Please change the facial expression of Tav while kissing ascended Astarion

[Sacred Korok]

It doesn't make sense for Tav to be scared or angry during the kiss animations because they CHOSE to ascend him and KNEW what was coming when THEY ASKED to turn them into a spawn (or more accurately a vampire bride because of the way he turned Tav).

To me it just seems that the people from Larian don't know what route to go with ascended Astarion. In one moment he is really sweet and caring (which makes sense cuz a vampire Lords purpose after creating a bride is to make them happy, cuz they have this special psychic emotional connection. Happy wife, happy life so to speak). And then during the kiss animations she is just terrified out of nowhere and it wouldn't make sense cuz then the bride would obviously be unhappy.

I have seen a lot of people on Youtube being upset about this change. Not the kiss animations themselves, they are great and really fit with his dominant behaviour that he gained from the ritual. But the facial expressions for Tav just don't fit.

In some dialogue for origin Karlach during the epilogue he even says that he let her go because he isn't a monster like Cazador and that he will wait for her when she finds a way to return so they can spend their life together. This is when she went to the hells.

Everything about ascended Astarion just seems so inconsistent from Larian and it is really frustrating. Like they really want you to go the spawn route. I like his spawn version too but imo the ascension route just is how any Vampire is. Plus it's fantasy, not real life. Let us have the Dark Vampire Lord and consort fantasy without all this bias please TvT

[アンジェル]

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

Please change the facial expression of Tav while kissing ascended Astarion
It doesn't make sense for Tav to be scared or angry during the kiss animations because they CHOSE to ascend him and KNEW what was coming when THEY ASKED to turn them into a spawn (or more accurately a vampire bride because of the way he turned Tav).

To me it just seems that the people from Larian don't know what route to go with ascended Astarion. In one moment he is really sweet and caring (which makes sense cuz a vampire Lords purpose after creating a bride is to make them happy, cuz they have this special psychic emotional connection. Happy wife, happy life so to speak). And then during the kiss animations she is just terrified out of nowhere and it wouldn't make sense cuz then the bride would obviously be unhappy.

I have seen a lot of people on Youtube being upset about this change. Not the kiss animations themselves, they are great and really fit with his dominant behaviour that he gained from the ritual. But the facial expressions for Tav just don't fit.

In some dialogue for origin Karlach during the epilogue he even says that he let her go because he isn't a monster like Cazador and that he will wait for her when she finds a way to return so they can spend their life together. This is when she went to the hells.

Everything about ascended Astarion just seems so inconsistent from Larian and it is really frustrating. Like they really want you to go the spawn route. I like his spawn version too but imo the ascension route just is how any Vampire is. Plus it's fantasy, not real life. Let us have the Dark Vampire Lord and consort fantasy without all this bias please TvT

Do not forget ~ If you wish your feedback to reach Larian Studios it is best to contact them directly.

via email [e-mail]

or

via online form https://larian.com/support/baldur-s-gate-3#modal <-- select feedback

with the online form your feedback gets also properly tracked by the staff. They might not come back to you, but you can be sure it is on their screen.

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by アンジェル:

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

Please change the facial expression of Tav while kissing ascended Astarion
It doesn't make sense for Tav to be scared or angry during the kiss animations because they CHOSE to ascend him and KNEW what was coming when THEY ASKED to turn them into a spawn (or more accurately a vampire bride because of the way he turned Tav).

To me it just seems that the people from Larian don't know what route to go with ascended Astarion. In one moment he is really sweet and caring (which makes sense cuz a vampire Lords purpose after creating a bride is to make them happy, cuz they have this special psychic emotional connection. Happy wife, happy life so to speak). And then during the kiss animations she is just terrified out of nowhere and it wouldn't make sense cuz then the bride would obviously be unhappy.

I have seen a lot of people on Youtube being upset about this change. Not the kiss animations themselves, they are great and really fit with his dominant behaviour that he gained from the ritual. But the facial expressions for Tav just don't fit.

