I dont understand the storys logic.

[KONZENTRATION]

You desert the Germany Army but you see Russians executing Germans, why do you fight Germans after you've seen that?

[t.slappy]

Maybe because of this:
Soviets were killing (few - tens, hundreds?) Germans soldiers are lets say "fine": they are soldiers and this is a war.

BUT Germans were murdering innocent civilians (hundreds of thousands! - all that full trains and camps) - and that is too bad.
So both are bad, bud the Nazis are much more worse so it is better to stop that German terror.

(And those who lived in countries occupied by Soviets - e.g. Czechoslovakia / or who studied history know the Soviets started almost the same terror there so YES - in the end it was the same...)

[DootTheBoot]

Both sides were bad. The game shows that if you think "Soviets good, Germans bad" or "Germans good, Soviets bad", you think wrong.

[KONZENTRATION]

Originally posted by t.slappy:

Maybe because of this:
Soviets were killing (few - tens, hundreds?) Germans soldiers are lets say "fine": they are soldiers and this is a war.

BUT Germans were murdering innocent civilians (hundreds of thousands! - all that full trains and camps) - and that is too bad.
So both are bad, bud the Nazis are much more worse so it is better to stop that German terror.

(And those who lived in countries occupied by Soviets - e.g. Czechoslovakia / or who studied history know the Soviets started almost the same terror there so YES - in the end it was the same...)

Soviets also killed civillians but I was talking about soldiers who surrendered, and they executed them. Thats a war crime, no "this is a war."

[Garry]

Originally posted by Steck:

You desert the Germany Army but you see Russians executing Germans, why do you fight Germans after you've seen that?

So you are searchin' logic in WW2? ....okay

[KaleidoScopes]

This is a game from the POLISH perspective. The Polish were tag-team slaughtered by both the Soviets and Germans.

[KONZENTRATION]

Originally posted by ResectoScopes:

This is a game from the POLISH perspective. The Polish were tag-team slaughtered by both the Soviets and Germans.

No they are Germans.

[Vicitus]

Originally posted by noi siam Fascisti repubblican:

Originally posted by ResectoScopes:

This is a game from the POLISH perspective. The Polish were tag-team slaughtered by both the Soviets and Germans.

No they are Germans.

The Developers are Polish. When you don´t get the "story" of the game, you just should do some Historical research. Then you might get it.

[KONZENTRATION]

Originally posted by Vicitus:

Originally posted by noi siam Fascisti repubblican:

No they are Germans.

The Developers are Polish. When you don´t get the "story" of the game, you just should do some Historical research. Then you might get it.

You play Germans, see your comrades get massacred by a firing squad. Instead of fighting the communists they suddenly run and fight Germans. I don't understand that. In this case you are the one who needs some "Historical research".

[Xavi-Da-Imp]

I mean, they could make the second mission when we encountere german soldiers be a stealth mission. Or at least to the point when we discover WTH they were doing there, which was rather nasty.

Yeah, they were deserters and stuff and would get a bullet in the back of the head for it, but at start they would at least stay away and not go gun-hoe against their former budies. Well maybe for the main guy, becouse the big guy didnt realy give a crap, was realy hungry and ready to crack some skulls for some tastey sauerkraut or sumfin'.

Also wasnt them getting civilian cloths in the first mission the point for not getting a bullet in the skull from the old chaps from Wehrmacht at the first glance to begin with?

[Turtler]

Originally posted by ICHHASSEKOMMUNISTEN:

You desert the Germany Army but you see Russians executing Germans, why do you fight Germans after you've seen that?

You're still known as deserters from a Punishment Unit at a time when the Third Reich is making a point of executing just about anybody even ACCUSED of deserting or retreating without authorization.

It's a matter of self-preservation.

Also those people aren't really your "Comrades" any more, with most of your unit getting wiped out in the first mission by the Soviet attack and ensuing executions (and the one you do deal with in that mission is an officer holding you at gunpoint and ordering you to go back to certain death). Most of the Germans you fight from other units, who-again- either SUSPECT you're local partisans harassing their lines, or KNOW you're deserters from a Punishment Unit and thus presumably are traitors to the Vaterland worthy of only getting killed.

