Feedback and thoughts for the future direction of the game

[LordErec42]

So after playing the demo, the prologue and finally this early access release I have a bunch of thoughts on how this game could be improved by building on the fairly solid foundation we have already.

Lets start with the shop and tools. The shop layout is Bad. It's way too big with random stuff in random corners for no good reason so a lot of time is wasted running around. The gun assembly/disassembly workbench should be combined with the cleaning bench and accessory bench instead of having accessories be in another room for no reason. All the workstations should be moved into the main room without the silly side rooms. Ideally it would be awesome if the player could buy space and freely arrange the workbenches and machines within it. For example, they start with literally a garage with just the basic combined workbench and the car right there and later can buy larger workspaces with room for a full machine shop to make guns from raw materials. Also the whole mechanic with sandblasting/blueing parts doesn't make sense for most of the guns. Blueing is only really applicable to historic firearms, modern guns use lots of stainless steel parts or nitride/DLC coatings that don't need that. This also applies to oiling, EVERYTHING needs to be oiled currently whether or not it makes sense IRL (magazines DO NOT get oiled IRL as the oil can seep into the ammo and ruin the powder).

Now let's talk crafting. This is also Bad as currently implemented. Unless the current project needs a part, there's no way to saw "hey I want to craft this now" which has resulted in some annoying bugs where the game doesn't think a project needs a part from the lathe/CNC when it actually does but then it blocks you from crafting it. First off, I want to see more machines. Taking the history of Glock for example, Gaston Glock had a machine shop and plastic injection molding machine in his basement when he was developing the Glock 17. Some additional machines I want to see are 3D printers (polymer and later metal), auto looms and autoclaves for carbon fiber, equipment for electroplating and modern coatings like nitride and DLC, and injection molding machines. Additionally, I would like to see a lot more materials available like we have IRL, so when changing up a gun we could custom craft stainless steel/titanium/tungsten/etc parts, and have a couple different types of plastic. These materials would have different costs/weights that would affect the weight and balance of the gun. So for progression the player would start with a compact polymer 3D printer or desktop CNC machine that could make small plastic/metal gun parts (like printing a handgun polymer receiver or milling small parts) with upgraded models that could print/mill faster/larger parts or with better materials. Next step would be a larger lathe/CNC/stamping machine that could make any gun part (seriously, why can't we make barrels from scratch on the CNC machine?!?). Final step would be a metal printer/carbon fiber setup for the latest in manufacturing with metal printing saving immensely on material cost vs machining and carbon fiber being a top tier polymer replacement for lightweight components. Also allow us to fully fabricate any part with the appropriate machine, not just a small subset. I want one endgame option to be the player having a firearm manufacturing license and building custom firearms from scratch for customers (or themselves). Even better would be some limited ability to (within reason) make fully custom parts like custom barrel lengths and fine tune triggers like is so popular IRL.

The economy also needs to be revisited. Right now there's no reason at all to craft anything since it's so time consuming. To better balance crafting vs ordering, online orders should NOT be delivered instantly (maybe there can be a perk to allow the player to rush orders for a price to reduce this to nearly zero). This would incentivitize players to stock up on commonly used parts and to specialize in working on certain guns. Crafting right now is super tedious, initially this is fine because it is IRL but endgame we should be able to hire employees to craft things for us. Just tell them what we need and they'll make it based on their skill level. Change the payouts for the jobs to better balance everything, I'm getting a ton of Colt 1911 contracts that pay $400 for a super easy rail/barrel swap but much more complex repair jobs on guns I'm not as proficient with pay way less.

Another part of the game that needs a lot of work is how we obtain guns. The auctions are pretty bad honestly. Sure, it's fine to have them as an option, but it should not be the only way. To keep things somewhat realistic (at least for the US), to start the player would need to drive to a local gun shop in the early game to pick up any online orders (and pay a fee) and could also browse their inventory to buy new and used guns direct from the shop. Maybe have a couple gun/pawn shops in the area (have a map similar to car mechanic simulator). Also have estate sales (similar to barn finds in CMS) where the player can potentially find rare, historic firearms. Later in the game the player can obtain their FFL license and buy guns direct without needing to use a local gun shop.

