Thur Warmongers need a massive nerf.

[DaLagga]

Outside of maybe bringing along a few healers/buffers, they're so OP they completely invalidate every other unit in the game. Tanks, ranged DPS and other melee units all just get annihilated within seconds by them. Their Peerless Crescent ability in particular is arguable the best AoE in the game where they deal massive damage to everything in a forward arc. Once you have a few groups of them they hit a critical mass whereby their AoE completely wipes the entire enemy's front line instantly, at which point any battle is effectively over.

And as if that weren't enough they also have heavy armor, decent HP and the ability to heal so they are surprisingly tanky in their own right. Outside of the "cheaty" units like dragons which are disabled by default, Thur Warmongers really have no equal. If you want to steamroll this game, just build a party that consists of like 70%+ Warmongers and you instantly win any battle, even if you're outnumbered 4 to 1 like I was earlier. Devs, please nerf!

[DaLagga]

Oprindeligt skrevet af Byakko:

Dude, honestly u are exagerating, i have no fear of any sort of warmongers, and true, is not a hard core strategy game, but the separation its enough to prepare for the collision, savage giants are a crazy unit but terribly weak to mages, a 1st line of infantry and a 3rd line of mages and thats done, same with the warmongers, units can hold ground boy, not like mount and blade or total war, but u can prepare, try it, besides ur character its also a great deal with certain units, sultan can leave a pty of warmogers useless, boomerang and tower, ur vanguard does the rest, besides who on earth only carries one kind of unit in an army? Dhibs also have great units, Akhals cavalry its the best, Thur Warmongers, thats called balance bro, i really think u are overreacting, they good yeah, no doubt about it, but broken??? no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ way bro, besides strategy is not only about positioning,skills, units, combos, sinergies, stun a war pty of warmongers, then send the half of cabalry and pair that with 1/4 of mages and 1/4 of nasir lancers, they are gone daddy-o but if you face farmers with warmonguers, well, thats just plain dumb, if there is something we need its more quests, more size for the nameless valley, more factions, MORE map, markers, prolly more fantasy units for those who like them, i mean, if u see them op dont use them, beat the game with other formations, im a cavalry player for example and i back them up with Dakn mages and a nice vanguard of savage giants, only have 3 squads, no luck getting those, i personally dont use warmongers but i fought them, never lost a fight against them.

When all I have to do is spam 1 unit and steamroll everything else the game could ever throw at me, yeah, that's the definition of broken. If this game were PvP you'd be the first one crying about them being OP because it's all anyone would use and they'd roll over your army every time.

[DaLagga]

Oprindeligt skrevet af persocom01:

the best human units are supposed to stand up to their ifrit counterparts, which I think thur warmongers does. Nerfing them would ruin the human-ifirt balance. If any changes need to be made, I think the dakn have the weakest units because their infantry isn't good at being frontline, and their mage, while controlling enemy units sounds like a powerful ability, the enemy's most powerful units are often disable resistant by default.

That seems to be more of an argument that both Ifrit and Warmongers need a nerf. Obviously other units have balance issues as well, but Warmongers just stand out to be as being particularly egregious.

[DaLagga]

Oprindeligt skrevet af persocom01:

I did some testing, and irit high wizards basically fry an equal number of thur warmongers in like 30 seconds tops. This is where you find that cavalry and the tanker infantry shines, because on testing they take the brunt of the damage when they charge, leaving the warmongers free to do their work. (and actually win)

I don't think the warmongers are imbalanced on their own, but rather, a lot of the other human units are pretty weak. The dhib archers, while they do a good job summoning distractions, were very poor dps, and pretty much none of the other human mages command the sort of AoE carnage that ifirt high wizards do. Archers tended to live longer than melee units, due to the fact they avoided most of the brunt of fan of flames most of the time, but their dps is just too poor to do much.

in the end, the winning combination (by winning, they only win like 10-20% of the time) was cavalry + tanks + warmongers, which was an all melee team. Perhaps a few ranged units would be good additions for their support abilities, but that's it.

Well, I've found most of the units to be pretty bad, to be honest. Warmongers are far and away the best, then there's 3 or 4 other units that are pretty good, and everything else is basically just trash. Archers in particular are almost completely useless. So the game does need a lot of balancing. As for Ifrit armies, not sure how you tested them exactly seeing as how you can't select them for a Custom Battle.

