Industry is broken, all other yields suck.

[Poop King]

I've done a thing on a few maps now where I save before taking the first culture, and reload to test Harappans vs Egyptians.

Simply put, food and population don't help you develop your cities.

More problematic is the fact that you can turn production into infinite food without ever needing to build a farmers district by completing the 'Feast' project over and over. As long as you build cities on rivers you also get plenty of food from the river upgrades.

Granaries seemingly suck, that is until all infrastructure buildings complete in 1-2 turns. Meanwhile farmers districts and canals will continue getting more expensive to build without having more production to build them faster.

The gold buy cost also increases too sharply - it ends up costing thousands of gold per turn of production, and never mind the option to buyout with population - even if you gain 1 population per turn, buying something with 16 population is 16 turns of growth wasted.

You can also get a lot of food from several of the luxury resources, same as the other resources, but also as with with money and science - you can exclusively get all these resources from other means than building their districts in the early game, and focus on spamming the Emblematic Districts for the builder cultures and then getting as many wonders as you can even for nothing more than the stability bonus (the stability increase is all I care about from most of the wonders).

And the builder perk of 10 stability of building completion lets you forget about stability and just keep spamming buildings to keep stability in check. Combine this with using gold to buy stability from one of the civics and just keep expanding with loads of production.

[SanityBasket]

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Yeah you need pop for armiers.. so you don´t need food... makes sense. Have you completed any games?

https://steamcommunity.com/id/Poopskin/stats/1124300/?tab=achievements

[Poop King]

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Yeah you need pop for armiers.. so you don´t need food... makes sense. Have you completed any games?

Where did I say you 'don't need any food'?

I said very clearly many many times over, and as many other people whol have already done this 'You don't need farmer's districts for food'.

Why don't you try it yourself? Don't build a single food district, build industry only, take Egyptians > Maya > Khmer, then dominate with whole map with a hundred or so units.

Everyone that has already done and tried this are all saying it is broken. So try it and then you will see for yourself.

[SirKnechtalot]

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

https://steamcommunity.com/id/Poopskin/stats/1124300/?tab=achievements

Geezuz- you´ve no life.

[Poop King]

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Yeah you need pop for armiers.. so you don´t need food... makes sense. Have you completed any games?

https://steamcommunity.com/id/Poopskin/stats/1124300/?tab=achievements

I get bored well before the games end and restart to perfect my strategies, so what?

Still likely played the game more than someone that's too scared to make their profile public lol.

[Poop King]

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

https://steamcommunity.com/id/Poopskin/stats/1124300/?tab=achievements

Geezuz- you´ve no life.

'Have you even played this game?'

Someone else shows that I have

'OMG U HABE NO LYFE'.

Typical.

I'm guessing I am perfectly correct when I say that nobody arguing against me even plays this game at all lol.

[SirKnechtalot]

Originally posted by Poopskin:

I get bored well before the games end and restart to perfect my strategies, so what?

Or just found some exploit. I´ll give it a try next time.

[SanityBasket]

Originally posted by Poopskin:

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

https://steamcommunity.com/id/Poopskin/stats/1124300/?tab=achievements

I get bored well before the games end and restart to perfect my strategies, so what?

Still likely played the game more than someone that's too scared to make their profile public lol.

https://steamcommunity.com/profiles/76561198032084902/stats/appid/1124300/achievements

[Poop King]

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Originally posted by Poopskin:

I get bored well before the games end and restart to perfect my strategies, so what?

Or just found some exploit. I´ll give it a try next time.

Sorry if it isn't clear, finding exploits is all I am doing currently.

I found the current biggest exploit and all I am saying is that it needs fixing.

All you lot are saying it that is can't exist because you haven't yet found or used the exploit.

I guess you would only listen if someone like Pewdiepie made a meme video on 'this game is totally not broken', and then shows exactly what I and several other people on the reddit sub for this game are already doing?

Why even bother finishing the game when it is as broken as it currently is?

The first exploit I've been posting about is getting all your research from scouts (Harappan runners are No.1 top exploit).

Second exploit found so far is industry only, and completely trounces the first exploit above since normal scouts can already do the same, just a tiny bit slower.

First fix I've suggested is to make curiosities stop giving research so that players actually have to build research quarters. Second is either nerf industry or buff the other things to its level.

Right now everyone that powergames / min-maxes is either playing Harappan or Egypt in first era. Nothing else compares to how broken these two are for the above reasons.

[SirKnechtalot]

Originally posted by Poopskin:

All you lot are saying it that is can't exist because you haven't yet found or used the exploit.

Geezuz i wasn´t aware of the fact wasting ♥♥♥♥ tons of lifetime on weird game mechanics can make you a living. And no i wasn´t "aware" of some glitch in the game mechanics and pretty much don´t care since i win anyhow. My brainbrawn strategy made me win way ahead of the "AI" until now an max cheat bot is next anyhove so chill.

[SanityBasket]

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Or just found some exploit. I´ll give it a try next time.

To be fair, the OP is thinking in the right direction, even if they are inexperienced enough to say some very silly things.