Related, have a couple different places to practice shooting. At the start the player can either visit the local pistol/rifle range in town or drive out of town to a quarry. Some ranges would have a fee to use them. Endgame the player could set up and customize their own range in their workspace (or adjacent to it outside a door) to quickly test guns without having to go elsewhere. Have a lot more variety of targets to shoot at the quarry or custom range like water bottles/ballistic gel blocks and dummies/paint cans/etc. Have some shooting competitions as well (including 2, 3, 4 gun) where the player can earn cash, this could also tie into the endgame crafting where the player is fine tuning their firearms for the challenge.

Also maybe consider doing some work on force feedback for shooting since a large number of players have game controllers with analog triggers. It would be really neat to have the trigger feel simulated with the haptic feedback, like vibration indicating trigger wall/reset.

I would also like to see multiple ammo types and magazines. Have a variety of different loadings/bullet types for each caliber with different performance characteristics and cost. Like FMJ, hollowpoint, fluted, hard cast, etc. This could also open up new gameplay with ammo loading and fine tuning custom loads for competition/hunting.

Speaking of hunting, that would be an amazing DLC expansion. House flipper added farming, so it's entirely possible to sidestep into a related genre that adds to the core gameplay as well.

Somewhat lower priority, but it would be kind of neat to customize our character and dress them up with holsters and other tactical gear for going out and shooting (and decking them out with WAY too many guns until they can barely move).

[fumblaer]

Hello.

Bug report
Upon disassembly of a gun I could not find a part were it should be. After leaving the game and starting it again the part could be found were it was supposed to be. Mossberg M21

I also would like to make some suggestions to give the game some more depth.

Materials.
I think we should sue up the cleaning agents and chemicals and the gun oil.
After a number of (X) parts have been cleaned or oiled players should have to buy new gun oil and cleaning agents.
Players should be able to stock up on these and they appear on the shelfs.

Ammo
Instead of having an unlimited supply of ammo we should have to buy and store ammo for the guns to test them on the range.
The ammo could appear on shelves.

Woodwork
Players can buy different types of wood to make stocks and handguards, etc.

XP Buffs and advantages.
Buying books and magazines could give the players additional XP or make work easier/ give access to better jobs, like repairing high end/ very expensive guns like those from tuning shops like LesBaers or gun manufacturers like Holland & Holland.

Also maybe some posters, calendars and shop shields to give the shop a face lift and allow players some customization.

All the above materials could appear on the shelfs to give the workshop some more live and individuality.
Also these additional ways to spend money could invest the players more and give them the chance to individualize and customize their shops.

With new guns in later editions there could be the requirement to buy specializes tools.

Paint
Besides having the game crash several times during painting, the patterns are ugly on most guns. There should be more options beside camo patterns.
Here are some ideas.
Spray paint the gun with a paint can tool instead of using a pattern.
Gold coating guns.
Nitrating guns (Gives a golden looking surface and increases lifetime of materials.)
Ivory or mother of pearl grips.
Custom paint jobs like on these guns

[lenox100]

Originally posted by LordErec42:

So after playing the demo, the prologue and finally this early access release I have a bunch of thoughts on how this game could be improved by building on the fairly solid foundation we have already.

Lets start with the shop and tools. The shop layout is Bad. It's way too big with random stuff in random corners for no good reason so a lot of time is wasted running around. The gun assembly/disassembly workbench should be combined with the cleaning bench and accessory bench instead of having accessories be in another room for no reason. All the workstations should be moved into the main room without the silly side rooms. Ideally it would be awesome if the player could buy space and freely arrange the workbenches and machines within it. For example, they start with literally a garage with just the basic combined workbench and the car right there and later can buy larger workspaces with room for a full machine shop to make guns from raw materials. Also the whole mechanic with sandblasting/blueing parts doesn't make sense for most of the guns. Blueing is only really applicable to historic firearms, modern guns use lots of stainless steel parts or nitride/DLC coatings that don't need that. This also applies to oiling, EVERYTHING needs to be oiled currently whether or not it makes sense IRL (magazines DO NOT get oiled IRL as the oil can seep into the ammo and ruin the powder).

