Do Bards have to drink to use songs?

[Soulsurfer]

I can't seem to find a direct answer to this anywhere. Is it possible for Bards to use their class skills like songs without drinking booze, or is it literally impossible? I understand that there are finite resources in this game and I need to know if one class can cast infinite spells while another must use a finite reagent for each casting. I purchased the game and I'm trying to plan the composition of my party. I will never use Bard skills if they require a finite resource because I'll save them for a combat that I just can't survive any other way. This makes it useless to take that character class, or at the very least not fun. So does booze just amp the Bard's skills, or is it requisite? Thank you for your responses.

[Makam]

Since the game is called Bard's Tale I guess you really should have at least one. I finished it with two bards in my team since they specialize at the end and become somewaht different and all I can tell you is I couldn't win that final DLC dungeon boss without them.

Yes they usually need to drink to get "spell points" (even though there are a few other perks that give spell points too but a little later in the game) but don't worry, you almost don't need booze outside fight and you will soon be able to produce your own so it's not a problem.

Plus, their spells sound wild!

[Soulsurfer]

Thanks, I appreciate your input. I can imagine myself being in the final battle and needing to cast that bard song and having no booze left in the game because it's finite... It sounds like it won't be an issue.

[Chilkoot]

OK, first off, you're going to have a terrible time trying to finish the game without a Bard, especially the new content in Haernhold. There are even quests in the game that can not be completed without a Bard.

Some important points related to Bards, Spell Points and general resourcing:

• First off, yes, at least early on in the game, Bards need to drink to gain spell points and stacks of "drunk", which unlocks extra effects for their skills.
  
• To drink in combat and gain spell points, the Bard needs to have a Tankard trinket equipped, and there must be booze in the party inventory. The bread-and-butter alcohol in the game is called Trow Squeezin's, and you'll never, ever run out even in Legendary where you're drinking many times per encounter. Every Bard can craft Trow Squeezin's as a base skill, and the recipe is 1x water + 1x rotted food = 5 bottles. You'll have more than you could ever want, even if you drink every combat round - don't get too tipsy! ;)
  
• Trow Squeezin's and the components to craft/brew 'em are available at every tavern in the game, and are very common drops from crates, barrels, and monsters. There are other, strategic types of booze you can craft and buy with varying effects. There is only one type of booze that is truly "rare" - it is extremely powerful and should be reserved for the toughest fights in the game, just like the most powerful healing and buff potions, which are rare/expensive.
  
• One of the Bard's primary skills is a shield for players that also heals with a few stacks of drunk. This is your primary damage mitigation skill in the game. Without it, you're going go be going through healing consumables (potions and food) like crazy, and you'll soon be short of healing, both in-combat and out-of-combat. Using the Booze consumables and a Bard with shield/healing is very important.
  
• As you advance in the game, there are many other ways for Bards - and other classes - to gain spell points. Keep an eye on the skill trees for spell-point generating skills. NB that a paladin with Chant (Cleric tree) and a War Horn will give the whole party spell points every turn, and the Jester's Cap grants a Bard spell points every time she/he takes damage. That's just two of many spell-point generating mechanics. Finding these skills and gear and getting them working in concert optimally can be extremely powerful.

The static/limited resources in Bard's Tale IV puts people off at first, but don't forget that combat encounters are also static/planned, and the amount of resource in the game is (generously) balanced against the number of possible combat encounters.

My last Normal-difficulty playthrough, I think I had about 200 bottles of Trow Squeezin's left at the end of the game, and enough components to make hundreds and hundreds more. There are likely more than enough in the game to have *2* Bards, and drinking literally every round of every encounter. I'd say make a Bard, dive in, and bottom's up!

[Hody]

Is the cleric chant not useless with a scensor, the war horn is for something else?!

[Chilkoot]

Originally posted by Hody:

Is the cleric chant not useless with a scensor, the war horn is for something else?!

I think the Cleric chant is bugged as you can use the skill without needing a censer, so it's great with a war horn if you're trying to keep a couple of mages topped up. Note that mages under the effect of the censer cannot meditate or summon, so there are trade-offs.

[Hody]

Originally posted by Chilkoot:

Originally posted by Hody:

Is the cleric chant not useless with a scensor, the war horn is for something else?!

I think the Cleric chant is bugged as you can use the skill without needing a censer, so it's great with a war horn if you're trying to keep a couple of mages topped up. Note that mages under the effect of the censer cannot meditate or summon, so there are trade-offs.

But why will a warhorn give spellpoints? Because you first click sconsor and than warhorn? So it would be like if everyone has a scensor?

[Chilkoot]

You don't need to have the censor equipped to use chant. So in round 1, for example, you can have your Paladin use Chant, then in round 2, have him/her use War Horn to spread the chant to all nearby party members. It's absolutely amazing in long fights like the 99-wave Baron Harkyn encounter.