Production is king if you are the tech leader, and farmers quarters suck. Though don't try to spam feasts, that is just weird. Most people do in fact value food a lot higher then they should because of their experience with Civ. If you only have 20 slots for workers, a city with a population of 30 is wasting a lot of resources. That almost never happens in Civ, but is kind of the default here.

Instead of feasts, expand wide, and spam things like hamlets. They tend to give you all the food you need, and you end up with cities who have massive production and massive population. Particularly if you grab the food wonder, and make a bread basket city.

That said, remember that there is only one win condition in this game, and that is fame. You can spend 2/3rds of the game as a vassal, fail to trigger any ending condition, be behind on all stats, and still outscore every AI 3:1 when it comes to fame, making you the "winner"

And generally the best way to farm fame is with a balanced approach. Staying in eras far longer then most people would be willing to is also very helpful. Humankind isn't about being first across any finish line. It is about getting the most stars.

[AOM]

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

Instead of feasts, expand wide, and spam things like hamlets. They tend to give you all the food you need, and you end up with cities who have massive production and massive population.

Exactly. Hamlets are the way to go. In the right spot, harbors as well.

[Poop King]

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

Originally posted by SirKnechtalot:

Or just found some exploit. I´ll give it a try next time.

To be fair, the OP is thinking in the right direction, even if they are inexperienced enough to say some very silly things.

Production is king if you are the tech leader, and farmers quarters suck. Though don't try to spam feasts, that is just weird. Most people do in fact value food a lot higher then they should because of their experience with Civ. If you only have 20 slots for workers, a city with a population of 30 is wasting a lot of resources. That almost never happens in Civ, but is kind of the default here.

Instead of feasts, expand wide, and spam things like hamlets. They tend to give you all the food you need, and you end up with cities who have massive production and massive population. Particularly if you grab the food wonder, and make a bread basket city.

That said, remember that there is only one win condition in this game, and that is fame. You can spend 2/3rds of the game as a vassal, fail to trigger any ending condition, be behind on all stats, and still outscore every AI 3:1 when it comes to fame, making you the "winner"

And generally the best way to farm fame is with a balanced approach. Staying in eras far longer then most people would be willing to is also very helpful. Humankind isn't about being first across any finish line. It is about getting the most stars.

Ok as for the reason I haven't yet 'finished a game?'

My last game I snowballed from 8 Pyramids in first era to 18 Kuh'nahs (I called them Tikals before - thats the name of the city, I should go back to calling them, and then spent ages thinking of how to do it faster and try to get maybe 30+ Barays next.

I restarted a lot to see if I could push more than 8 ancient era EQs, and the only reason you cant is the influence cost. You need to build 4 for your capital first because while attaching a second territory to all cities only costs 60 influence, it snowballs the cost of all third+ ones.. I then kept restarting to get as many second era ones as I could, and it seems to be 18 before again I am capped by influence.

Yes I have to reload a lot and micromanage where to settle and reload if independent cities block my locations because that would waste turns. I play on huge maps with only 3 AI purely to test just how much I can try to 'break' the game with 'cheese' because that's what I enjoy doing.

[Poop King]

Originally posted by AOM:

Originally posted by SanityBasket:

Instead of feasts, expand wide, and spam things like hamlets. They tend to give you all the food you need, and you end up with cities who have massive production and massive population.

Exactly. Hamlets are the way to go. In the right spot, harbors as well.

You still don't get it, the feast takes 2 turns on endless speed for a permanent +5 food bonus.

I have 1000+ production, theres nothing else left to build and I can spam the food, stability and unit experience projects like mad.

I'm not saying my way is 'better'. I'm saying my way is 'broken'.

Someone actually said 'you can't be developing your cities if you are doing feast'. FFS EVERYTHING ELSE WAS ALREADY BUILT, BY THE TIME ALL MY CITIES HAVE 4 BARAYS EACH, FEAST X100 IS THE ONLY THING I HAVE LEFT TO 'BUILD'.

I don't 'have to' build farmers districts at all because I absolutely can simply spam feast for permanent food gain for no stability loss or wasted tile!

[Matthew]

I find that the game does a pretty good job of rewarding balance. Yes, getting food just to get food doesn't help much. All of the yields get pointless if you go all out.

Stacking nothing but science gets you to the end of an era's tech, then anything more is wasted.

Stacking nothing but gold gives you a high stockpile, but the cost to instant purchase is much higher than production.

Stacking nothing but production empties your queue with nothing else to build, though yes, you can waste some turns doing feasts or whatever.

Yet a balance of all three would allow you to maximize fame.

As for food. Every population gives influence. There are several bonuses in the game which add different bonuses, like science per population. Religion scales off of population. The bonuses are less direct than the other yields, but a high population is better than a low population city.

And yes, there are people who way, way overvalue Harappans.

[Poop King]

Originally posted by Matthew:

And yes, there are people who way, way overvalue Harappans.

I was already doing that until I tried Egypt instead.

Wow is trying to build canals such a waste of turns in the ancient era compared to getting the industry wagon rolling.

If anything you can build farmers districts later, you need industry first to build everything else.