening being cancelled. that will likely cause some very big problems.

no idea about scratchs motivations, though.

[Everybody do the flop]

I agree with Davekat being a bad ship. The only reason why they were together is because they were forced to on the Meteor, while Rose and Kanaya wrote the book and Terezi and Vriska hung out.
Logically, Karkat should be into Sollux and Terezi at this point and skipping to 3 years later BS is stupid, especially since all the Trolls are alive and around at this point of time.

I really hate PQ and how it reads like an expensive fanfic. If you want Davekat and Trans Vriska it shouldn't have to be paid for.

[wordsmith101]

Hey, Davekat has the potential to be a good ship, I'd say, even though I personally dislike it; they clashed and they learned to get along, and they do have a great deal in common. (Too much to be very interesting, to my way of thinking, but that's only my personal taste as I like strongly contrasting pairs.) The problem was all of their development happened offscreen. The pre-retcon timeline was slightly better in that, but the entire meteor cast spent three in-comic years having maybe three conversations total onscreen, all the changes in their relationships happened between those conversations and we never saw it, and in the retcon all of that development was erased and we saw literally nothing but everything magically worked out okay anyway. The entire three-year journey was a bad decision, to my mind; everything that was actually shown happening in it could just as easily have happened in three weeks. I think maybe Hussie got uncomfortable with the shipping of thirteen-year-olds and wanted to make it a bit more respectable before anything serious happened with any of them? But nothing serious DID happen with them, anyway.

But anyway! Yeah, I don't like PQ on its face either, but my point is I think the writers might be going somewhere with this. I mean, can you imagine Doc Scratch allowing these goings-on which specifically prevent SGrub/SBurb from happening, unless he has a hidden agenda? Doomed timelines don't usually last this long.

[Everybody do the flop]

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Hey, Davekat has the potential to be a good ship, I'd say, even though I personally dislike it; they clashed and they learned to get along, and they do have a great deal in common. (Too much to be very interesting, to my way of thinking, but that's only my personal taste as I like strongly contrasting pairs.) The problem was all of their development happened offscreen. The pre-retcon timeline was slightly better in that, but the entire meteor cast spent three in-comic years having maybe three conversations total onscreen, all the changes in their relationships happened between those conversations and we never saw it, and in the retcon all of that development was erased and we saw literally nothing but everything magically worked out okay anyway. The entire three-year journey was a bad decision, to my mind; everything that was actually shown happening in it could just as easily have happened in three weeks. I think maybe Hussie got uncomfortable with the shipping of thirteen-year-olds and wanted to make it a bit more respectable before anything serious happened with any of them? But nothing serious DID happen with them, anyway.

But anyway! Yeah, I don't like PQ on its face either, but my point is I think the writers might be going somewhere with this. I mean, can you imagine Doc Scratch allowing these goings-on which specifically prevent SGrub/SBurb from happening, unless he has a hidden agenda? Doomed timelines don't usually last this long.

My problem with Davekat this time around is that Karkat and Dave spent one afternoon together and now Karkat is in love with him? That's just unrealistic, especially since he's supposed to have feelings for Sollux and Terezi at this point. It goes through all these hoops and none of the hoops make any narrative sense. Not to mention Sollux goes out of his way to protect Karkat and it feels like he's just backstabbing Sollux by choosing Dave instead.

[cgoose500]

Originally posted by Everybody do the flop:

My problem with Davekat this time around is that Karkat and Dave spent one afternoon together and now Karkat is in love with him? That's just unrealistic, especially since he's supposed to have feelings for Sollux and Terezi at this point. It goes through all these hoops and none of the hoops make any narrative sense. Not to mention Sollux goes out of his way to protect Karkat and it feels like he's just backstabbing Sollux by choosing Dave instead.

Is Karkat in love with him though?
I don't remember which troll said it, but I remember them just saying that Karkat wouldn't stop talking about Dave. That doesn't necessarily mean love. From Karkat's point of view he just met an entire race of aliens who share his weird blood color (he might not know about their blood yet though) and who aren't constantly under the threat of culling for being subpar in some way, and Dave is the cooler of the two he met.

[Everybody do the flop]

Originally posted by cgoose500:

Originally posted by Everybody do the flop:

My problem with Davekat this time around is that Karkat and Dave spent one afternoon together and now Karkat is in love with him? That's just unrealistic, especially since he's supposed to have feelings for Sollux and Terezi at this point. It goes through all these hoops and none of the hoops make any narrative sense. Not to mention Sollux goes out of his way to protect Karkat and it feels like he's just backstabbing Sollux by choosing Dave instead.

Is Karkat in love with him though?
I don't remember which troll said it, but I remember them just saying that Karkat wouldn't stop talking about Dave. That doesn't necessarily mean love. From Karkat's point of view he just met an entire race of aliens who share his weird blood color (he might not know about their blood yet though) and who aren't constantly under the threat of culling for being subpar in some way, and Dave is the cooler of the two he met.

It was Terezi as a way to stop her from being coupled with him.

[wordsmith101]

Not to mention Terezi doesn't seem to care about this, which is lousy writing.

[HeeCawRoo]

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Not to mention Terezi doesn't seem to care about this, which is lousy writing.

why is *that* lousy writing? terezi doesnt like karkat at this point. their "thing" started during sgrub.

[wordsmith101]

Pretty sure they were flirting before that.

[leah]

idk if this sounds crazy but what if we're playing with the alpha timeline before the main invasion of the Condesce. All this work to build the alpha timeline. Connecting the right people together

[HeeCawRoo]

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Pretty sure they were flirting before that.

their only interactions shown before sgrub started were them arguing about sgrub and then starting the game. theres no indication that they were interested in each other until later.

[wordsmith101]

Still, dismissing their interactions like that is lousy writing. If you have to make the interactions of two characters never happen to make your ship happen, your ship is flimsy.

It can't be the alpha timeline, because SGrub and SBurb were prevented from happening, which by definition would prevent Lord English's creation, which is the definition of the alpha timeline.

[Everybody do the flop]

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Still, dismissing their interactions like that is lousy writing. If you have to make the interactions of two characters never happen to make your ship happen, your ship is flimsy.

It can't be the alpha timeline, because SGrub and SBurb were prevented from happening, which by definition would prevent Lord English's creation, which is the definition of the alpha timeline.

Yeah, IMO, Vriska Stans shouldn't write anything because they ruin everything they touch.

[HeeCawRoo]

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Still, dismissing their interactions like that is lousy writing. If you have to make the interactions of two characters never happen to make your ship happen, your ship is flimsy.

i mean, if davekat hadnt actually happened in canon and this was the way it went, yeah, thatd be dumb. except thats not the case. karkat and terezis relationship failed way before davekat started. terezi doesnt care about karkat here just because, canonically, at this point in time she just didnt.

i think terezis route sucks but theres nothing wrong with that part.

[Everybody do the flop]

Originally posted by HeeCawRoo:

Originally posted by wordsmith101:

Still, dismissing their interactions like that is lousy writing. If you have to make the interactions of two characters never happen to make your ship happen, your ship is flimsy.

i mean, if davekat hadnt actually happened in canon and this was the way it went, yeah, thatd be dumb. except thats not the case. karkat and terezis relationship failed way before davekat started. terezi doesnt care about karkat here just because, canonically, at this point in time she just didnt.

i think terezis route sucks but theres nothing wrong with that part.

Terezi is meant to care about Karkat at this point because Vriska got Karkat to help Terezi out when she first became blind.