Talks of mass murder, killing POWs, and the like is nice but it's ultimately to the side. Simple self-preservation means you can't trust EITHER side to not murder you ASAP on first glance.

[Turtler]

Originally posted by Xavi-Da-Imp:

I mean, they could make the second mission when we encountere german soldiers be a stealth mission. Or at least to the point when we discover WTH they were doing there, which was rather nasty.

Yeah, they were deserters and stuff and would get a bullet in the back of the head for it, but at start they would at least stay away and not go gun-hoe against their former budies. Well maybe for the main guy, becouse the big guy didnt realy give a crap, was realy hungry and ready to crack some skulls for some tastey sauerkraut or sumfin'.

I don't have the game myself, but the first mission you play fighting Germans as the main enemy (in contrast to the initial mission, where your enemies are mostly Soviets after you kill the officer demanding you get back into the firing line to die like a good Aryan), you're facing SS Einsatzgruppen (not Wehrmacht). Who the protagonists had little love for even BEFORE they got punted into a punishment unit- hence the protag's disgust at the mass murder of civilians in the trailer- and who most German soldiers (even those loyal to the regime) viewed as crude, murderous thugs taking up resources and supplies from the soldiers.

So it's not like first combat with a sizable German force has you breaking the necks or gunning down the drinking buddies from Army Barracks.

Originally posted by Xavi-Da-Imp:

Also wasnt them getting civilian cloths in the first mission the point for not getting a bullet in the skull from the old chaps from Wehrmacht at the first glance to begin with?

I don't know, but I do know that neither side treated civilians well to start with, and in the second mission they get summarily shot if spotted because they're near a major killing center that is supposed to be kept secret on pain of death. So the SS mow down any witnesses they don't control.

[DeLastOne]

Plague or Cholera... sometime there is no right or wrong choice... just one to make

[Verranicus]

Originally posted by ICHHASSEKOMMUNISTEN:

Originally posted by Vicitus:

The Developers are Polish. When you don´t get the "story" of the game, you just should do some Historical research. Then you might get it.

You play Germans, see your comrades get massacred by a firing squad. Instead of fighting the communists they suddenly run and fight Germans. I don't understand that. In this case you are the one who needs some "Historical research".

Only have to ask how many J-s were somehow involved with financing or designing this game and you get your answer. This is just woke garbage masquerading as a war story.

Am a combat vet. Served in a foreign legion. Would not just desert and watch my ex-comrades get slaughtered after surrendering, even if I was deserting. There's no logic here, it's just leftist kvetching and historical deconstructionism.

[Turtler]

Originally posted by Verranicus:

Only have to ask how many J-s were somehow involved with financing or designing this game and you get your answer. This is just woke garbage masquerading as a war story.

Translation: someone hasn't studied the number of defectors and deserters from the Wehrmacht in WWII.

Originally posted by Verranicus:

Am a combat vet. Served in a foreign legion. Would not just desert and watch my ex-comrades get slaughtered after surrendering, even if I was deserting.

Fair, but you're also not the character in question. And you're also seriously outnumbered.

Originally posted by Verranicus:

There's no logic here, it's just leftist kvetching and historical deconstructionism.

You mean besides being outnumbered, outgunned, lacking any real armament (unless you took the pistol from the officer you kill earlier), and surrounded by the enemy where stealth is your only option?

One does not need to agree with the choice in order to recognize the logic.

[KONZENTRATION]

Originally posted by Turtler:

Originally posted by Verranicus:

Only have to ask how many J-s were somehow involved with financing or designing this game and you get your answer. This is just woke garbage masquerading as a war story.

Translation: someone hasn't studied the number of defectors and deserters from the Wehrmacht in WWII.

Originally posted by Verranicus:

Am a combat vet. Served in a foreign legion. Would not just desert and watch my ex-comrades get slaughtered after surrendering, even if I was deserting.

Fair, but you're also not the character in question. And you're also seriously outnumbered.

Originally posted by Verranicus:

There's no logic here, it's just leftist kvetching and historical deconstructionism.

You mean besides being outnumbered, outgunned, lacking any real armament (unless you took the pistol from the officer you kill earlier), and surrounded by the enemy where stealth is your only option?

One does not need to agree with the choice in order to recognize the logic.

But why is he fighting his own guys after getting destroyed by the enemy?