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It's weird because I launch the game through the bepin sh. I don't remind have changed anything. Ha well, I'll look that later, no hurry.
We tested it in the current HK version for both Mac and Windows, and we had no problems.
It's missing of errors log to get any information, I didn't insist much. If you give me how get debug/error logs for the bepinex, eventually I could give a check.
I tried with Big Sur where it's been a little different as launch at command line generates a Steam error, but not through Steam, so ok.
I realized why I hadn't the security problem with the lyb, my setup on that was lowered and I forgot restore the setup, it's annoying that it changed and I'm still using High Sierra which hadn't a so detailed setup for security (SIP).
So ok old mod version there's the bug, new mod version there isn't the bug, so thank you.
I'm going to try the Persona mod, gave it a quick check on Windows, perhaps in doc you should quote the right location for the persona folder for Mac.
During Neolithic, when I save, the game says I'll override a save, despite there's none yet for the turn (default names). Checking files doesn't explain the message, I had never seen it before. At entrance in first era the problem disappeared.
Otherwise it seems fine for now, still in first era.
I can't say much by comparison yet because I tried a new setup (many big lakes and 60% land) that generated a very special start with a large horizontal continent just for me. It's a bit weird because with 8 players, 4 continents with New world there should have been at 3/2/2. For a more general feedback on Teams, I'll need a less special start, with such start I had I lack of comparison points. It's like playing New World since first era.
This start isn't helping because I would benefit of neighbors for trades, but also wars and possibly captures. If I had knew I would have packed a different first culture. But it's first time I pick Nubians, usually wait one turn too much or just can't pick it.
One AI exited Neolithic at turn 50 (600 turn pace), never seen that, but I can's say the cause are the mods or AIs I defined. Teams hide a bit fame states through average, but it's clear one AI is in serious troubles, stars still show the problem.
I confirm the bizarre bug with save during Neolithic because in current play I had something I never seen and wanted check if without bepinex I would have it. I launch the game without bepinex so no mod. So I took the opportunity to check the save bug during Neolithic, and confirm that without bepinex/both mods I don't have it.
For the case that made me do this test, and finally seems not related to bepinex:
When you bride independents, their assimilation price is increased, when patronage reaches 100 or when the bride finishes the assimilation price comes back to normal. For example I have an indies town with patronage 100, and the assimilation price (no proximity) is 800.
But of one indies, right the one I wanted assimilate lol, I hurry up briding with one gold bride and one influence bride and even benefited of an extra from direct influence. But when the patronage reaches 100 the normal assimilation price (no proximity) wasn't restored and stayed at 2260.
Except that I have a save right before patronage reaches 100, could launch the game without bepinex, finish turn and quote the exact same problem.
Very weird, I don't remind have ever seen such not rounded assimilation price when there's no bride running. That said, if I can do sometimes the double bride, gold and influence, I could never have done it with also direct influence free bride activated (it adds a free +3 per turn), could be the cause of the bug.
EDIT:
No bug for assimilation price, the normal price is restored after one turn past reaching max patronage, I never quoted before because I never been in such a hurry to assimilate a town. :-)
Interesting - never hit that one before.
1. Bugs (all very minor)
- During Neolithic save generates a warning this will override a save file but there's none. I start all my play with an empty Save Files folder and I checked carefully. After Neolithic the bug disappear.
- Once, two AI in a teams broke the alliance and didn't restored it right in same turn, but turn after. Other time I quoted it the alliance was restored in same turn (clearly by the mod). If that turn the AIs had started a war I wonder if the mod would have manage.
- At end during hall of fame, the hall of fame is by player, not by team.
2. Appreciation in Single Player
Surprisingly interesting, it adds a new layout, the teams, that changes the game.
3. Possibles influences on AIs
I don't think this have much side effects but because the teams create constant alliance you'll see more often cases showing alliance playing a role like AIs of an alliance attacking the same enemy.
One almost clear side effect is alliances make AIs more confident so they evaluate their position as better because of the alliance. I don't think it's hazard that it's first time I quoted AIs with Protector state.
One bizarre difference is there's been many vassalage, I don't see the link with alliances, but it makes harder to follow and decipher the diplomacy. First alliances (out of teams) occurred sooner that usual, but proved be hard to keep, in first two eras I had troubles to have significant trades, nit sure it's from the mod.
I can't say yet if overall it makes the AIs perform better, I hadn't read the mod details before to start and resulted in a setup a bit weird that' clearly influence a lot my play:
- One continent just for me, even if the smaller, still 30 territories.
- Second continent middle size so a bit bigger with a team of 2 AIs.
- Third continent, the bigger but not that big either, a bit overcrowded with a Team of 2 AIs and a Team of 3 AIs.