[persocom01]

Oprindeligt skrevet af DaLagga:

Oprindeligt skrevet af persocom01:

I did some testing, and irit high wizards basically fry an equal number of thur warmongers in like 30 seconds tops. This is where you find that cavalry and the tanker infantry shines, because on testing they take the brunt of the damage when they charge, leaving the warmongers free to do their work. (and actually win)

I don't think the warmongers are imbalanced on their own, but rather, a lot of the other human units are pretty weak. The dhib archers, while they do a good job summoning distractions, were very poor dps, and pretty much none of the other human mages command the sort of AoE carnage that ifirt high wizards do. Archers tended to live longer than melee units, due to the fact they avoided most of the brunt of fan of flames most of the time, but their dps is just too poor to do much.

in the end, the winning combination (by winning, they only win like 10-20% of the time) was cavalry + tanks + warmongers, which was an all melee team. Perhaps a few ranged units would be good additions for their support abilities, but that's it.

Well, I've found most of the units to be pretty bad, to be honest. Warmongers are far and away the best, then there's 3 or 4 other units that are pretty good, and everything else is basically just trash. Archers in particular are almost completely useless. So the game does need a lot of balancing. As for Ifrit armies, not sure how you tested them exactly seeing as how you can't select them for a Custom Battle.

you can only test units you've personally had in your army before. I've tested the ifirt units, and they're better than anything humans have by far. Have you seen their cavalry? 10k hp each. But you don't even need to use their most advanced unit to kill thur warmongers, because their mages, which you'll encounter everywhere in the ifirt realm, are enough to send them packing.

[El_Firulais]

Oprindeligt skrevet af DaLagga:

Oprindeligt skrevet af Byakko:

Dude, honestly u are exagerating, i have no fear of any sort of warmongers, and true, is not a hard core strategy game, but the separation its enough to prepare for the collision, savage giants are a crazy unit but terribly weak to mages, a 1st line of infantry and a 3rd line of mages and thats done, same with the warmongers, units can hold ground boy, not like mount and blade or total war, but u can prepare, try it, besides ur character its also a great deal with certain units, sultan can leave a pty of warmogers useless, boomerang and tower, ur vanguard does the rest, besides who on earth only carries one kind of unit in an army? Dhibs also have great units, Akhals cavalry its the best, Thur Warmongers, thats called balance bro, i really think u are overreacting, they good yeah, no doubt about it, but broken??? no ♥♥♥♥♥♥♥ way bro, besides strategy is not only about positioning,skills, units, combos, sinergies, stun a war pty of warmongers, then send the half of cabalry and pair that with 1/4 of mages and 1/4 of nasir lancers, they are gone daddy-o but if you face farmers with warmonguers, well, thats just plain dumb, if there is something we need its more quests, more size for the nameless valley, more factions, MORE map, markers, prolly more fantasy units for those who like them, i mean, if u see them op dont use them, beat the game with other formations, im a cavalry player for example and i back them up with Dakn mages and a nice vanguard of savage giants, only have 3 squads, no luck getting those, i personally dont use warmongers but i fought them, never lost a fight against them.

When all I have to do is spam 1 unit and steamroll everything else the game could ever throw at me, yeah, that's the definition of broken. If this game were PvP you'd be the first one crying about them being OP because it's all anyone would use and they'd roll over your army every time.

Spam one unit, thats the definition of noob son, and no, i never whine about pvp games and nerfing units, building, skills or w/e thats for kids, as far as i know you are the only crybaby about the warmongers, and just coz a kid like you thinks that warmongers are op doesnt mean they are, whats gonna be next? cry about fantasy units? cry about the sultan? cry about the ifrits being op? as a matter of fact i have seen ppl calling the sultan op and others crying about how hard its to play with the sultan specially the campaing, my point is, there are whinners like you all the time for any stupid reason and they diverge the focus of real important matters and developers always listen to whinners coz, well, they are a pain in the neck, dont you see you are the only one crying about the warmongers? and go ahead, spam that unit againts others, you will find how weak the warmongers are, then you will cry to the devs to boost the warmongers coz they suck, you will be saying that they are weak againts dakn mages and dragons, they will need better something, or any other dumb reason just to keep ur noob neck happy, go and play w/e suits you but u carry no reason at all.

[tolaburke]

There's a thing you're forgetting. Jade costs. Jade is very scarce. Getting even 1 unit of Warmongers is a significant cost. Most of the highest powered human units have this Jade cost.

[Duke Fleed]

I dont understand why people are saying ifrit soldiers need to be on par with human high tier units. They can only be recruited if you capture ifrit towns and require tons of exp and comparable jade to level. Why in the world do they have to be balanced with human troops?

[El_Firulais]

Oprindeligt skrevet af ❄︎♥︎Sammy♥❄:

I dont understand why people are saying ifrit soldiers need to be on par with human high tier units. They can only be recruited if you capture ifrit towns and require tons of exp and comparable jade to level. Why in the world do they have to be balanced with human troops?

They dont have to, but if the developers dont balance them can u imagine the amount of crybabies? Ifrits are op, ifrits are broken, game too hard, nerf the ifrits, bla bla bla bla its called, avoid unnecesary pains and yet you see ppl crying about something really stupid, like nerf the warmongers XD