In some dialogue for origin Karlach during the epilogue he even says that he let her go because he isn't a monster like Cazador and that he will wait for her when she finds a way to return so they can spend their life together. This is when she went to the hells.

Everything about ascended Astarion just seems so inconsistent from Larian and it is really frustrating. Like they really want you to go the spawn route. I like his spawn version too but imo the ascension route just is how any Vampire is. Plus it's fantasy, not real life. Let us have the Dark Vampire Lord and consort fantasy without all this bias please TvT

Do not forget ~ If you wish your feedback to reach Larian Studios it is best to contact them directly.

via email [e-mail]

or

via online form https://larian.com/support/baldur-s-gate-3#modal <-- select feedback

with the online form your feedback gets also properly tracked by the staff. They might not come back to you, but you can be sure it is on their screen. :spacehamster:

yeah will do. thx for providing the link!

[kiramira99]

The game is unplayable for me after the kiss patch. I didn't think new kisses could make me feel so utterly heartbroken. I really liked the dark romance going on with ascended Astarion, the Act 3 romance scene is the best I have seen in a game. And roleplaying as a evil power couple (where Astarion is in charge of course) felt amazing, now with the new kisses and Tavs expression it feels horrible. Like I'm an invisible force forcing Tav through this, like she is seperate from my imagined character.
I also think the kneel kiss should be reserved for the epilog at the Elfsong, it just feels wrong kneeling in front of the Bhaal murder tribunal or in the streets of Baldurs gate.

[arikel.pv]

Originally posted by kiramira99:

The game is unplayable for me after the kiss patch. I didn't think new kisses could make me feel so utterly heartbroken. I really liked the dark romance going on with ascended Astarion, the Act 3 romance scene is the best I have seen in a game. And roleplaying as a evil power couple (where Astarion is in charge of course) felt amazing, now with the new kisses and Tavs expression it feels horrible. Like I'm an invisible force forcing Tav through this, like she is seperate from my imagined character.
I also think the kneel kiss should be reserved for the epilog at the Elfsong, it just feels wrong kneeling in front of the Bhaal murder tribunal or in the streets of Baldurs gate.

But why, this behavior perfectly fits his new self - and Tav's ruined expectations, too. When AStarion seduces him/her into becoming a spawn, he would promise everything just to make this person stay beside him. Now that he/she is under his overwhelming influence, he can do whatever he likes. Humiliating included. While Tav hasn't much to complaint: he/she got just what asked for.
Me, I really like the 'bipolar disorder' gleam of these kisses, when Astarion first shows his cruelty, then sweetens the pill, saying smth like 'You're perfect, every time'.

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by kiramira99:

The game is unplayable for me after the kiss patch. I didn't think new kisses could make me feel so utterly heartbroken. I really liked the dark romance going on with ascended Astarion, the Act 3 romance scene is the best I have seen in a game. And roleplaying as a evil power couple (where Astarion is in charge of course) felt amazing, now with the new kisses and Tavs expression it feels horrible. Like I'm an invisible force forcing Tav through this, like she is seperate from my imagined character.
I also think the kneel kiss should be reserved for the epilog at the Elfsong, it just feels wrong kneeling in front of the Bhaal murder tribunal or in the streets of Baldurs gate.

there is a post going on on youtube where you can fill out a google document that will go directly to larian (like a kind of petition) where you can say how you feel about the new animations for spawn and ascended astarion. you can say what you dont like and what they can improve in the future! its really good, i already filled it out, the questions and options are really good!

you can find it on "Resonating Lo", "Nirraart" and "Kate Kotova"s channels!