If I had read well the mod detail it wouldn't have happen. But I think it would be cool if the mod had some options around the spreading, for example:
- Like currently, so a team on only one continent.
- Another with no team on one continent if that's possible.
- Another with a random spreading.
Anyway, AOM, thanks, quite good job and idea. :-)
We'll look into the other issues you've raised. In particular, adding placement options to the mod so it's more useful beyond its original goal of facilitating team play between human partners. Further, the situation you described, where you were alone on a continent and two teams were sharing one isn't really what we were aiming for. We'll take a look why that happened and see if we can make it work better.
I'm really glad to hear the mod worked well for you (in spite of minor issues that we can look into) and that you enjoy using it.
Still it's a play running, for now feels more like an artificial penalty on fame, but well, just turn 100/600, a lot to go.
I wonder if the mod manage well the hall of fame, see the bug I quoted about it. I could not win on fame because of team and average, but could win anyway on hall of fame.
In fact last game version already improved this obsolete units aspect for eras 1 to 3 and partially the 4th.
But this play couldn't let me quote this aspect, one continent for me, New World landed by AI at turn 120/600 and me at 130/600 (for both, AI and me, it was through islands). It generated a lot of trouble, but past them and some wars it led to ultra domination. Started Industrial with French (so access of whole research tree) at turn 310/600. It was more watch AIs plays, so at turn 500+ I decided rush mars conquest as I was going to have all tech and it wasn't an end condition.
So I can't say for obsolete units.
About the bugs:
- In this new play I couldn't reproduce the bug: "During Neolithic save generates a warning this will override a save file". Very minor one, haven't tried find the difference, either the play/save, either the game version that changed since I played this pre era in previous play. I would suggest ignore this one.
- For and placements, sure a seriously hard start would have been the team of 3 and me on the biggest continent, 2 team on the second, and 1 team of the third, the continent where I started alone. Or even harder, team of 3 and me on the second continent. It's not easy setup something on a base of playing alone, or perhaps try one big continent or jump in teams of 3 like huge and 3 teams of 3 plus player alone, or also have some AI not in a team.
About that, the mod seems limit teams size to 3 max is this really necessary?
For playing with team not just against teams as I did in first play, I think the mod would need at least one option if not the default:
- Teams not only have forced alliance but also have forced treaties for influence and science. It's a pointless penalty for AI teams against humans teams, and when teaming with an AI it's ultra annoying, right now I have 3 extra alliances and for all I have both treaties when with my team AI I never ever achieved make any, very annoying because there's no logic inside a forced alliance.
And, even if I understand all the point is one fame score for the team, I think for SP but also eventually coop, keep fame score independents would be a great option.
Then some comment on the play:
- Once more, and even more, it's a total garbage of alliances, cross alliances, vassals, this extra layout adds a good fun, even if it's hard to follow sometimes. :-) Im' even in war with an AI, and allied with its Teamate AI. And i'll skip details of the complexity from teams, crossed alliances and vassals.
- One AI is ultra active and quite performant, never seen that. And for sure it's probably not units upgraded but up to date stacks, significant amounts (but cities pop size seem pay a heavy price), and an ultra active AI making the show. It moves fast in eras but still not to fast and collected many fame knowing its team. So it is now in 5th era already but still not 300/600 turns reach. I lag a bit deliberately for fame thanks to an incompetent teamate. That said the second world war started (all nations involved lol) and if I'll lost armies this will probably finish weaken too much the AI. It gets through first world war quite well even if I won it after a garbage of successive wars.
I can't say what's the cause and why this AI. It was my exported persona but just for experiment, traits look pointless because of elements not well managed by AI, for the quote:
- Archetypes: Militarist, Adaptative, Traitorous (make them more human-like lol)
- Strengths: Freerider (+2 power on units hired), Uniter (+20 influence on plaza per independents on patronage)
- Biases: Hired Sword (prefer use hired units), Luxurious.
But AI don't know manage well Independent and even use well hired units, and even if I can't say for first eras as this AI was on another continent, I never seen it use any hired units nor try any patronage, lol.
So what's even weirder is beside for Luxurious, this Ai is like having no strength and no biases.
In comparison my teamate also an experience is very close, and it performs very weakly:
- Archetypes: Militarist, Adaptative, Loyal (alas ransak your own resources seems looked as no loyal, I won't pick it again for an AI teamate)
- Strengths: Freerider (+2 power on units hired), Uniter (+20 influence on plaza per independents on patronage)
- Biases: Hired Sword, Turtle
So very close to the AI performing very well in the play, only differences, Loyal instead of Traitorous, and Turtle instead of Luxurious. I think it's Turtle that penalized it a lot in this play.
Sorry for the pointless details lol, play not finished, but another very good experience. :-)