[CelestialSlayer]

I have two bards in my current playthrough (playing on gamepass) - I have never run out of booze. I usually have one - the main chacter melody - focus either on the fire defence against melee or the air defence against ranged, and then i dont need her to use booze anymore. She used to heal, but when i got the other one I stopped her healing and the other one does the healing. The other one does healing and the occasional group damage or shrink for the really tough opponents. She might use a bottle or two or even a elven one when things get tough. The both have a perk now where if they get the final blow on an opponent they get a spell point, and Melody starts with one at the beginning of combat. My party setup is two bards (using two different builds and weapons), figher (two handed and now can hold a shield too), rogue, and two spellcasters (one of which is a cleric, but i have only just started specing into it, and the other also uses daggers). Bards are really essential at protecting, tanking, and buffing and debuffing the enemies. Get crafting and smash all the crates and you should never run out of booze. You will get good at realising when you need to drink and when you can get by without, but dont worry yourself to much. This is one of the best games i have played, and i still havent finished it.

[svdp]

Originally posted by CelestialSlayer:

I have two bards in my current playthrough (playing on gamepass) - I have never run out of booze. I usually have one - the main chacter melody - focus either on the fire defence against melee or the air defence against ranged, and then i dont need her to use booze anymore. She used to heal, but when i got the other one I stopped her healing and the other one does the healing. The other one does healing and the occasional group damage or shrink for the really tough opponents. She might use a bottle or two or even a elven one when things get tough. The both have a perk now where if they get the final blow on an opponent they get a spell point, and Melody starts with one at the beginning of combat. My party setup is two bards (using two different builds and weapons), figher (two handed and now can hold a shield too), rogue, and two spellcasters (one of which is a cleric, but i have only just started specing into it, and the other also uses daggers). Bards are really essential at protecting, tanking, and buffing and debuffing the enemies. Get crafting and smash all the crates and you should never run out of booze. You will get good at realising when you need to drink and when you can get by without, but dont worry yourself to much. This is one of the best games i have played, and i still havent finished it.

I... have to dispute this statement a bit, though. I had two bards as well. Granted, I've really been liberal with drinking booze on a massive scale on my second playthrough, and I might not have found/searched for every last drop of booze or ingredient for booze, but I'm pretty sure I did for 90+%... and yes, I ran out of booze, on the DC/Haernhold.

Of course, if you're more conservative, you might get through it without a booze-shortage, so I'm not saying you're wrong in every situation. Only that it's quite possible to fall without booze in the DC, if you take a liberal approach on "boozing" with two bards.

[Cursed Life]

Not for me, having to drink every turn to get spell points seems a terrible mechanic

[Chilkoot]

Originally posted by Charmed Life:

Not for me, having to drink every turn to get spell points seems a terrible mechanic

It's supposed to be a strategic decision, forcing you to balance between gaining spell points vs. getting *too* drunk, while walking the line to get just drunk *enough* to proc your special abilities (and of course managing consumables).

I think the "just drunk enough" abilities could have been implemented better, to make this more engaging. It's a trickle-down problem from the decision to force the 4-slot masteries.

[Cursed Life]

The problem is my bard doesnt have spell points to lauch spells, and the bard hasnt any spell gain mechanic other than cosumables

[svdp]

Originally posted by Charmed Life:

The problem is my bard doesnt have spell points to lauch spells, and the bard hasnt any spell gain mechanic other than cosumables

Well, every character/profession has his own thing, I sort of like the variation in one's party.

I have heard others complain about finite consumables (to get buffs/etc.) and finite enemies (no eternal grinding thus), but... that's just the way the game is conceived. You either like it, or you don't, but it is what it is, and it was meant to be like this. Yes, it deviates from a plethora of other RPG's (especially ARPG's) where you have no qualms in doing whatever for as long as you want, since stuffing yourself and grinding is endless. For a MMRPG I can understand this POV - you can't provide finite consumables and enemies for millions of players, after all - , but there is no reason why *all* RPG's should have it. In a sense, it's quite unrealistic, and often game-breaking unless you put a hard cap on it, and also.... it's often tedious (imho).

I actually like the concept of NOT having infinite resources; it makes for a far more tactical decision-making.

Yes, sometimes, if you gauged it wrongly, you get in trouble with it, like me in the DC for the Haernhold dungeon: with two bards having royally drunk loads of booze on every opportunity, I fell out of booze.. but that was mainly my own fault for not optimizing for it - and for having passed the point of no return when I entered that dungeon, so searching (or replenishing the ingredients) for it wasn't possible anymore.

With one bard, or even with two if you optimize for it and make loads of booze with ingredients you find before "the point of no return", you'll never end up without enough booze. I've even heard of playthroughs with 6 bards, and they succeeded as well (though I guess you'll need to be very tactical about drinking booze, then).

[Chilkoot]

Originally posted by Charmed Life:

the bard hasnt any spell gain mechanic other than cosumables

.... that you have found ;)

[Cursed Life]

Whatever, is still worhty to carry a bard around for the extra opportunity point