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by arikel.pv:

Originally posted by kiramira99:

The game is unplayable for me after the kiss patch. I didn't think new kisses could make me feel so utterly heartbroken. I really liked the dark romance going on with ascended Astarion, the Act 3 romance scene is the best I have seen in a game. And roleplaying as a evil power couple (where Astarion is in charge of course) felt amazing, now with the new kisses and Tavs expression it feels horrible. Like I'm an invisible force forcing Tav through this, like she is seperate from my imagined character.
I also think the kneel kiss should be reserved for the epilog at the Elfsong, it just feels wrong kneeling in front of the Bhaal murder tribunal or in the streets of Baldurs gate.

But why, this behavior perfectly fits his new self - and Tav's ruined expectations, too. When AStarion seduces him/her into becoming a spawn, he would promise everything just to make this person stay beside him. Now that he/she is under his overwhelming influence, he can do whatever he likes. Humiliating included. While Tav hasn't much to complaint: he/she got just what asked for.
Me, I really like the 'bipolar disorder' gleam of these kisses, when Astarion first shows his cruelty, then sweetens the pill, saying smth like 'You're perfect, every time'.

his dominant behaviour fits, yes. but it doesnt make sense for tav to look so distressed cuz of the reasons i mentioned. they are his bride! they have to be happy or at least consent with what he does or theyll literally damage him cuz they share an emotional bond. larian keeps tripping over their own way of story telling with his character cuz theyre so inconsistent for some reason, its no fun!

the players should have the option to choose between softer and hard dom behaviour, so they can identify with it or at least roleplay with it. for example if you choose the "be gentle... if you can" dialogue option he should remember that tav likes it more tame in order to live out that dom fantasy with them, so they both are happy in the end. or if they say "come on, make it hurt" then we would see the animations we do now, but also with tavs changed expressions (they really should be into it cuz they again CHOSE this).

[arikel.pv]

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

his dominant behaviour fits, yes. but it doesnt make sense for tav to look so distressed cuz of the reasons i mentioned. they are his bride! they have to be happy or at least consent with what he does or theyll literally damage him cuz they share an emotional bond. larian keeps tripping over their own way of story telling with his character cuz theyre so inconsistent for some reason, its no fun!

the players should have the option to choose between softer and hard dom behaviour, so they can identify with it or at least roleplay with it. for example if you choose the "be gentle... if you can" dialogue option he should remember that tav likes it more tame in order to live out that dom fantasy with them, so they both are happy in the end. or if they say "come on, make it hurt" then we would see the animations we do now, but also with tavs changed expressions (they really should be into it cuz they again CHOSE this).

If you succeed the Wisdom check in that very scene, you'll learn that life.. sorry, unlife alongside Astarion as his spawn just suggests the humiliation, a priori. I don't see any inconsistency about him behaving like a tyrant and sadist. The point is that perhaps at the moment of becoming a spawn Tav just didn't see all depths of the pit he/she is jumping into. After that, he/she does, but it's too late

[kiramira99]

Originally posted by arikel.pv:

If you succeed the Wisdom check in that very scene, you'll learn that life.. sorry, unlife alongside Astarion as his spawn just suggests the humiliation, a priori. I don't see any inconsistency about him behaving like a tyrant and sadist. The point is that perhaps at the moment of becoming a spawn Tav just didn't see all depths of the pit he/she is jumping into. After that, he/she does, but it's too late

No. It suggests that if Tav goes through with turning into a spawn she is happy with and consents to Astarion degrading her and Astarion respects it. THAT is the freaking problem with all this, Tav consents she is in this willingly, no regrets. Astartion respecting the decision and still respecting Tav.
Putting those faces on Tav is so out of character for my playthrough and having Astarion do that to Tav WHEN Tav looks like that is out of character for him.
That you have your Tav in a victim position is YOUR playthrough, mine is not like that at all and it breaks the whole romance.

[kiramira99]

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

there is a post going on on youtube where you can fill out a google document that will go directly to larian (like a kind of petition) where you can say how you feel about the new animations for spawn and ascended astarion. you can say what you dont like and what they can improve in the future! its really good, i already filled it out, the questions and options are really good!

you can find it on "Resonating Lo", "Nirraart" and "Kate Kotova"s channels!