Now let's talk crafting. This is also Bad as currently implemented. Unless the current project needs a part, there's no way to saw "hey I want to craft this now" which has resulted in some annoying bugs where the game doesn't think a project needs a part from the lathe/CNC when it actually does but then it blocks you from crafting it. First off, I want to see more machines. Taking the history of Glock for example, Gaston Glock had a machine shop and plastic injection molding machine in his basement when he was developing the Glock 17. Some additional machines I want to see are 3D printers (polymer and later metal), auto looms and autoclaves for carbon fiber, equipment for electroplating and modern coatings like nitride and DLC, and injection molding machines. Additionally, I would like to see a lot more materials available like we have IRL, so when changing up a gun we could custom craft stainless steel/titanium/tungsten/etc parts, and have a couple different types of plastic. These materials would have different costs/weights that would affect the weight and balance of the gun. So for progression the player would start with a compact polymer 3D printer or desktop CNC machine that could make small plastic/metal gun parts (like printing a handgun polymer receiver or milling small parts) with upgraded models that could print/mill faster/larger parts or with better materials. Next step would be a larger lathe/CNC/stamping machine that could make any gun part (seriously, why can't we make barrels from scratch on the CNC machine?!?). Final step would be a metal printer/carbon fiber setup for the latest in manufacturing with metal printing saving immensely on material cost vs machining and carbon fiber being a top tier polymer replacement for lightweight components. Also allow us to fully fabricate any part with the appropriate machine, not just a small subset. I want one endgame option to be the player having a firearm manufacturing license and building custom firearms from scratch for customers (or themselves). Even better would be some limited ability to (within reason) make fully custom parts like custom barrel lengths and fine tune triggers like is so popular IRL.

The economy also needs to be revisited. Right now there's no reason at all to craft anything since it's so time consuming. To better balance crafting vs ordering, online orders should NOT be delivered instantly (maybe there can be a perk to allow the player to rush orders for a price to reduce this to nearly zero). This would incentivitize players to stock up on commonly used parts and to specialize in working on certain guns. Crafting right now is super tedious, initially this is fine because it is IRL but endgame we should be able to hire employees to craft things for us. Just tell them what we need and they'll make it based on their skill level. Change the payouts for the jobs to better balance everything, I'm getting a ton of Colt 1911 contracts that pay $400 for a super easy rail/barrel swap but much more complex repair jobs on guns I'm not as proficient with pay way less.

Another part of the game that needs a lot of work is how we obtain guns. The auctions are pretty bad honestly. Sure, it's fine to have them as an option, but it should not be the only way. To keep things somewhat realistic (at least for the US), to start the player would need to drive to a local gun shop in the early game to pick up any online orders (and pay a fee) and could also browse their inventory to buy new and used guns direct from the shop. Maybe have a couple gun/pawn shops in the area (have a map similar to car mechanic simulator). Also have estate sales (similar to barn finds in CMS) where the player can potentially find rare, historic firearms. Later in the game the player can obtain their FFL license and buy guns direct without needing to use a local gun shop.

Related, have a couple different places to practice shooting. At the start the player can either visit the local pistol/rifle range in town or drive out of town to a quarry. Some ranges would have a fee to use them. Endgame the player could set up and customize their own range in their workspace (or adjacent to it outside a door) to quickly test guns without having to go elsewhere. Have a lot more variety of targets to shoot at the quarry or custom range like water bottles/ballistic gel blocks and dummies/paint cans/etc. Have some shooting competitions as well (including 2, 3, 4 gun) where the player can earn cash, this could also tie into the endgame crafting where the player is fine tuning their firearms for the challenge.

Also maybe consider doing some work on force feedback for shooting since a large number of players have game controllers with analog triggers. It would be really neat to have the trigger feel simulated with the haptic feedback, like vibration indicating trigger wall/reset.

I would also like to see multiple ammo types and magazines. Have a variety of different loadings/bullet types for each caliber with different performance characteristics and cost. Like FMJ, hollowpoint, fluted, hard cast, etc. This could also open up new gameplay with ammo loading and fine tuning custom loads for competition/hunting.

Speaking of hunting, that would be an amazing DLC expansion. House flipper added farming, so it's entirely possible to sidestep into a related genre that adds to the core gameplay as well.

Somewhat lower priority, but it would be kind of neat to customize our character and dress them up with holsters and other tactical gear for going out and shooting (and decking them out with WAY too many guns until they can barely move).

+1