Thank you for the tip, I did fill out a Google form that was linked in Larian forums it might be the very same.
I really hope they do somehing about the faces so everyone can enjoy their Ascended Astarion romance and not just those looking for a victim/abuser trope.

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by kiramira99:

Originally posted by arikel.pv:

If you succeed the Wisdom check in that very scene, you'll learn that life.. sorry, unlife alongside Astarion as his spawn just suggests the humiliation, a priori. I don't see any inconsistency about him behaving like a tyrant and sadist. The point is that perhaps at the moment of becoming a spawn Tav just didn't see all depths of the pit he/she is jumping into. After that, he/she does, but it's too late

No. It suggests that if Tav goes through with turning into a spawn she is happy with and consents to Astarion degrading her and Astarion respects it. THAT is the freaking problem with all this, Tav consents she is in this willingly, no regrets. Astartion respecting the decision and still respecting Tav.
Putting those faces on Tav is so out of character for my playthrough and having Astarion do that to Tav WHEN Tav looks like that is out of character for him.
That you have your Tav in a victim position is YOUR playthrough, mine is not like that at all and it breaks the whole romance.

THIS

Larian just basically took away that our choices matter, THAT is the big problem! They want to force their opinion on us by saying that he is abusive and toxic. It is not that we don't see it! It isn't a super healthy relationship like with Gale or Wyll. But our Tav consents and should therefore be happy with that choice! So yes, the facial expressions dont make sense at all for Tav! And then in the end cutscene and the epilogue, they both go away hand in hand as if nothing ever happened. Like WHAT? Why this sudden change?

I really hope Larian sees the petition. Every single Astarion dedicated channel out there is posting it and letting people decide what Larian should change in the future.

We are here to have a fun time with a video game and not having some company make the decisions for us and lecture us about what a toxic relationship looks like! we are not stupid. Seeing my Tav with a distressed facial expression is really disturbing cuz she would defenitely be into this kinda stuff, but wouldve consent to it. Now it looks like she doesn't even want this. It isn't a roleplaying game anymore, if we can't roleplay.

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by kiramira99:

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

there is a post going on on youtube where you can fill out a google document that will go directly to larian (like a kind of petition) where you can say how you feel about the new animations for spawn and ascended astarion. you can say what you dont like and what they can improve in the future! its really good, i already filled it out, the questions and options are really good!

you can find it on "Resonating Lo", "Nirraart" and "Kate Kotova"s channels!

Thank you for the tip, I did fill out a Google form that was linked in Larian forums it might be the very same.
I really hope they do somehing about the faces so everyone can enjoy their Ascended Astarion romance and not just those looking for a victim/abuser trope.

yeah same! I've read on nexusmods that a new big hotfix is coming soon, maybe theyll fix it quicker than we thought

[Sacred Korok]

Originally posted by arikel.pv:

Originally posted by Sacred Korok:

his dominant behaviour fits, yes. but it doesnt make sense for tav to look so distressed cuz of the reasons i mentioned. they are his bride! they have to be happy or at least consent with what he does or theyll literally damage him cuz they share an emotional bond. larian keeps tripping over their own way of story telling with his character cuz theyre so inconsistent for some reason, its no fun!

the players should have the option to choose between softer and hard dom behaviour, so they can identify with it or at least roleplay with it. for example if you choose the "be gentle... if you can" dialogue option he should remember that tav likes it more tame in order to live out that dom fantasy with them, so they both are happy in the end. or if they say "come on, make it hurt" then we would see the animations we do now, but also with tavs changed expressions (they really should be into it cuz they again CHOSE this).

If you succeed the Wisdom check in that very scene, you'll learn that life.. sorry, unlife alongside Astarion as his spawn just suggests the humiliation, a priori. I don't see any inconsistency about him behaving like a tyrant and sadist. The point is that perhaps at the moment of becoming a spawn Tav just didn't see all depths of the pit he/she is jumping into. After that, he/she does, but it's too late

Larian just basically took away that our choices matter, THAT is the big problem! They want to force their opinion on us by saying that he is abusive and toxic. It is not that we don't see it! It isn't a super healthy relationship like with Gale or Wyll. But our Tav consents and should therefore be happy with that choice! So yes, the facial expressions dont make sense at all for Tav! And then in the end cutscene and the epilogue, they both go away hand in hand as if nothing ever happened. Like WHAT? Why this sudden change?

I really hope Larian sees the petition. Every single Astarion dedicated channel out there is posting it and letting people decide what Larian should change in the future.

We are here to have a fun time with a video game and not having some company make the decisions for us and lecture us about what a toxic relationship looks like! we are not stupid. Seeing my Tav with a distressed facial expression is really disturbing cuz she would defenitely be into this kinda stuff, but wouldve consent to it. Now it looks like she doesn't even want this. It isn't a roleplaying game anymore, if we can't roleplay.

[God Queen 158]

He is now an ascended vampire with FULL control over you. Play time is over. The narratives Larian is playing with are far darker than you think. Every insight check on Ascended!Astarion will tell you this. Ascending is giving up your soul.

This isn't some "teehee, I'll get on my knees, for you, daddy" bs. He's asserting his control. It will and should shock Tav. This sort of dynamic involves asserting dominance, which is not fun or nice. Don't ask what he would do if Tav did smile.

Don't let weak men get power over you. Or else (as illustrated in his own arc) you'll become victim to some other pretty boy peddling sweet lies.

[arikel.pv]

And then in the end cutscene and the epilogue, they both go away hand in hand as if nothing ever happened. Like WHAT? Why this sudden change?

This doesn't seem out of accord with Ascended Astarion concept even for a bit. If Tav speaks with him in the very morning after becomes his spawn (and go through EVERY line), you'll get the perfect explanation about how does he feel about having him/her alongside. First 'I want to keep you all to myself', then 'You won't dream of going astray too far?' and 'You're going to be wonderfully obedient'.
Same in the epilogue. If Tav listens to Astarion spellbound, he will be nice and tender, but even then he warns him/her, 'I'm always watching' with such a mean face that makes you wince. And if Tav tries to object his opinion just a little bit, he outrages smth like 'I gave you everything, and you're trying to rebel, you ungrateful s**t'
And lastly. If Tav comes with Astarion the Ascendant to 'Sharess Caress' and hires both drow twins, you'll see first that he allows everyone other to satisfy him (as opposed to non-Ascendant who gives pleasures to all), and afterwards Tav 'looks into his eyes and sees no trace of joy, only intensity that makes him/her shiver'.
So even if Tav did agree to become a spawn, he/she indeed might not be satisfied with the way Astarion treats her afterwards. He really changes thoroughly, and feels no remorse in behaving like that.

[kiramira99]

Originally posted by God Queen 158:

He is now an ascended vampire with FULL control over you. Play time is over. The narratives Larian is playing with are far darker than you think. Every insight check on Ascended!Astarion will tell you this. Ascending is giving up your soul.

This isn't some "teehee, I'll get on my knees, for you, daddy" bs. He's asserting his control. It will and should shock Tav. This sort of dynamic involves asserting dominance, which is not fun or nice. Don't ask what he would do if Tav did smile.

Don't let weak men get power over you. Or else (as illustrated in his own arc) you'll become victim to some other pretty boy peddling sweet lies.

You clearly do not want to see that anybody can play the game any other way than how you percieve things. Again it is about consent and respect. There can be care in such a dynamic if it has those things. Astarion would stop when he sees those new faces on Tav because he still care for and respect Tav.
If you don't get it, fine, but don't berate me or anybody else for wanting a dark romance without having our Tavs become victims. Play how you want to play with your romance, let me have mine.